Calais

[Tyrone Biggums]

Things have been on the decline a for a while in this regard.

haha irony perhaps that with the rise of the left in Australia the standard of living has declined?

 

[BadFish]

haha irony perhaps that with the rise of the left in Australia the standard of living has declined?

So you agree, it has declined? People often tell me about the 80's with misty eyed nostagia. Obviously I wasn't here then but I am told it has declined since.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

So you agree, it has declined? People often tell me about the 80's with misty eyed nostagia. Obviously I wasn't here then but I am told it has declined since.

Only in the sense of divisiveness and hate politics on the rise with the rise of the left.

Personal freedoms have diminished and the nanny state has taken over. The once great institution of the local community has eroded.

Ironically that decline coincides with the arrival of the Greens and all their hatefilled minions.

 

[BadFish]

Only in the sense of divisiveness and hate politics on the rise with the rise of the left.

Personal freedoms have diminished and the nanny state has taken over. The once great institution of the local community has eroded.

Ironically that decline coincides with the arrival of the Greens and all their hatefilled minions.

Sounds like you really hate the left

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Sounds like you really hate the left

I do. They are totalitarian wolves in sheeps clothing.

 

[BadFish]

I do. They are totalitarian wolves in sheeps clothing.

Labor or the greens?

This place was a nanny state when I arrived during the Howard Government.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Labor or the greens?

This place was a nanny state when I arrived during the Howard Government.

And you said its gotten worse...

The majority of the years after Howard we had Labor/Greens coalition ruling over us. So there in lies the irony.

 

[BadFish]

And you said its gotten worse...

The majority of the years after Howard we had Labor/Greens coalition ruling over us. So there in lies the irony.

What irony?

yet the golden years that every one harks back to were presided over by two labour governments weren't they? Hawk and Keating?

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

What irony?

yet the golden years that every one harks back to were presided over by two labour governments weren't they? Hawk and Keating?

Hawke was ok. Keating ushered in the downfall. He introuced us all to condescending, narcissistic politics. He told us all we needed to suffer under a recession. He's the reason why Howard ruled for an almost record time.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I just can't see how the current situation is preferable to processing their applications and sorting out the ones who need genuine help from the economic migrants and terrorists and dealing with them appropriately.

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T ****1NG APPLYING FOR ASYLUM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How can we 'process' people who aren't applying for asylum and are instead trying to enter our country ( rather than YOUR country ) illegally ?

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T ****1NG APPLYING FOR ASYLUM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How can we 'process' people who aren't applying for asylum and are instead trying to enter our country ( rather than YOUR country ) illegally ?

Blokes a bellend spouting shit from an ex British colony
regards
DR

 

[pastafarian]

I base my opinions on the information I find (big difference). I have been asking and asking for evidence about the people in Calais and so far all this thread has provided is assumptions, anecdotal evidence and made up statistics.

This thread has provided you with facts and figures and peoples personal experience of what is going on in Calais.If you wish to dismiss these go ahead.

More importantly your solution to the problem is to let these people in and process them(as to their asylum status),this country has no obligation to do this. This is a requirement of the French authorities whose land these people have built an illegal "refugee" camp on.
Why on earth should the British taxpayer be burdened with the extra costs of processing,housing,feeding and financially supporting 1000`s of asylum seekers who are the responsibility of France
Its quite telling you are a bit of a lone voice on this thread......perhaps most people realise despite the wider debate about immigration and opposing views, in this instance the French are simply failing in their responsibilities

 

[Hastings gull]

Be careful not to dismiss information because it disagrees with your viewpoint HS. Or dismiss someone as lecturing just because you disagree with them.

I think this is the confusion from our previous discussion you alluded to earlier. You asked for a statistic and then didn't like it so started moving the goal posts and messing about with definitions. A person does not cease to be an immigrant when they become a resident.

Immigrant is defined as: A person who comes to live permanently in a foreign country:
A citizen (in this context) is defined as: A legally recognised subject or national of a state or commonwealth, either native or naturalised.

These two things are not mutually exclusive and I for example am both.

You could not be more mistaken, though at fault here is the fact that we rely simply on the written word. I referred to your claim of 1.5% to demonstrate that for all your quoting of wonderful stats, you could not even tell me how many immigrants live locally. Another post gave a different figure and I accepted that, saying that it boils down to a question of definition. I have NOT attempted to change any goalposts and do not quibble with what you write in this instance. I have never said or even attempted to say that the two definitions are mutually exclusive. A strop really is unnecessary here.

 

[looney]

You don't witness the sheer scales of the situation any more than I do. For that you would need to be in Pakistan, Jordan or Turkey. Stop being so melodramatic. Your posts clearly demonstrate a lack of understanding of the global scope of this problem.

I base my opinions on the information I find (big difference). I have been asking and asking for evidence about the people in Calais and so far all this thread has provided is assumptions, anecdotal evidence and made up statistics.

This is up to your usual standard of intellectual dishonesty. He is talking about the scale of the problem into the UK, which is what the thread is about, which is what you started about. so you decided to move the goal posts to try to avoid the point.

 

[carlzeiss]

Alleged asylum seekers having a tough time in the UK , should have stayed in France :-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-cooked-meals-35-cash-week-days-arrival.html

 

[Hastings gull]

All good mate, I will leave you to your fear and paranoia.

