[Politics] Brexit

[A1X]

You mean they couldn't build everything in that week between Christmas and New Year under lockdown? It's almost like they WANT Britain to fail.

 

[WATFORD zero]

You mean they couldn't build everything in that week between Christmas and New Year under lockdown? It's almost like they WANT Britain to fail.

EU CHEATS ! Customs procedures preparations started before the deal was agreed !

We can reveal that the reason the EU were ready and successfully implemented their customs procedures on Jan 1st was because they CHEATED and began building works, developing systems and recruiting staff before the deal with the UK was even finalised.

We now believe that this was done solely to make the UK look foolish when it proved unable to control it's own borders 6 months later. In a further completely unjustified attack on the UK when asked, a spokesman for the EU said it was simply about 'Taking back control !'

www.Expressheadlinesareus.com

 

[Randy McNob]

[tweet]1367855517805207554[/tweet]

 

[Baldseagull]

As I said, I think it's a silly question to ask for the reasons previously stated. Also, not much point in arguing for something that isn't going to happen.

Yes the point being, referendum votes are in no way a guarantee (unless for leaving the EU) of preventing ever closer union no matter how much some people pretend otherwise. Speaking of which ..



Bollox ...

They even mentioned it in the question. The question asked in France ...

“Do you approve the bill authorizing the ratification of the treaty establishing a Constitution for Europe?”

.... numerous issues get drawn into a referendum and parties take sides for all sorts of reasons but to pretend it wasn't about accepting or rejecting the EU constitution (another step towards ever closer union) is clearly false.

Netherlands - Dutch say 'devastating no' to EU constitution

The project for greater European integration was today facing crisis after Dutch voters rejected the constitution spelling out the conditions of unity.

....Jan Peter Balkenende, the prime minister, swiftly conceded defeat and acknowledged the gap between politicians and the electorate. "The idea of Europe has lived for the politicians, but not the Dutch people," he said. "That will have to change."

The French president, Jacques Chirac, said the Dutch vote - which came just three days after France rejected the EU constitution - had exposed "questions and concerns about the development of the European project".

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/jun/02/eu.politics

Even the French President and the Dutch PM acknowledged it was a rejection of the political drive for ever closer union. As we know it didn't take the politicians long to find a way of bypassing referendum results that gave the wrong answer.

I'm pretty sure the last time we did this I mentioned France/Netherlands in my final post and you didn't reply ...

Possible I didn't respond to what happened in France or the Netherlands, because as I said in my post, neither State had an act of law requiring a referendum to ratify as we did in the UK, so it is a false argument to use either one as an example. You making the same erroneous point again and again until I give up making the same point in putting you right, is not me disappearing, avoiding the question, or backing off, that is you being willfully ignorant.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Possible I didn't respond to what happened in France or the Netherlands, because as I said in my post, neither State had an act of law requiring a referendum to ratify as we did in the UK, so it is a false argument to use either one as an example. You making the same erroneous point again and again until I give up making the same point in putting you right, is not me disappearing, avoiding the question, or backing off, that is you being willfully ignorant.

You keep running off because you know the French and Dutch examples show that even when the citizens of member states voted to reject the EU constitution, a significant step towards ever closer union, in a referendum, it made no real difference thus demolishing your claim that a UK referendum lock is certain to prevent ever closer union. They always find a way to get round inconveniant democratic road blocks. It's the fundamental flaw in the EU project, the political class are completely detached from the European electorate and keep driving towards a goal usually without any specific democratic mandate and on the rare occasions they do allow us a vote they just circumvent democracy orbkeep asking us to vote when they get the wrong answer.

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

 

[Baldseagull]

You keep running off because you know the French and Dutch examples show that even when the citizens of member states voted to reject the EU constitution, a significant step towards ever closer union, in a referendum, it made no real difference thus demolishing your claim that a UK referendum lock is certain to prevent ever closer union. They always find a way to get round inconveniant democratic road blocks. It's the fundamental flaw in the EU project, the political class are completely detached from the European electorate and keep driving towards a goal usually without any specific democratic mandate and on the rare occasions they do allow us a vote they just circumvent democracy orbkeep asking us to vote when they get the wrong answer.

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

I have never claimed that the referendum was certain to prevent closer Union, just that it prevents it from happening without popular consent, I assume that this would allay your concerns over the politicians being detached from the electorate?

