Fox hunting

[Creaky]

Vile and cruel youde have to be a purely evil c### to want it legalised

I presume that comment is based on an assumption that there is a specific law that bans fox hunting - there isn't. If there were then I would be amongst those that supported such a law.

The Hunting Act takes no account of the purpose a particular activity but rather simply bans the hunting of wild mammals with more than two dogs - irrespective of whether such a hunt is for some form of perverse enjoyment or actually to keep the population of a particular pest under control.

 

[Harry H]

Are cats killing for fun or just being instinctive?

 

[lawros left foot]

The vast majority of those that used to take part in hunts and still regularly now partake in drag hunts are not from the 'gentried class' although it is fair to say that they do organise many of the hunts.

Yes, all the hunts these days are multi ethnic, and full of benefit claimants. Come on , how much does a hunting horse cost to buy, and stable for a year, and that is without the hunts fees, but this is all a smoke screen, it is an unnecessarally cruel and barbaric pastime

 

[dazzer6666]

No that cannot be a reasoned view, you are basing your selection of the pursuit on class prejudice, that cannot be correct.

For me the scale of fox hunting in its impact on the foxes population is likely to be negligible, has anyone actually ever seen one, I haven't in the 50 years in living in Sussex.

Do I find the pursuit proportionate in its aims/cruelty to the need for the pursuit to be continued, then for me probably not.

But it cannot be lost on you that actually why should we perhaps go out and catch a fish and bash its head in the hope of winning a prize trophy sourced from some child labour camp in China, for £10.99.

So if I subscribe to the first point of outlawing fox hunting that in the grand scale of foxes being killed humanly or otherwise, is it proportionate when other pursuits are ignored.

Not seen a fox in Sussex ?? Admittedly I spend a fair amount of time running the local roads and paths, but there are dozens about, including urban ones around where I live. Seeing them is at least a weekly occurrence if not more. The impact on population of hunting them will be lower now as so many have become urbanised and I don't see the Tally Ho brigade charging down the High Street...

As for fishing, in my experience fish are either killed and eaten, or returned alive. The latter is a whole separate 'do they feel pain' debate......

 

[lawros left foot]

No that cannot be a reasoned view, you are basing your selection of the pursuit on class prejudice, that cannot be correct.

For me the scale of fox hunting in its impact on the foxes population is likely to be negligible, has anyone actually ever seen one, I haven't in the 50 years in living in Sussex.

Do I find the pursuit proportionate in its aims/cruelty to the need for the pursuit to be continued, then for me probably not.

But it cannot be lost on you that actually why should we perhaps go out and catch a fish and bash its head in the hope of winning a prize trophy sourced from some child labour camp in China, for £10.99.

So if I subscribe to the first point of outlawing fox hunting that in the grand scale of foxes being killed humanly or otherwise, is it proportionate when other pursuits are ignored.

It would be point in having a go at afro Caribbean huntsmen, or benefit claiming single mothers who hu t, because there arent that many. My point is the fact remains that the vast majority of huntsmen, are white and upper middle clas/upper class, because it is a ery expensive pastime. Just because they are our betters, , shouldn't excuse them from criticism

 

[dazzer6666]

It would be point in having a go at afro Caribbean huntsmen, or benefit claiming single mothers who hu t, because there arent that many. My point is the fact remains that the vast majority of huntsmen, are white and upper middle clas/upper class, because it is a ery expensive pastime. Just because they are our betters, , shouldn't excuse them from criticism

But they're not, they really aren't. The leaders usually are (those you will always see in the photos in their red jackets) but not the 'followers'. Typically people from farming families and farm workers and connected individuals - for example 'young farmers' members (basically a social/drinking club for country kids).

 

[BigGully]

Not seen a fox in Sussex ?? Admittedly I spend a fair amount of time running the local roads and paths, but there are dozens about, including urban ones around where I live. Seeing them is at least a weekly occurrence if not more. The impact on population of hunting them will be lower now as so many have become urbanised and I don't see the Tally Ho brigade charging down the High Street...

As for fishing, in my experience fish are either killed and eaten, or returned alive. The latter is a whole separate 'do they feel pain' debate......

No I didnt mean Foxes I meant Huntsmen, my point being if you wish to just ban Fox Hunting then to me its seems driven by prejudice if other pursuits hobbies are not then challenged.

 

[Guerrero]

Personally I wouldn't get any pleasure in seeing a living creature ripped apart by other creatures. Not really my idea of fun.

 

[Seagull kimchi]

Can't we all agree that those who derive pleasure from the act of killing animals in this age of supermarkets and available food are clearly devoid of compassion at a base level. Would you bet they would be more compassionate to other human beings than those who spend their time campaigning for better conditions for animals?

I wouldn't.

 

[BigGully]

It would be point in having a go at afro Caribbean huntsmen, or benefit claiming single mothers who hu t, because there arent that many. My point is the fact remains that the vast majority of huntsmen, are white and upper middle clas/upper class, because it is a ery expensive pastime. Just because they are our betters, , shouldn't excuse them from criticism

But you prove my point, you seem to care more about your prejudice of those participating in the hunt rather than trying to determine the impact, whether that be on numbers or cruelty to the foxes.

 

[lawros left foot]

Every huntsman that I have known, I grew up in Ashington so it was a fair few, has been of the social class I mentioned, the hunt followers, those with the terriers and spades to dig out the foxes when they've gone to ground, were mainly farm workers etc. I remember that a documentary made a few years ago by the beeb, made a big thing of a minerwho rode too hounds somewhere up north , and it cost him all his money, the point being, how unusual for a working class bloke to actually ride In a hunt

 

[CheeseRolls]

My father was a dairy herdsman for forty years, , I don't think he would have left young calfs crying endlessly of starvation, you really don't know much about the dairy farming business do you?

