Have we got North Korea all wrong?

[Bakero]

Propoganda. Truth is, we will never really know what life is like in this country until it opens its doors. It could be a wonderful place to live, but right now we are relying on accounts from people who may have been there in the past and of course what the governments of the world are telling us.

As I said before, I know a North Korean guy. I've spent hours talking to him. He would never say a bad word about the leader and was generally pretty positive about life there. He was aware that he was one of the lucky ones though and life for some of his compatriots wasn't so easy. He would never describe it as a wonderful place to live though. If he could leave the country permanently, he would. He certainly wasn't looking forward to returning to do his national service.

 

[knocky1]

As I said before, I know a North Korean guy. I've spent hours talking to him. He would never say a bad word about the leader and was generally pretty positive about life there. He was aware that he was one of the lucky ones though and life for some of his compatriots wasn't so easy. He would never describe it as a wonderful place to live though. If he could leave the country permanently, he would. He certainly wasn't looking forward to returning to do his national service.

When were you in North Korea?

 

[Bakero]

When were you in North Korea?

I wasn't in North Korea. The guy and his family lived in Vietnam on a temporary basis. His mother ran a Korean restaurant that was owned by the regime and I assume his father worked for the government in some capacity.

 

[drew]

The country is extremely poor and decades of US sanctions have only made it poorer. Compared to nations with similar wealth, the levels of hunger are not as bad as we are lead to believe, and its achievements in education, technology and culture are admirable. All things considered, it's doing rather well considering how poor it is. I would imagine if it wasn't the major trade route between the South and China it would be treated with more respect.

Don't you mean UN sanctions. Also, are you sure that South Korea uses the North as a trade route!!!!!!

By the way anything Mustafa Kemal posts is absolute nonsense on this subject, we covered this in another post recently and he displayed a clear lack of knowledge and made genuinely ignorant and offensive statements regarding this issue. As illustrated by the above suggestion that North Korean camps do not differ from those in other nations. A clear lack of understanding does not suffice to highlight his ineptitudes.

A bit harsh. Why do you single out his posts just on this thread!!!!

 

[Lawson]

Don't you mean UN sanctions. Also, are you sure that South Korea uses the North as a trade route!!!!!!



A bit harsh. Why do you single out his posts just on this thread!!!!

because of his posts on a different thread that were frankly offensive and ignorant beyond belief.

 

[drew]

because of his posts on a different thread that were frankly offensive and ignorant beyond belief.

 

[beorhthelm]

& Yes, North Korea is used as a trade route between the South and China. I don't feel I need to explain why this is a pain in the arse for the South, US et al considering they are two very major economies.

do you have any reference for this? i find it incredible that S Korea would send trade through a country they are still tecnically at war with, when a prefectly good sea trade with Bejing and the more ecomomically important ports and regions are to the south anyway.

Well I find it quite offensive & ignorant that so many of you are comfortable with millions of innocent N. Koreans suffering more than they have to because of Western oppression, something that people such as yourself blindly support.

but, if i understand it correctly, Juche is about being self sufficient. so how does "western oppression" make them suffer then, shirley they dont want western assistance? (though i beleive they rely on massive food aid from those nasty westerners)

 

[supaseagull]

Well I find it quite offensive & ignorant that so many of you are comfortable with millions of innocent N. Koreans suffering more than they have to because of Western oppression, something that people such as yourself blindly support.

Ok then, I'll bite.

North Korea receive billions of dollars worth of aid from China...and I mean BILLIONS.

Why should and would any western country be interested in supporting a country who continually threatens to wipe them off the face of the earth?

Are you happy for the UK to provide support to a country who spends what they have on their pointless and irrelevant nuclear weapons programme?

Why should the US provide any funding to a country who has admitted supporting and providing military technology to countries, considered to be enemies of the US' allies?

Please base your response on fact and not on your dislike of the US or western countries.

 

[Lawson]

Well I find it quite offensive & ignorant that so many of you are comfortable with millions of innocent N. Koreans suffering more than they have to because of Western oppression, something that people such as yourself blindly support.