The French and Dutch examples are examples of what the French and Dutch Governments did, the EU did not force them to have referendums, or to not have them on the Lisbon Treaty.
"They always find a way to avoid a democratic road block" is just regurgitated Farage bumjuice.
The French and Dutch referendums killed the constitution, the Lisbon Treaty is an amendment to the original Treaties, it achieved a lot of what the constitution had aimed for, including the legal right to leave the EU which was not previously clear, so it even had something in it for you.
You can cite referendums held in France and Holland as much as you like, and the later absence of any in France or Holland for the Lisbon Treaty, it does not change the fact that in the UK a law was brought in requiring that both houses of Parliament and the electorate had to give consent before any treaty changes or new treaties with the EU could be signed up to, it is just a fact, and has **** all to do with France or Holland.

 

[Baker lite]

I have never claimed that the referendum was certain to prevent closer Union, just that it prevents it from happening without popular consent, I assume that this would allay your concerns over the politicians being detached from the electorate?

The French and Dutch examples are examples of what the French and Dutch Governments did, the EU did not force them to have referendums, or to not have them on the Lisbon Treaty.
"They always find a way to avoid a democratic road block" is just regurgitated Farage bumjuice.
The French and Dutch referendums killed the constitution, the Lisbon Treaty is an amendment to the original Treaties, it achieved a lot of what the constitution had aimed for, including the legal right to leave the EU which was not previously clear, so it even had something in it for you.
You can cite referendums held in France and Holland as much as you like, and the later absence of any in France or Holland for the Lisbon Treaty, it does not change the fact that in the UK a law was brought in requiring that both houses of Parliament and the electorate had to give consent before any treaty changes or new treaties with the EU could be signed up to, it is just a fact, and has **** all to do with France or Holland.

Dry your eyes now, we’re out and there’s not going to be an EU to rejoin in 5-10 years time. Chins up..
Born to win [emoji636]


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

Dry your eyes now, we’re out and there’s not going to be an EU to rejoin in 5-10 years time. Chins up..
Born to win [emoji636]


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Hoodwinked into joining the common market which then morphed into the EU which the British public had no say in .
Normal service has been resumed
Regards
DF

 

[Randy McNob]

I wonder if the French and Dutch would vote to lose thier freedom of movement and have trade barriers to all their european neighbours even before looking at the complete shitshow happening in the UK? (and pay circa 200bn for the privelidge)

 

[Baker lite]

I wonder if the French and Dutch would vote to lose thier freedom of movement and have trade barriers to all their european neighbours even before looking at the complete shitshow happening in the UK? (and pay circa 200bn for the privelidge)

I’ve got my nice blue passport, I’m free to go wherever I please.
Born to win [emoji636]

 

[WATFORD zero]

I'm guessing he has probably run out of getting those who 'need to believe more' on board, so it appears that imagination is now the key to Brexit. I'm guessing that, just like every single NSC Brexiteer on this thread, the Government can't 'imagine' any other alternative solutions to the NI protocol

Boris Johnson: ‘Goodwill’ and ‘imagination’ can fix post-Brexit border problems

LONDON — Post-Brexit "teething problems" at the Northern Irish border should be ironed out with "goodwill" and "imagination," Boris Johnson said Monday. Speaking at a Downing Street press conference, the prime minister said the U.K. was fixing issues at Northern Ireland’s ports with "some temporary technical things" in a bid to keep trade flowing smoothly.

Britain announced last week it would unilaterally continue Irish Sea border grace periods until October, a move Brussels says breaks the trade agreement signed by the two sides in December, which includes special arrangements for Northern Ireland.

https://www.politico.eu/article/boris-johnson-goodwill-imagination-fix-post-brexit-teething-problems/

It appears that not only did he sell a 'fantasy good deal' to the terminally naive in order to get power and win an election, he then went on to actually negotiate, sign off and try to implement the same unimplementable 'fantasy'.

Boris Johnson's Brexit shenanigans have met their reckoning in Northern Ireland

The Northern Ireland border was Boris Johnson’s greatest Brexit “untruth”. He told the taoiseach there would be no border in Ireland. He told Northern Ireland’s unionists there would be none in the Irish Sea. He told everyone he would leave Europe’s customs union. Johnson was, as the saying goes, “averse to the despotism of facts”.