I think it is a question of what happens to those born without udders LLF.

I don't support or condone fox hunting, but understand perfectly well, what Cameron is doing here and it is just another attempt to prevent the exodus of voters to UKIP and it makes perfect sense.

The number of voters, who would see their opposition to fox hunting as a primary decision point for voting in a general election is miniscule (especially as this right has already been curtailed), the number of those who are potentially Tory voters is even smaller. On the other hand this might just shore up a couple of marginal seats, so whatever the rest of us think is largely irrelevant at this point.

 

[lawros left foot]

No I didnt mean Foxes I meant Huntsmen, my point being if you wish to just ban Fox Hunting then to me its seems driven by prejudice if other pursuits hobbies are not then challenged.

They have banned similar bloodsports, bear baiting, cock fighting, dog fighting and badger baiting none of which cause any controversy in this day and age

 

[Creaky]

Every huntsman that I have known, I grew up in Ashington so it was a fair few, has been of the social class I mentioned, the hunt followers, those with the terriers and spades to dig out the foxes when they've gone to ground, were mainly farm workers etc. I remember that a documentary made a few years ago by the beeb, made a big thing of a minerwho rode too hounds somewhere up north , and it cost him all his money, the point being, how unusual for a working class bloke to actually ride In a hunt

Are the hunt followers any less culpable when it comes tofox hunting than those who ride the horses? - they are every much a part of any hunt as those in red jackets!

The ones in charge of the dogs are very much a part of the hunt and let's face it are the ones who provide the tools which carry out the 'ripping of foxes to pieces' that many, (including myself), complain of - in many ways they are far more culpable for not only have they chosen to take part in the pursuit but are actually paid for it!

 

[lawros left foot]

Are the hunt followers any less culpable when it comes tofox hunting than those who ride the horses? - they are every much a part of any hunt as those in red jackets!

The ones in charge of the dogs are very much a part of the hunt and let's face it are the ones who provide the tools which carry out the 'ripping of foxes to pieces' that many, (including myself), complain of - in many ways they are far more culpable for not only have they chosen to take part in the pursuit but are actually paid for it![/QUOT
Totally agree, hunting know is big business with over 100 000people involved in the hunts, either directly employed, or farriers etc . I personally have nothing against the drag hunts an the sight of a hunt with the hunting pink jackets etc is very iconic of a bygone day,but the act of using dogs to rip apart foxes Iis just too barbaric for me

 

[CheeseRolls]

Personally I always find it a bit magical to see a fox at close quarters, especially a bold one.

Find it odd there's also an annual badger cull. The only badger I ever saw except for on TV was lying dead at the side of a road, tragic victim of a badger-vehicle collision. Nowhere near Falmer, I hasten to add.

Badgers are nocturnal. Going back a few years me and the missus were staggering back to my parents house in Saltdean, after a session in Rottingdean and we ended up sitting on the kerb, watching the badgers as they scurried in and out of the gardens, in Lustrells Crescent checking for any scraps in the dustbins. There was also a house up Coombe Rise that had a sett in the back garden. The argument in favour of badger culling on economic grounds has completely fallen apart and why any sane person would think it appropriate to continue defeats me.

 

[lawros left foot]

Badgers are nocturnal. Going back a few years me and the missus were staggering back to my parents house in Saltdean, after a session in Rottingdean and we ended up sitting on the kerb, watching the badgers as they scurried in and out of the gardens, in Lustrells Crescent checking for any scraps in the dustbins. There was also a house up Coombe Rise that had a sett in the back garden. The argument in favour of badger culling on economic grounds has completely fallen apart and why any sane person would think it appropriate to continue defeats me.

My father, , mentioned in a previous post, maintained only bad dairymen had cows who caught bovineTB.

 

[Motogull]

We do need to do something to control the Fox population. Whether it's just my imagination or it is a fact but I see so many foxes around nowadays and they seem to be getting bolder and bolder.

Loads of foxes get shot overnight. I know someone who got paid £5 for every fox tail he left as proof of death. Can't believe that was limited to a single farm in the UK.

The dogs still have to be trained. Not sure if 'cubbing' is now still going on. Horrible thing to do.

The whole wanting hunting back as it was back seems based purely upon a desire to see the horrific death. Absolutely no need for it. The true reason for the hunt is surely a chance to dress up and enjoy a mass ride out. Why does that need to involve an animal being ripped up?

 

[T.G]

The idea of an animal being ripped apart by a pack of dogs is awful but.....

We do need to do something to control the Fox population. Whether it's just my imagination or it is a fact but I see so many foxes around nowadays and they seem to be getting bolder and bolder.

I'd like a cull on Seagulls as well.

I'm a complete B*****d really aren't I.

Not a Barsteward just naive! They don't control populations by ripping a defenceless fox apart. They often take foxes they have caught and let them go where they intend to hunt. This insures they have a fox to kill and the animal is disorientated and cannot escape. C@£Ts

 

[Mutts Nuts]

. It's pretty simpleHow about supporting the move to ban all forms of needless animal cruelty, if and you need to cull a wild animal - do it humanely.

How about supporting the move to ban all forms of needless animal cruelty

Like battery farming you mean

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpbtBgLfl90 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfVBsTBNsg0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAQDF_8f8Bw