Jonathan Trott on his way home

[Trevor]

The replacements for the number 3 spot don't exactly inspire confidence really...

I think Ian Bell should now bat 3 - I would be happy enough to try James Taylor at 5

 

[Leekbrookgull]

I never really fully understood 'the stress problem' maybe because i never seem to feel low low or down ? However i just do wonder for some player's touring is really not for them,three months living out of a suitcase away from the family and friends. No watching your local club side or a pint with your mates. Look how many Ex-pats return and they are not under any pressure. Nothing wrong in being a 'home bird'.

 

[Pevenseagull]

I didn't draw the conclusion from this comment though



The implication was that because Australia are bowling at his leg stump and have been doing so since the start of the summer it has somehow triggered this condition. There's plenty of research into mental illness, and the two are not connected.

I was going to put something on here along your lines but you've already done it in a manner I would be proud of.

Loving the areas.

 

[Pevenseagull]

Out of interest, if he had gone home with Crohn's Disease, (as suffered by Darren Fletcher at United) or something similar, would you have said he'd left England in the lurch?

Mental illness is as debilitating as a physical one, attitudes to it are however completely different. I've just heard Kieswetter saying that Trott wasn't the 'type you'd expect to suffer from this', which is revealing, as is there is still a belief that it only affects what we perceive to be weak-minded individuals, whereas in reality it can strike down anyone, just as cancer can.

........and another .............. great work.

 

[Kumquat]

Edited for accuracy.

Can't we agree on both depression and David Warner being nasty pieces of work? At least the latter can and has apologised. Edited for opinion rather than accuracy. Don't feel I have any specific claim on others about that.

 

[Pevenseagull]

My wife has Crohn's Disease. She works 4 days per week, has two young children to bring up and is presently organising a Christmas High Street Fayre in a small town in Sussex. She manages her illness, as does her brother who works part-time but has Multiple Sclerosis. Thousands of people work and manage their health, and this involves planning ahead.

I think this works both ways. Yes, the wider population needs to be more understanding and aware of mental illness, but players who are not "fit for battle" should think twice about joining the fray.

How good is Mrs Pavillionaire against pace bowlers?

 

[Kumquat]

I never really fully understood 'the stress problem' maybe because i never seem to feel low low or down ? However i just do wonder for some player's touring is really not for them,three months living out of a suitcase away from the family and friends. No watching your local club side or a pint with your mates. Look how many Ex-pats return and they are not under any pressure. Nothing wrong in being a 'home bird'.

I think the difference with Trott is that he clearly was affected by it in the summer ie. when not touring.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

The trash talk is all part of The Ashes, and in the same way that it can affect players like Trott it can also inspire others. Look at the way Anderson has improved since Justin Langer's dossier revealed the Aussies regarded him as mentally weak. Ditto the way Mitchell Johnson has bounced back from the Barmy Army's constant taunts.

You are assuming that the 'trash talk' has affected Trott.

Maybe it did, but perhaps the straw that broke the camels back.

I'm sure it is not as simple as shrugging it off and working double hard to prove something, someone, somewhen.

 

[joeinbrighton]

In terms of the cricketing matters that need addressing following Trott's departure, I'd have thought they either move Ian Bell up to number 3 or they move Joe Root back up to open the batting and play Michael Carberry at number 3 where he has played in the past. I'd probably go with the Bell option as Bell was England's key batsman in the home Ashes series and I tend to subscribe to the view that your best batsmen should be playing in the top 4 in the order. England haven't called up a replacement because the England performance squad are also in Australia. I expect they will assess how the players in that squad are getting on and will, in due course, draft one of the batsmen from that squad into the first team's touring party.

With regards to Jonathan Trott, I think it is very easy to sit thousands of miles away and speculate, but people saying England were foolish to select him in the squad when they knew he had a long-standing stress related illness are talking with the benefit of hindsight. Trott and the medical team, psychologist etc will probably have felt his condition was under control and he was able to function. The pressures of not fulfilling his job as well as he would have liked may well have intensified his stress to make things unmanageable, but maybe also being away from his family, having difficulty sleeping might have come in to it too. The workings of the mind are very complex, so only Trott knows what he is feeling. Cricketers do seem to suffer from depression more than competitors in other sports for some reason. I remember reading that the percentage of suicides among cricketers is higher than in any other sport. Why would this be? I can only think that the mental deterioration involved when you go from scoring runs for fun to suddenly struggling to get the ball off the square not knowing where the next run is coming from plays its part. It's not a case of being weak though, in fact people suffering from depression are often very strong people who perhaps keep things to themselves.