Of course the problems that you refer to are bad in Jordan Turkey etc -no one denies that. But what you cannot appreciate from where you are is that the scale here is akin to other countries in the world, though obviously Britain is a better position, economically, to assist. Much has changed since the time you left, and you have to appreciate that. Pompously saying that you are leaving us to our fear and paranoia reflects very badly on you. Kent CC. Bearstead, Operation Stack, A20, Kent Social Services, RHA -you will know little of this but that never stops the lecturing, and understandably folk here become very tired of it, particularly when the lecturing is accompanied by foolish idealism such as assuming that immigrants will voluntarily state that they are economic migrants rather than asylum seekers, and that one EU country should dictate what others should do. All sections of society here have expressed disquiet at what is happening and for you to suggest and/or dismiss this as right-wing paranoia is the height of arrogance. You love your studies and stats, if they are convenient, of course, and want stats - the numbers that come to this country are well publicised, and people here are thoroughly alarmed at what is going on.

 

[Hastings gull]

Anyway I am happy to bow out of this discussion as i seem to be upsetting people with my crazy views from afar. I will leave you with these crazy views from UK (Which are obviously more credible even though they are remarkebly similar to mine. Why? because they are based on research rather than fear )

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...y-making-calais-migrant-crisis-more-difficult

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/07/31/calais-migrants-crisis-myths-facts_n_7910350.html

Bad Fish says that he goes by information that he finds -I think the vast majority here can go by something rather more accurate, namely by what we SEE. I did him the courtesy of looking at the Huffington Post, which he clearly regards as an accurate portrayal of the situation. Read 1 and 2 carefully - the 120 extra riot police have only been very recently brought in after pressure from the Brits. Then there is the vague mention of 18,000 arrests -significantly with no further comment. 2 talks of "applications" for asylum - not if they were granted. And fails to mention any other category, but attempts to give the impression that the French are doing far more than the Brits. It might be the case, but certainly not on that limited information alone. Then there are the extreme sweeping statements whereby individual comments have been lumped together for effect and consequently "disproved".
No wonder he comes up with what he does. He often asks for stats -by chance I found one today -and no, not in the DM - Bedfordshire Police report a seven-fold year-on-year increase in the number of illegal immigrants caught.

 

[Publius Ovidius]

From over the border, is it a bigger problem in this massive country than potential terrorists coming across our borders........i think not.

Aaaah..so there is the nub of your argument...they are all terrorists over in Calais! Do you not think that terrorist organisations that have billions of dollars stashed away would fly their people in on false passports and documents, rather that take it as chance that they might get over without falling off the back of an axle and getting crushed.

My company has an office in Houston and the amount of illegals in that city numbers around 500k at a conservative estimate. Our 3k odd is a mere splash in the ocean even if you think that Italy and Greece are taking thousands and Syria alone has had 2 million people move to neighbouring countries to avoid being killed.

There is no simple answer to this. I still think a good step would be open a border processing offices in Calais to process these people...if they can be proved to be genuine refugees, let them over in a controlled way, if not , they must be dispursed through Europe. Trouble is the rest of Europe, especially the eastern bloc countries do not want any of them, so it's left to the western countries and Scandinavians to resettle this huge migration of people.

I wonder when the first Homo sapiens walked from Ethiopia to the north and east were met by the first Chinese and Asian developing humans were met with..." **** off we are full...all you want is our handouts you scrounges". "All they want to do is murder us and eat us"

 

[BadFish]

Of course the problems that you refer to are bad in Jordan Turkey etc -no one denies that. But what you cannot appreciate from where you are is that the scale here is akin to other countries in the world, though obviously Britain is a better position, economically, to assist. Much has changed since the time you left, and you have to appreciate that. Pompously saying that you are leaving us to our fear and paranoia reflects very badly on you. Kent CC. Bearstead, Operation Stack, A20, Kent Social Services, RHA -you will know little of this but that never stops the lecturing, and understandably folk here become very tired of it, particularly when the lecturing is accompanied by foolish idealism such as assuming that immigrants will voluntarily state that they are economic migrants rather than asylum seekers, and that one EU country should dictate what others should do. All sections of society here have expressed disquiet at what is happening and for you to suggest and/or dismiss this as right-wing paranoia is the height of arrogance. You love your studies and stats, if they are convenient, of course, and want stats - the numbers that come to this country are well publicised, and people here are thoroughly alarmed at what is going on.

As a summary of my posts on this thread this is dreadful.

 

[BadFish]

Bad Fish says that he goes by information that he finds -I think the vast majority here can go by something rather more accurate, namely by what we SEE. I did him the courtesy of looking at the Huffington Post, which he clearly regards as an accurate portrayal of the situation. Read 1 and 2 carefully - the 120 extra riot police have only been very recently brought in after pressure from the Brits. Then there is the vague mention of 18,000 arrests -significantly with no further comment. 2 talks of "applications" for asylum - not if they were granted. And fails to mention any other category, but attempts to give the impression that the French are doing far more than the Brits. It might be the case, but certainly not on that limited information alone. Then there are the extreme sweeping statements whereby individual comments have been lumped together for effect and consequently "disproved".
No wonder he comes up with what he does. He often asks for stats -by chance I found one today -and no, not in the DM - Bedfordshire Police report a seven-fold year-on-year increase in the number of illegal immigrants caught.

Who are you talking to?

I am still waiting for those illusive stats that show how many of the people at Calais are Asylum Seekers and how many are illegal immigrants (and how many are terrorists for Soulman). 10 pages and still no body can provide any! Yet so many people what to base an action on the assumption that they are wrong uns.

Or should i just accept that you can SEE this information from Hastings?