Illuminati Olympics

[dingodan]

OK but I'll ask my question again...what is your point on post #37?

I suggested that the 1950's - 1970's MI5 Crest contained hidden (occult) symbolism, in this case the Eye of Horus at the apex of a pyramid shape.

You responded by pointing out that the current MI5 crest is different.

Post #37 was to point out that the contemporary MI5 crest also contains hidden (occult) symbolism, in this case the symbol of the rose.

Hope that helps.

 

[One Love]

on slow phone so cant post links but theres no point - most of the symbolism is esoteric, a word lost on too many here. to understand esoteric symbols takes time - only the inner self can do it - and then match these up to patterns and events pfff not on here ... Lets just see what happens in the first two weeks of august. Maybe taking special note of any days israeli competitors are not at the stadium.

Can you promise to come on here after the two weeks of August and explain yourself.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

I suggested that the 1950's - 1970's MI5 Crest contained hidden (occult) symbolism, in this case the Eye of Horus at the apex of a pyramid shape.

You responded by pointing out that the current MI5 crest is different.

Post #37 was to point out that the contemporary MI5 crest also contains hidden (occult) symbolism, in this case the symbol of the rose.

Hope that helps.

No it doesn't, the I on the old logo symbolises the I in MI5. The rose symbolises secrecy. Neither are hidden; they are in plain sight. Its a bit like saying the I in BMI is a nod to the occult and that the rose on the RFU means the same as the MI5 logo.

So what is the point of pointing this out? Isnt it just finding symbols in logos that you want to find symbolism in and not all those that have them?

 

[dingodan]

No it doesn't, the I on the old logo symbolises the I in MI5. The rose symbolises secrecy. Neither are hidden; they are in plain sight. Its a bit like saying the I in BMI is a nod to the occult and that the rose on the RFU means the same as the MI5 logo.

So what is the point of pointing this out? Isnt it just finding symbols in logos that you want to find symbolism in and not all those that have them?

There is the letter "I" and under the letter "I" is an image of an eye.

If you asked MI5 why there were roses on their crest, I am pretty sure they would tell you it is the Tudor rose, a symbol of England.

The "secrecy" meaning of the rose is not readily identifiable by looking at a rose. The purpose of symbolism like this is to say something, while appearing not to be saying anything. In this sense the meaning is hidden, and the symbol can be considered "occult" (by its true definition).

This is my interpretation, I am sure you don't agree. No problem.

 

[Dr Q]

Does this mean eating Diarylea triangles and Toblerone are gonna put you under mind control of the Lizard Overlords?

Come to think of it we cut the pizza into triangles when we were watching the opening bash last night. Sh*t maybe the tinfoil hat brigade have a point!! Run for the hills and dig your command centres (and break out the Buffy the Vampire Slayer w**k mags).

 

[pastafarian]

If you asked MI5 what there were roses on their crest, I am pretty sure they would tell you it is the Tudor rose, a symbol of England.

The "secrecy" meaning of the rose is not readily identifiable by looking at a rose. The purpose of symbolism like this is to say something, while appearing not to say be saying anything. In this sense the meaning is hidden, and the symbol can be considered "occult" (by its true definition).

This is my interpretation, I am sure you don't agree. No problem.

lets ask MI5 shall we. Luckily someone already has and the answer is

"The rose has historical associations with state intelligence work. Sir Francis Walsingham, Queen Elizabeth I's spymaster in the 16th century, used it on his seal. He is widely regarded as the first intelligence chief in British history. The rose's five-lobed petals are another allusion to the "5" in MI5."

but dont take my word for it get it from the horses mouth yourself

https://www.mi5.gov.uk/output/what-does-the-mi5-crest-represent.html

and i really do not get what you are trying to imply by secret hidden meanings in crests.
crests by their very nature must be symbolic of what they are trying to convey,when you say "hidden" what you really mean is i dont understand.

 

[pastafarian]

case closed

 

[looney]

I suggested that the 1950's - 1970's MI5 Crest contained hidden (occult) symbolism, in this case the Eye of Horus at the apex of a pyramid shape.

You responded by pointing out that the current MI5 crest is different.

Post #37 was to point out that the contemporary MI5 crest also contains hidden (occult) symbolism, in this case the symbol of the rose.

Hope that helps.

Thats not the eye of horus though. The eye of horus has 7 lines running from it with specific meanings. thats just an eye.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

There is the letter "I" and under the letter "I" is an image of an eye.

If you asked MI5 what there were roses on their crest, I am pretty sure they would tell you it is the Tudor rose, a symbol of England.

The "secrecy" meaning of the rose is not readily identifiable by looking at a rose. The purpose of symbolism like this is to say something, while appearing not to say be saying anything. In this sense the meaning is hidden, and the symbol can be considered "occult" (by its true definition).

This is my interpretation, I am sure you don't agree. No problem.

No they say its to symbolise its 'historical associations with state intelligence work. Sir Francis Walsingham, Queen Elizabeth I's spymaster in the 16th century, used it on his seal. He is widely regarded as the first intelligence chief in British history'. or you could read it as the rose's association with secrecy.

https://www.mi5.gov.uk/output/what-does-the-mi5-crest-represent.html

This is very similar to the sybolism of this...

The Intelligence Corps cap badge, again they readily admit that it is to represent that their role is secret.