That just simply is not true. The government hoards the minimal wealth that North Korea has to allow themselves to live a life of luxury, and they divert incredible sums to the construction of that huge hotel in the middle of North Korea, the massive stadiums and the military that serves no purpose or benefit to the people. Yet if these sums were diverted to welfare etc then the people would benefit and there would be no starvation.

You are also ignoring the relief that America gave until the resumption of nuclear testing that poses a threat to millions of people, and you would be a fool to believe that any funding they receive they would not divert to this area.

The situation with the mass concentration camps would continue with funding, evidence shows in recent days that they have indeed enlarged these complexes. If we gave funding we could jeopardise lives of those outside of North Korea and only prolong the suffering of those inside. The only chance the North Korean people have is to rise up themselves or for the West and China to broker a deal for its dissolution. Existence of a totalitarian state just simply is not acceptable.

 

[BadFish]

Propoganda. Truth is, we will never really know what life is like in this country until it opens its doors. It could be a wonderful place to live, but right now we are relying on accounts from people who may have been there in the past and of course what the governments of the world are telling us.

.......and Denis Rodman, don't forget Denis Rodman.

 

[Seagull on the wing]

Well they have an official youtube channel, so if you want to find out more, go have a look. uriminzokkiri님의 채널 - YouTube

MMMmmmm! Quite taken in by State controlled lies are'nt you.........why did they dig tunnels under the 38 th parrell....which have been discovered....not for invasion on the South surely ?

 

[Northstandite]

Could just be a conspiracy to get us to dislike North Korea.

I agree, probably by Neil Armstrong whilst bounding about with Buzz Aldrin on that Moon set.

It's all David Icke's fault!

 

[BadFish]

We only know they are poor because our governments have told us they are poor.

........and the UN and Amnesty and several independant film makers and authors and the chap Bakero knows. What information do you have (aside from Denis Rodman thinking it's okay) that in any way suggests that this is all anti NK propaganda?

 

[BadFish]

It's totally unfair to compare North Korea's levels of education with developed nations, so if you compare their education to countries with similar wealth they exceed all comparisons. They have a 99.9% literacy rate which is better than many developed nations. They educate their own scientists, doctors, businessmen and other academics. The nations focus on academia & technology is inspirational. They DO draft in foreign academics for help, but we of all nations cannot criticise them for that, if anything we should take a leaf from their book and improve our own production of vital academics rather than stealing them from poorer nations.

In regards to their culture - it is a nation that is very dedicated to the arts. It produces TV and cinema to a very acceptable level. - while they are obviously not up to Western standards, the fact that such a poor nation is capable and doesn't lose focus of these things is admirable. Sport, music and literature also has notable cultural importance & competence in North Korea.



It's important to respect that it is a developing nation. All western nations once had the problem of feeding all its people and many still do. It's also worth noting that the famines are usually caused by environmental problems such as flooding or draughts. Undoubtedly with Western wealth, North Korea could cultivate its land to its full potential and create a stockpile of food, but the same could be said for all other impoverished Asian nations.

...and you are completely wrong about North Korea wanting destroy South Korea - absolute bullshit - in fact their ultimate goal is to reunify with the South and restore true Korean values, it's part of their Juche ideology. They have one main enemy, the USA - and who can blame them? Intimidation and propaganda has been continually coming from the USA since they lost the war.

You may not agree with the personality of cult, it's very different to the way we do things, but it's not dissimilar to Western religion or advertising in our capitalist system - except rather than their people being encouraged to believe in a man in the sky or materialistic values, they have their nation personified into an individual. I don't agree with it, but it's not an argument that is strong enough to have their values destroyed.

North Korea just wants to be self-sufficient, and left alone - with its Korean values unaffected. It's all in their Juche ideology which I would recommend anyone to read more about for a better insight into their political mindset. The best thing the West could do is make peace with North Korea, accept its ways, and help it into prosperity. As the country gets richer, the people would have a greater power to revolt if that is what they wanted - but from what I know, the people are so proud of their nation and its values and fully subscribe to the Juche ideology to the extent that a majority of them would die for it - no exaggeration.