 

[Durlston]

As Marcus Trescothick said in his book about depression when he walked off the pitch on tour after getting out: "I knew the b*st*rd was back". Often it's always there subconsciously - you're so busy that you don't have time to think about things really deeply and all it takes is one or two mental blows to the mind. I'm sure Jonathan Trott has been feeling in a bad place for some time. I wish him well on his recovery and hope he returns to the England team in the near future.

 

[Pavilionaire]

You are assuming that the 'trash talk' has affected Trott.

Maybe it did, but perhaps the straw that broke the camels back.

I'm sure it is not as simple as shrugging it off and working double hard to prove something, someone, somewhen.

He gave an interview a year ago in which he talked about the thrill of the battle at test level, having to play bowlers hurling the ball down at pace etc, so it's not the idea of facing the bowling that's got to him.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I had a read of a Major League Baseball website to see what their experience is of stress- related illness, this on the basis that the careers of baseball players and cricketers have many similarities. Sure enough, players signing onto the DL (Disabled List) because of stress / depression is on the increase, including several high profile players. One article listed 12 such players. Most never recover but in Joey Votto and Zach Greinke there are two All-Stars that have made a full recovery, so there is some hope if he gets the best counselling.

 

[Pevenseagull]

I like to think of myself as hard. Not physically..... I could hide behind a lamp post ....... but 'hard' in the resilient sense. I've had/have physical problems which I've overcome/ will overcome ........... I've known/ know people who have had/have 'mental' issues and it is/was/ can be heartbreaking and scary. I'd rather need something cut out of me than my mind be scrambled ....................... I was going to try to flesh this out with something that read as wise but I'm a bit pissed and am too busy listening to 'The Posies, Frosting The Beater' ............. and I would probably only come across as a dull preachy dickhead.

Anyway ........... anyone getting on his back ........ get the F*** off of it.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Whether or not the sledging had any part in his decision to return home (and its hard to imagine the pressures of the first test didn't play some role); I still find it amazing that continual downright abuse of your opponent is allowed in cricket. So much is made that this is the gentleman's game but I can't think of another sport like it, where you can stand there and the have four or five guys around giving you constant verbals, and you've basically got to take it and try to shut it out somehow. Its just a game, its meant to be fun but it seems that for cricket, mental resilience is as important as skill when it comes to making the step to the highest level.

 

[Publius Ovidius]

Interesting today that the England management have come out and said they knew about trott's condition for a long time!

 

[Mo Gosfield]

Whether or not the sledging had any part in his decision to return home (and its hard to imagine the pressures of the first test didn't play some role); I still find it amazing that continual downright abuse of your opponent is allowed in cricket. So much is made that this is the gentleman's game but I can't think of another sport like it, where you can stand there and the have four or five guys around giving you constant verbals, and you've basically got to take it and try to shut it out somehow. Its just a game, its meant to be fun but it seems that for cricket, mental resilience is as important as skill when it comes to making the step to the highest level.

