It's comments like that...that clearly show how pathetic our society has become. Every criminal now has a sob story of how hard done by they are, it's societies fault, I've got this or that condition that suddenly only appeared in the last 15 years, my mum doesn't love me, blah blah fvcking blah. Get in the real world mate....that attitudes like yours have created a disgusting mitigation by scum like her are no longer responsible for their actions and it would be a travesty to even think about punishing them. Go and ask the old lady she punched in the face or the old lady's family if they give a flying fvck about any of your 'bigger picture'. Bottom line the horrible little shit punched an old lady in the face for no reason other than wanting to get home and asking 2 scumbags refusing to pay their fare to stop causing the delay to the bus. Would you care about the 'bigger picture' if she punched your mother?
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How does this happen anywhere (let alone in Croydon)?
- Thread starter Colonel Angus
- Start date
It's comments like that...that clearly show how pathetic our society has become. Every criminal now has a sob story of how hard done by they are, it's societies fault, I've got this or that condition that suddenly only appeared in the last 15 years, my mum doesn't love me, blah blah fvcking blah. Get in the real world mate....that attitudes like yours have created a disgusting mitigation by scum like her are no longer responsible for their actions and it would be a travesty to even think about punishing them. Go and ask the old lady she punched in the face or the old lady's family if they give a flying fvck about any of your 'bigger picture'. Bottom line the horrible little shit punched an old lady in the face for no reason other than wanting to get home and asking 2 scumbags refusing to pay their fare to stop causing the delay to the bus. Would you care about the 'bigger picture' if she punched your mother?
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 35,316
it is exactly what you were saying - the standard tired responce that the behavour must be the symptom of some deeper problem. the problem is this isnt an entirely isolated incident, its part of living in some parts of the country, the only reason its news is the vitcim was an old lady. i understand why this situation occured, lack of any respect or fear of authority or the repurcusion of ones actions. we can of course attempt to address probelms youth have to struggle with, but the minute we assume its not their fault, we give them licence to behave as they see fit.
gregbrighton
New member
You just gotta love the "hang 'em, flog 'em and throw away the key" brigade. It's just as well these frightened and misguided people never usually get a sniff of power. If they did we would all be living in a fascistic society....
Why the hell should some scumbag enjoy a pathetic slap on the wrist punishment, probably a supervision order...Oooh they work don't they...get real!
Scum like that should be locked up....end of!
It's attitudes like yours that cause these problems. Far to worried about the offenders treatment than the victim arnt you. No wonder people have no fear of the police or facing proper justice because there's always the likes of you to pipe up about the punishment should not be harsh I case it hurts their feelings etc.
Like I said....if it was your mother she punched in the face, would you be so liberal
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
Where has anyone said, it's not her fault? To be given a referral order she has to plead guilty.
The youth offending team will look into all aspects of the case, and let the court know. The judge will then decide the punishment.
It's possible that the girl has been physically abused at home & only knows how to lash out with her fists. I wouldn't like to say until I knew more details, and we're not going to get that, because she's a youth.
I do believe that putting a 14 year old in detention with hardened youngsters of 17/18 in a YOI, is only going to make her worse.
FREDBINNEY
Banned
- Dec 11, 2009
- 317
Yes i would, and your attitude is the reason that they get away with this sort of crap.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 35,316
it should be pointed out that this happened in nice suburban streets. our offenders are as likely going home to a nice semi-detached than deprived sink estate, much as we like to talk down Croydon. they boarded the bus without paying, driver refused to go, everyone got off except the old lady who wanted to get home, when she spoke up they hit her.
FREDBINNEY
Banned
- Dec 11, 2009
- 317
That shes never known an ounce of discipline in her life would be the reason , and i can also guarantee that had the old girl been black it wouldnt have happened.
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
U
Yes, some supervision orders do work. Part of a supervision order is reparation. The offender has to face the victim, & hear what effect it has had on them. The victim is asked if they want that. Every case is different.
I'm not more concerned with the offender than the victim, but at 14, there's still a chance, she could grow up better.
Don't bring my mother into this debate as you know nothing about me or my family.
Why the hell should some scumbag enjoy a pathetic slap on the wrist punishment, probably a supervision order...Oooh they work don't they...get real!
Scum like that should be locked up....end of!
It's attitudes like yours that cause these problems. Far to worried about the offenders treatment than the victim arnt you. No wonder people have no fear of the police or facing proper justice because there's always the likes of you to pipe up about the punishment should not be harsh I case it hurts their feelings etc.
Like I said....if it was your mother she punched in the face, would you be so liberal
Yes, some supervision orders do work. Part of a supervision order is reparation. The offender has to face the victim, & hear what effect it has had on them. The victim is asked if they want that. Every case is different.
I'm not more concerned with the offender than the victim, but at 14, there's still a chance, she could grow up better.
Don't bring my mother into this debate as you know nothing about me or my family.
FREDBINNEY
Banned
- Dec 11, 2009
- 317
i doubt it, a lot of kids from croydon . norwood etc get sent to school in coulsdon.
You really are deluded mate if you think that. Oh well never mind the effect on the victim and her family eh?
So I'll ask the question again. Would you be so liberal with your punishment if she punched your mother in the face for no reason?
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
Perhaps we should ship them off to Australia or hang them like we used to.
beorhthelm
A. Virgo, Football Genius
- Jul 21, 2003
- 35,316
hanging is a bit strong, but Australia does have a lot of space... or rather than reach for the hyperbole we could consider that we've gone rather soft on dealing with youth and petty offences.
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
It's not a petty offence, and we don't know if she has previous. All of that would be taken into consideration. It's not as simple as lock them up.
Thunder Bolt
Silly old bat
What excuses have I made? I don't know her history.
Megazone
On his last warning
Not harsh enough. I'd make them watch '2001 a space odyssey' once a day for a week.
Justice
Dangerous Idiot
Cage
Your continuous argument of some sort of 'bigger picture' and now 'not knowing her history'. What you don't seem to get about my point is that the victim in this case has no bearing on her background or history or your 'bigger picture'!!!! So why should it be an excuse for her behaviour? And your response of me knowing nothing of your family or mother is again something my argument is absolutely nothing to do with it and you know it. I've clearly asked if you would feel the same about the offender if it were your mother. Don't now jump on some I'm offended band wagon, it's a perfectly reasonable question to ask in a debate like this!
The reach I was making is that this child's 'sob story' may well be considerably worse than 'my mother doesn't love me'.
If not this case I guarantee there have been previous identical cases where as the news and identity of the child broke, extended family, neighbours, teachers, professionals, etc someone has said 'I'm not surprised, what with all they go through'.
That's the point I'm getting at, while all along saying this child needs a fitting and just punishment:-
What happened to make a 14 year old child need to be locked?
It is and always will be her fault, and as I said, for that she needs to be "properly dealt with".
Locking this child up and dealing with her isn't going to protect our mothers.
This pensioner was assaulted, incredibly sadly previous pensioners have been assaulted by children, what is actually happening to stop future pensioners being assaulted?
Send these kids to borstal.
Teach them discipline.
Teach them respect.
Make them scared.
What if the situation they have been removed from, and will be going back to, is 100 times scarier than borstal.
We all know that isn't the answer and I don't know what the answer is.
But being one of the world's richest countries it can't be:-
'wait till they're a danger to everyone then lock them up'.