Nothing to do with the fear of not subscribing to it or being brainwashed then?

 

[Cheeky Monkey]

These are some documentaries by a film crew who did secret filming there. Interesting watch.
]

There are some interesting North Korean vids on YouTube filmed by an American tourist, all about 1.5hrs long (3 in total), starting off with him filming from a train crossing North Korea while tucking into a burger made of grass ripped from the nearest embankment. If I wasn't so lazy and useless at using an Ipad I'd put them up here. Fascinating watch though.

 

[Questions]

How hearts of the loyal hardworking people of India/Pakistan/ must soar when thay are told that their struggle and sacrifice has meant that the Great Leader has launched a new rocket which has gone higher and made a bigger bang than the last one ,making all their years of suffering and hunger worthwhile.

I've recently read that Taiwan are developing a missile based on the old Sam systems (honest) in response to China's aggression. Should we expect them to be on sale in Wilkinsons and the Range sometime soon ?

 

[Seagull on the wing]

There was a good documentary filmed in NK where a western doctor went and did one thousand cataract operations....they were then assembled in a room and one by one had their bandages removed...they then stood in front of a portrait of Kim and sung HIS praises for curing their sight...one even declaring that he would serve faithfully and kill as many Americans as he could....really enlightened people....brainwashed and dare not say anything against the state for fear of retribution to him and his family....

 

[Biscuit]

North Korea is heavily militarised because it is ready for war and rightly so. If it wasn't, it would probably no longer be a state - it is just trying to self preserve. It isn't going to roll over like other nations have for the US, by sanctions or by war.

Do you think the West and/or the US are scared of the North Korean military?

The only reason the most vile dictatorship on the planet is still going is because nobody has a CLUE how to solve the crises afterwards. South Koreas economy is simply not big enough to handle the HUGE strain that it would be put under with the millions of dependants under a unified Korea. Even the norths natural resources wouldn't come close to bridging the gap. So apart from those economic reasons there's also the sociological problems. What on earth do you do with generations of people that have been totally brainwashed? People that have gone through unbelievable hardship and would have no idea how to integrate into a modern society.

You posts imply NK is on some brave campaign against the outside world's interference. In reality is an incredibly complicated social-economic cluster f*** that no one knows how to handle. A country built on fear where a tiny few enjoy luxury beyond measure where millions of their countrymen starve and are beaten in prison camps. It's disgusting and your defence of it is quite frankly bizarre. When it all comes to an end (hopefully sooner rather than later) and the true horror is revealed you'll be ashamed of your comments on the matter.

 

[beorhthelm]

... The heavy militarisation is an obscenely large expense as you can imagine.

an expense they chose to make over other priorities. as far as trade is concerned if N Korea is building a railway, it would be either for vanity, military purposes or both (i dont suppose they see any difference). there's little purpose for trade through N Korea when you can go direct to a port in China or Russia.

 

[jakarta]

Do you think the West and/or the US are scared of the North Korean military?

The only reason the most vile dictatorship on the planet is still going is because nobody has a CLUE how to solve the crises afterwards. South Koreas economy is simply not big enough to handle the HUGE strain that it would be put under with the millions of dependants under a unified Korea. Even the norths natural resources wouldn't come close to bridging the gap. So apart from those economic reasons there's also the sociological problems. What on earth do you do with generations of people that have been totally brainwashed? People that have gone through unbelievable hardship and would have no idea how to integrate into a modern society.

You posts imply NK is on some brave campaign against the outside world's interference. In reality is an incredibly complicated social-economic cluster f*** that no one knows how to handle. A country built on fear where a tiny few enjoy luxury beyond measure where millions of their countrymen starve and are beaten in prison camps. It's disgusting and your defence of it is quite frankly bizarre. When it all comes to an end (hopefully sooner rather than later) and the true horror is revealed you'll be ashamed of your comments on the matter.

I would have thought that the only reason NK continues on its bizarre course is because China allows it to do so.

I agree it will be a very, very strange place when it all falls apart - East Germany raised to a factor of ten!