As the “grace periods” come to an end, it is clear that Johnson must quickly decide what to do, whether to erect customs barriers around the six counties, incidentally breaking the Good Friday agreement, or erect them around Belfast dock. The first would be a logistical and emotional nightmare. It would probably drive the north’s eventual reunion with the south – and much strife in the process. Or he must do the EU’s bidding, barricade Belfast and enrage the unionists, which he has twice refused to do in illegal breach of the Northern Ireland protocol. He simply must decide.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/08/boris-johnsons-brexit-northern-ireland-customs-union-border

When Fantasy meets reality

 

[Chicken Run]

I'm guessing he has probably run out of getting those who 'need to believe more' on board, so it appears that imagination is now the key to Brexit. I'm guessing that, just like every single NSC Brexiteer on this thread, the Government can't 'imagine' any other alternative solutions to the NI protocol

Boris Johnson: ‘Goodwill’ and ‘imagination’ can fix post-Brexit border problems

LONDON — Post-Brexit "teething problems" at the Northern Irish border should be ironed out with "goodwill" and "imagination," Boris Johnson said Monday. Speaking at a Downing Street press conference, the prime minister said the U.K. was fixing issues at Northern Ireland’s ports with "some temporary technical things" in a bid to keep trade flowing smoothly.

Britain announced last week it would unilaterally continue Irish Sea border grace periods until October, a move Brussels says breaks the trade agreement signed by the two sides in December, which includes special arrangements for Northern Ireland.

https://www.politico.eu/article/boris-johnson-goodwill-imagination-fix-post-brexit-teething-problems/

It appears that not only did he sell a 'fantasy good deal' to the terminally naive in order to get power and win an election, he then went on to actually negotiate, sign off and try to implement the same unimplementable 'fantasy'.

Boris Johnson's Brexit shenanigans have met their reckoning in Northern Ireland

The Northern Ireland border was Boris Johnson’s greatest Brexit “untruth”. He told the taoiseach there would be no border in Ireland. He told Northern Ireland’s unionists there would be none in the Irish Sea. He told everyone he would leave Europe’s customs union. Johnson was, as the saying goes, “averse to the despotism of facts”.

As the “grace periods” come to an end, it is clear that Johnson must quickly decide what to do, whether to erect customs barriers around the six counties, incidentally breaking the Good Friday agreement, or erect them around Belfast dock. The first would be a logistical and emotional nightmare. It would probably drive the north’s eventual reunion with the south – and much strife in the process. Or he must do the EU’s bidding, barricade Belfast and enrage the unionists, which he has twice refused to do in illegal breach of the Northern Ireland protocol. He simply must decide.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/08/boris-johnsons-brexit-northern-ireland-customs-union-border

When Fantasy meets reality

And I’m trying to guess why your post has the same paragraph in it twice[emoji23][emoji6]

Oh and I still don’t have a clue what to do about NI x

 

[WATFORD zero]

And I’m trying to guess why your post has the same paragraph in it twice[emoji23][emoji6]

Oh and I still don’t have a clue what to do about NI

Yes you have told us before that you didn't understand what you were voting for, there really isn't any need to keep repeating it

Anyway, another glorious spring day so I am off out and you can spend the day typing furiously at your keyboard again. Maybe you should try the Race Fishing threads for some more attention after your sterling efforts on them yesterday. Have fun

 

[Chicken Run]

Yes you have told us before that you didn't understand what you were voting for, there really isn't any need to keep repeating it

Anyway, another glorious spring day so I am off out and you can spend the day typing furiously at your keyboard again. Maybe you should try the Race Fishing threads for some more attention after your sterling efforts on them yesterday. Have fun

Oh so it was just a mistake while you “furiously” typed at your keyboard, so much so in fact you typed it twice you silly tit[emoji23]

Anyway jog on then and we look forward to hearing all about your day out later then, oh an is it a shoulder of lamb with couscous tonight?

 

[WATFORD zero]

Oh so it was just a mistake while you “furiously” typed at your keyboard, so much so in fact you typed it twice you silly tit[emoji23]

Anyway jog on then and we look forward to hearing all about your day out later then, oh an is it a shoulder of lamb with couscous tonight?

So, no contribution to the subject of the post, which you claim you don't understand anyway, just trying to derail the thread as you originally did with your pretend humour

you are kidding absolutely no one with this.

Now, why don’t you see if you can go at least 10 minutes without replying to a post of mine.

Here’s your dummy back and perhaps we can have your thoughts on Pharmacies instead of you derailing the thread as you originally did with your pretend humour [emoji6][emoji6]

 

[Chicken Run]

So, no contribution to the subject of the post, which you claim you don't understand anyway, just trying to derail the thread as you originally did with your pretend humour

I knew it wouldn’t be long until your foul stench made a reappearance shit stirring!

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I have never claimed that the referendum was certain to prevent closer Union, just that it prevents it from happening without popular consent, I assume that this would allay your concerns over the politicians being detached from the electorate?

