Jock Stein, Fergie and the other greats.......

[Soulman]

and a man with class and humour who is fondly remembered by players and fans alike.

Indeed.
I was coming back from Spain about 10 years ago and sat next to a pensioner on the plane. This chap was 80, but looked about 65. He was an interesting chap, and after him telling me that he was in the Navy when he was younger, and that his ship was one of the ones that sank the Bismark, he then left the navy and became LFC's coach driver. Shankly was the manager. He loved Shankly and at first this chap would sit in the coach with his flask whilst the match was on.
Shankly soon had him sitting nearby and watching the game with refreshments. The chap said Shankly was always so polite, had time for all the fans and staff.
The players all had huge respect for him, and he knew how to talk to the players to get the best out of them on an individual basis.
Apparently the player that was not a nice bloke, and the other players despised was Emlyn Hughes, but Shankly knew how to get the commitment out of him and keep the peace.
His personality and humbleness puts him above Fergie, not least he brought the club up from the second division and laid the foundations for others.

 

[Lord Bracknell]

Are you actually serious ? Please tell me you're not.

http://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2009/03/football-politics-team-tony-2

Alastair Campbell:- Where do you think your politics come from?

Alex Ferguson:- My background and my upbringing. My dad was on the left, and so were most people where I came from. I grew up in a very working-class area of Glasgow and I was always very conscious of the sense of community, people and families supporting each other. I grew up believing Labour was the party of the working man, and I still believe that. Then, when I was working in the shipyards on Clydeside, I realised how important it was that people had proper representation and I got involved as a shop steward in the union. I led an unofficial walkout over pay. There was another thing that politicised me even more as an adult, and that was when my mother was dying in November 1986, just a couple of weeks after I took over at United. She was at the Southern General in Glasgow, and it was absolutely dreadful, cladding hanging off the pipes, doctors and nurses overworked, and so little dignity attached to it. All my life I’ve seen Labour as the party working to get better health care for ordinary people, and the Tories really only caring about the people at the top. The NHS is definitely better after 12 years of Labour.

 

[BadFish]

Indeed.
I was coming back from Spain about 10 years ago and sat next to a pensioner on the plane. This chap was 80, but looked about 65. He was an interesting chap, and after him telling me that he was in the Navy when he was younger, and that his ship was one of the ones that sank the Bismark, he then left the navy and became LFC's coach driver. Shankly was the manager. He loved Shankly and at first this chap would sit in the coach with his flask whilst the match was on.
Shankly soon had him sitting nearby and watching the game with refreshments. The chap said Shankly was always so polite, had time for all the fans and staff.
The players all had huge respect for him, and he knew how to talk to the players to get the best out of them on an individual basis.
Apparently the player that was not a nice bloke, and the other players despised was Emlyn Hughes, but Shankly knew how to get the commitment out of him and keep the peace.
His personality and humbleness puts him above Fergie, not least he brought the club up from the second division and laid the foundations for others.

My uncle is a bluenose from a huge Everton family and from the way he speaks Shankly was respected around Liverpool for the way he went about things. My uncle speaks very highly of him, which is notable because it is the only positive thing he has to say about the red side of Liverpool.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Absolutely spot on. People who claim the European Cup was harder than the UCL is today are living in the past.

Take Liverpool in 1977 for example. All they had to do to win the competition was beat Crusaders (who?), Trabzonspor, Saint Etienne and FC Zurich before reaching a final against Borussia Monchengladbach. Or Nottingham Forest in 1980, who beat the mighty Oster, Arges Pitesti, Dynamo Berlin, Ajax and Hamburg. Liverpool in 1978 beat CLUB BRUGGE in the final - how is it even possible to take this seriously?

On the other hand, Chelsea in 2012 played Valencia, Bayer Leverkusen, Genk, Napoli, Benfica, Barcelona and Bayern Munich. And Man United in 1999 had to overcome Bayern Munich, Barcelona, Brondby, Inter Milan, Juventus and Bayern Munich (again). Winning the Champions League now is far more of an achievement than it ever was in the 1960s or 1970s, regardless of whether you are a domestic champion.

But the way the CL is currently set up you will have to play the historically glamourous names of European football if you get to the final. The UEFA coefficient ensures that the usual names from stronger UEFA leagues i.e. Germany, Spain, Italy and England all make the group stages which are then seeded to favour these same teams to get out of the group. And just because they are historically big names does not mean they are a particularly strong side; it's a bit like when supporters scan the Championship at the start of the season looking for teams they recognise and saying "this is a difficult league because it has Wolves, Sheffield Wed, Bolton, Boro, Birminghan, Wigan etc in it" ignoring any other facts appart from a name they recognise as having had past pedigree. Moving back to the CL, good enough to finish 3rd in their 3 horse-race of a domestic league and good enough to get out of the group stages seeded in their favour for sure...... but what else? What we do know from the old format is that a team is a true champion, the best their country had to offer, and they are still on a winning streak.

 

[BadFish]

But the way the CL is currently set up you will have to play the historically glamourous names of European football if you get to the final. The UEFA coefficient ensures that the usual names from stronger UEFA leagues i.e. Germany, Spain, Italy and England all make the group stages which are then seeded to favour these same teams to get out of the group. And just because they are historically big names does not mean they are a particularly strong side; it's a bit like when supporters scan the Championship at the start of the season looking for teams they recognise and saying "this is a difficult league because it has Wolves, Sheffield Wed, Bolton, Boro, Birminghan, Wigan etc in it" ignoring any other facts appart from a name they recognise as having had past pedigree. Moving back to the CL, good enough to finish 3rd in their 3 horse-race of a domestic league and good enough to get out of the group stages seeded in their favour for sure...... but what else? What we do know from the old format is that a team is a true champion, the best their country had to offer, and they are still on a winning streak.

Probably worth mentioning also that St Etienne and Mönchengladbach were two of the best sides in Europe in the late 70's. Infact Mönchengladbach would have had to beat Bayern to the German title to qualify,

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Probably worth mentioning also that St Etienne and Mönchengladbach were two of the best sides in Europe in the late 70's. Infact Mönchengladbach would have had to beat Bayern to the German title to qualify,

Very good point. And Bayern were no slouches in the 70s. Ajax were a rather good team back then as well As were Hamburg. None of these teams were also rans.

 

[The Large One]

The astonishing thing that I remember about Celtic winning the European Cup wasn't the birthplaces of the team, but the sheer brilliance of the performance on the day. Jock Stein deserves credit for that.

Indeed. Great performance.

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[BadFish]

Very good point. And Bayern were no slouches in the 70s. Ajax were a rather good team back then as well As were Hamburg. None of these teams were also rans.

Well they won their respective leagues, which meant that they would have had to beat the sides TCB mentioned to qualify. Even Club Brugge who he looks down his nose at would have had to beat a decent Anderlect team to the title the year before.