Mental resilience is a prerequisite in cricket as well as in life. Test cricket is the school of hard knocks and boy, do you have to be tough. It is probably the most mentally demanding sport in the world. It is a game of confidence, concentration and gamesmanship. Players will seize on the slightest weakness in technique or attitude to gain an advantage.
A friend of mine was playing for Sussex in the 70's and was fielding close to the wicket. He could hear every word that Tony Greig was saying to a certain West Indian, ball after ball after ball. It was racist, it was rude, it was unpleasant. It was relentless sledging. Greigy gave it out in big doses and he got it back in big doses. He could handle it. He was mentally tough.
Cricket is not a game for the faint-hearted. A cricketer is showing his character on the field of play. You can recognise the flat track bullies who will impose themselves against the average and mediocre. You can recognise those that will dig in and fight against the odds and move heaven and earth to turn a situation around. You can see the players that are uncomfortable with pace bowling and fast rising deliveries. Their bottle goes. They don't relish the challenge and end up giving it away than staying and trying to tough it out.
It was clear to anyone who knows cricket that Trott hasn't been right for a while. In the summer, he was batting way out of his crease in an attempt to counter the Aussie bowling but in effect he was compounding the problem, making it easier for them to tuck him up. Like Prior and Clarke, he doesn't like fast, short-pitched deliveries. All three players have a temperement flaw and are, in essence, ' flat-track bullies ' Notice how regularly all three get out quickly, when the going is a bit tough. Even Bradman had problems with this type of bowling in 32-33 but he still managed to average over 50 in the series.
I feel desperately sorry for any cricketer with mental issues. It signals the end of their career at the highest level. In Trott's case it has opened the door for the Aussies to seize a massive psychological advantage and it will now show whether England have enough players, with enough mental resolve to turn this around.

 

[LamieRobertson]

Interesting today that the England management have come out and said they knew about trott's condition for a long time!

As i said in in my post yesterday ..Flower stated that they had known about Trotts problems

 

[KZNSeagull]

Interesting today that the England management have come out and said they knew about trott's condition for a long time!

As i said in in my post yesterday ..Flower stated that they had known about Trotts problems

Just shows how reliant we are on the established batsmen. Now that someone else will get a chance, let's hope that they take it.

 

[5Ways Gull]

Can't we agree on both depression and David Warner being nasty pieces of work? At least the latter can and has apologised. Edited for opinion rather than accuracy. Don't feel I have any specific claim on others about that.

I question Warner's reasons for his apology - don't think he did it voluntarily. Apparently when he made his comment about Trott the ACB Press man with him winced. I wonder if he was told to apologise.

Also someone told me that Allan Border was interviewed somewhere on TV and was very critical of what he did!

Luis Suarez is a class act compared to this guy.

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

Mental resilience is a prerequisite in cricket as well as in life. Test cricket is the school of hard knocks and boy, do you have to be tough. It is probably the most mentally demanding sport in the world. It is a game of confidence, concentration and gamesmanship. Players will seize on the slightest weakness in technique or attitude to gain an advantage.
A friend of mine was playing for Sussex in the 70's and was fielding close to the wicket. He could hear every word that Tony Greig was saying to a certain West Indian, ball after ball after ball. It was racist, it was rude, it was unpleasant. It was relentless sledging. Greigy gave it out in big doses and he got it back in big doses. He could handle it. He was mentally tough.
Cricket is not a game for the faint-hearted. A cricketer is showing his character on the field of play. You can recognise the flat track bullies who will impose themselves against the average and mediocre. You can recognise those that will dig in and fight against the odds and move heaven and earth to turn a situation around. You can see the players that are uncomfortable with pace bowling and fast rising deliveries. Their bottle goes. They don't relish the challenge and end up giving it away than staying and trying to tough it out.
It was clear to anyone who knows cricket that Trott hasn't been right for a while. In the summer, he was batting way out of his crease in an attempt to counter the Aussie bowling but in effect he was compounding the problem, making it easier for them to tuck him up. Like Prior and Clarke, he doesn't like fast, short-pitched deliveries. All three players have a temperement flaw and are, in essence, ' flat-track bullies ' Notice how regularly all three get out quickly, when the going is a bit tough. Even Bradman had problems with this type of bowling in 32-33 but he still managed to average over 50 in the series.
I feel desperately sorry for any cricketer with mental issues. It signals the end of their career at the highest level. In Trott's case it has opened the door for the Aussies to seize a massive psychological advantage and it will now show whether England have enough players, with enough mental resolve to turn this around.

Cricket should definitely be about mental resilience to cope with loss of form, to play challenging bowlers, to tough out difficult passages off play, to stay focused and work round holes in your technique. It shouldn't be about mental resilience to cope with someone being abusive in your face. I've played a lot of cricket and there's always sledging, but its never that kind of downright abuse we hear so frequently at the top level. Its 'mind the windows Tino' kind of sledging, not 'I'm going to break your ****ing arm you ****'. The latter should be controlled IMHO.