The French and Dutch examples are examples of what the French and Dutch Governments did, the EU did not force them to have referendums, or to not have them on the Lisbon Treaty.
"They always find a way to avoid a democratic road block" is just regurgitated Farage bumjuice.
The French and Dutch referendums killed the constitution, the Lisbon Treaty is an amendment to the original Treaties, it achieved a lot of what the constitution had aimed for, including the legal right to leave the EU which was not previously clear, so it even had something in it for you.
You can cite referendums held in France and Holland as much as you like, and the later absence of any in France or Holland for the Lisbon Treaty, it does not change the fact that in the UK a law was brought in requiring that both houses of Parliament and the electorate had to give consent before any treaty changes or new treaties with the EU could be signed up to, it is just a fact, and has **** all to do with France or Holland.

The French and Dutch examples obviously prove you wrong, ever closer union was achieved despite two referenda no votes. The Lisbon Treaty was devised to circumvent those no votes, if the Uk votes no using the 2011 act there is no guarantee a way could not be found to circumvent that result as well ... pretending otherwise is just mendacious nonsense.

Plus a law was not brought in requiring that both houses of Parliament and the electorate had to give consent before any treaty changes or new treaties with the EU could be signed up to. Treaty changes could be made if deemed not significant by politicians and those same politicians would be the judge of what constitutes a transfer of power to the EU triggering the need for a referendum. The Act could also be repealed at any time so no, voting Remain was in no way the best option to prevent being dragged further into the quicksand of EU integration. There was only one surefire solution ..... voting leave Fact!

 

[vegster]

Sounds like we are hitting the Germans where it hurts ! Global Britain is BACK !

UK-Germany trade slumps amid Brexit and Covid fallout

" German exports to the UK also dropped by 29% to €4.3bn. " !!!!

 

[Baldseagull]

The French and Dutch examples obviously prove you wrong, ever closer union was achieved despite two referenda no votes. The Lisbon Treaty was devised to circumvent those no votes, if the Uk votes no using the 2011 act there is no guarantee a way could not be found to circumvent that result as well ... pretending otherwise is just mendacious nonsense.

Plus a law was not brought in requiring that both houses of Parliament and the electorate had to give consent before any treaty changes or new treaties with the EU could be signed up to. Treaty changes could be made if deemed not significant by politicians and those same politicians would be the judge of what constitutes a transfer of power to the EU triggering the need for a referendum. The Act could also be repealed at any time so no, voting Remain was in no way the best option to prevent being dragged further into the quicksand of EU integration. There was only one surefire solution ..... voting leave Fact!

This is like teaching Baldrick to count.

The French and Dutch referendums, killed the EU constitution, it went away, later, a set of amendments were created by the EU and member states, and France and the Netherlands signed up to it without a referendum, THAT COULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED IN THE UK AFTER 2011!

Please try to think, thinking is so important.

The aim of ever closer union is an aspiration, it will only be achieved at the rate of the least keen member, or, if the EU were to create a two "speed" EU, and then, the ever closer union would create a divide. There is nothing in any of the existing treaties that would have bound us to sign up to further treaties or amendments, the only way to get around the referendum requirement would be to repeal that law, and a government would only get away with doing that if the country was massively pro EU, and if that were the case, the government would have nothing to fear from a referendum.
Your surefire solution, leaving, means that the law that would have required a referendum on treaty changes has been repealed, and I bet that it does not get reinstated when we rejoin in a few years time, so in the fullness of time, you should be able to say that you played a part in clearing the path towards a United States of Europe.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Important update for kids planning to study abroad now Johnson has cut the Erasmus scheme.

New ‘Erasmus’ scheme will not pay tuition or travel costs and living allowance slashed

The replacement for the Erasmus study exchange scheme will not fund tuition or travel costs, it has emerged – and the living allowance has been slashed. The reality of the new project has triggered fresh accusations that ministers are crushing the hopes of huge numbers of students who want to live, study and travel abroad.

Boris Johnson promised last year that there was “no threat” to the hugely-popular Erasmus programme, but his Brexit trade deal then pulled the plug.

And, most significantly, free studies in any EU country, plus some others in Europe, has been replaced by pressure on universities and colleges to strike deals. “Turing Scheme funding is not available for tuition fees,” its website admits. “There is an expectation that HE providers will agree tuition fee waivers with their partner HE providers, in order to facilitate student study placements.”

The replacement was already under fire over a claim that 35,000 students in universities, colleges and schools would go on placements and exchanges, from this September. Ministers were unable to explain how a scheme costing only £100m could fund the travels of 35,000 students – working out at only £2,850 each.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/new-erasmus-scheme-will-not-pay-tuition-or-travel-costs-and-living-allowance-slashed/ar-BB1epCb3

I know this will be a major concern to some NSCers who were planning to study abroad or who have kids wanting to do the same