Thus your argument that the "secrecy" meaning of the rose is hidden is incorrect, they readily admit it alludes to their role.

Seperatley the Tudor rose was used to indicate that discussions of a secret nature were ongoing. It was nailed to doors or carved onto panels to show that the contents were secret and not to be discussed; hence the term 'under the rose'. So yes even if MI5 say it is the tudor rose it has no hidden symbolism. sorry just re-read this thread and you point this out yourself so undermining your own argument.

I believe your argument is fundamentally flawed.

 

[Driver8]

Can you promise to come on here after the two weeks of August and explain yourself.

And when wrong never post again.

 

[Frutos]

In Rome a wild rose would be placed on the door of a room where secret matters were discussed. The Latin phrase "Sub rosa" means "under the rose", which means to keep a secret.

Someone's been reading the Da Vinci Code...

 

[dingodan]

lets ask MI5 shall we. Luckily someone already has and the answer is

"The rose has historical associations with state intelligence work. Sir Francis Walsingham, Queen Elizabeth I's spymaster in the 16th century, used it on his seal. He is widely regarded as the first intelligence chief in British history. The rose's five-lobed petals are another allusion to the "5" in MI5."

but dont take my word for it get it from the horses mouth yourself

https://www.mi5.gov.uk/output/what-does-the-mi5-crest-represent.html

and i really do not get what you are trying to imply by secret hidden meanings in crests.
crests by their very nature must be symbolic of what they are trying to convey,when you say "hidden" what you really mean is i dont understand.

Thanks for that link, had not seen that. They only actually explain the rose symbol by saying it has five petals as an "allusion to the "5" in MI5", it has, "associations with state intelligence work", and, "Sir Francis Walsingham...used it on his seal", which isn't really saying a whole lot. Nothing about the term "Sub-rosa" or it's meaning as a symbol of secrecy.

You have a point, in that the meaning of a symbol is only "hidden" if you don't understand it. But most people are not aware of the symbolic meaning of the rose. So it is hidden, from most people.

Be careful though, because I do not claim the rose symbol is particularly nefarious. Only that there are hidden meanings in crests, symbols, logos etc which are not readily identifiable, and would not be recognized or understood by the majority of people.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

Thanks for that link, had not seen that. They only actually explain the rose symbol by saying it has five petals as an "allusion to the "5" in MI5", it has, "associations with state intelligence work", and, "Sir Francis Walsingham...used it on his seal", which isn't really saying a whole lot. Nothing about the term "Sub-rosa" or it's meaning as a symbol of secrecy.

You have a point, in that the meaning of a symbol is only "hidden" if you don't understand it. But most people are not aware of the symbolic meaning of the rose. So it is hidden, from most people.

Be careful though, because I do not claim the rose symbol is particularly nefarious. Only that there are hidden meanings in crests, symbols, logos etc which are not readily identifiable, and would not be recognized or understood by the majority of people.

Just because someone doesn't know the symbology doesn't mean its hidden does it? They are unaware of the meaning not that it is hidden from them.

 

[Frutos]

Just because someone doesn't know the symbology doesn't mean its hidden does it? They are unaware of the meaning not that it is hidden from them.

Exactly.

I don't know the fundamental principles of particle physics. That doesn't mean that they are in any way hidden from me, merely that I am not aware of them.

 

[dingodan]

No they say its to symbolise its 'historical associations with state intelligence work. Sir Francis Walsingham, Queen Elizabeth I's spymaster in the 16th century, used it on his seal. He is widely regarded as the first intelligence chief in British history'. or you could read it as the rose's association with secrecy.

https://www.mi5.gov.uk/output/what-does-the-mi5-crest-represent.html

This is very similar to the sybolism of this...

The Intelligence Corps cap badge, again they readily admit that it is to represent that their role is secret.

Thus your argument that the "secrecy" meaning of the rose is hidden is incorrect, they readily admit it alludes to their role.

Seperatley the Tudor rose was used to indicate that discussions of a secret nature were ongoing. It was nailed to doors or carved onto panels to show that the contents were secret and not to be discussed; hence the term 'under the rose'. So yes even if MI5 say it is the tudor rose it has no hidden symbolism. sorry just re-read this thread and you point this out yourself so undermining your own argument.

I believe your argument is fundamentally flawed.

"Under the Rose" - "Sub Rosa"

Someone has already posted MI5's explanation of the rose. They don't actually mention it's meaning as a symbol of secrecy.

 

[Blackcap]

Because of course if I was running a secret organisation looking to covertly control society, the one thing I'd want to make sure of would be to have my society's logo slapped around all over the place.

 

[Embrace]

Because of course if I was running a secret organisation looking to covertly control society, the one thing I'd want to make sure of would be to have my society's logo slapped around all over the place.

So would I... Subtlety is so last year!

 

[cmonbarrybringonwoody!]

but what about the Blackpool illuminati? There every year yet no one bats an eye lid, unbelievable!!

 

[dingodan]

Wizzbiz the old kids tv show, it was a triangle with eyes, OMG the bastards are after our kids, its all a conspiricy, I also have a square (hope that irony is not wasted . ) Window but if I section it in two diagonally its a triangle!! Harry potty wizards hats triangles,people have eyes all a consipiricy!!!!

 

[brightn'ove]

f*** sake here we go, 16 pages.

where is falmer?