[Football] Dunk to Chelsea?

[Kalimantan Gull]

This is ridiculous. I love Lewis but Lawro was starting every game for the best team in the world at the time.
When Lewis has won a bunch of trophies at Liverpool, Real or Barca come back to us

But we're not arguing who is Liverpool's best player of all time, but who is Brighton's. If Lewis Dunk was around in 1980 he would have dominated all around him. Bet he could mix it on an 80's pitch too.

 

[GT49er]

And you're right.

I know........

It would probably be more like 12 or 13-0. It would be laughable.

.....and that suggestion is beyond laughable; it's plain ridiculous.

 

[Questions]

Ward was nothing special when it came to the top level. Vicente barely played for us nd according to Lawrenson he never played for us too.

Wardy only had the one full season in the top flight and scored 16 times in the league. I’m not sure of his cup goals.

That’s still a record isn’t it ?

 

[Kosh]

I don't need to change your mind, nor will I try to. You are arguing a completely different point to the post of mine that you originally responded to.

No i’m bloody not, you sanctimonious patronising mojo subscribing Bowie disciple... you said: it would be 10-0, they’d be light-years quicker, and more skilful. I’m saying, rather obviously, that the comparison would be flawed unless you level things up one way or another. If you take the basic skill set of the 80s team they are easily the match of Jordan (bless) Henderson et al. The new breed are faster and stronger, but as skilled as their 80s counterparts.

So, to address your original sweeping generalisation re a result: I fail to agree, especially if the players were matched up in the 80s or now.

I can read, and the post I responded to... well it didn’t have a complex subtext, it was a reactionary post and it’s wrong on every level.

 

[Mellotron]

No i’m bloody not, you sanctimonious patronising mojo subscribing Bowie disciple... you said: it would be 10-0, they’d be light-years quicker, and more skilful. I’m saying, rather obviously, that the comparison would be flawed unless you level things up one way or another. If you take the basic skill set of the 80s team they are easily the match of Jordan (bless) Henderson et al. The new breed are faster and stronger, but as skilled as their 80s counterparts.

So, to address your original sweeping generalisation re a result: I fail to agree, especially if the players were matched up in the 80s or now.

I can read, and the post I responded to... well it didn’t have a complex subtext, it was a reactionary post and it’s wrong on every level.

But you keep trying to change the parameters to suit your argument. I'm not going along with it.

It wasn't wrong in my opinion, it is in yours. They would absolutely BATTER them, if played today. It would be embarrassing.

 

[Mellotron]

I know........


.....and that suggestion is beyond laughable; it's plain ridiculous.

It's really not. Imagine Sadio Mane's pace and skill against 1980s defending and (lack of) fitness. You'd be wanting to stop the fight in the second round. He wouldn't even have to run at full speed.

 

[Mellotron]

[yt]2_uyTIUOrps[/yt]

The bang average Glen Johnson, everyone.

Compared this to Pele's best 5 goals ever. There really isn't much in it. That's how ludicrous this argument is.

 

[Kosh]

But you keep trying to change the parameters to suit your argument. I'm not going along with it.

It wasn't wrong in my opinion, it is in yours. They would absolutely BATTER them, if played today. It would be embarrassing.

I fail to see the significance of your so called parameters vs mine. They’re one in the same. You’re suggesting that if peak era Liverpool existed today they’d be as unfit as they were in the 80s (hmmmmm) why would this be the case? They’d be as fit as today’s other top level players surely? So, if they lined up in this fantasy game, they’d be as quick and built as the players they were against... if we take this current ‘pool team back to the 80s and with my parameters make them as unfit (your allusion, not mine) then surely it’d be close... very close. Indeed I think the old boys would triumph. No mercenaries in that team, oh no.

You can’t take the comparison in simple terms, as the old team would be as fit as the current crop if they met today. The 10-0 stuff, is therefore laughable. You have to see this, surely? Okay if the old crop turned up (as they were) and tried to run with the current players then obviously they’d be out paced etc. And take a battering. However, that comparison is simply biased and unfair. I stand by the fact that any match up today (between two teams training with the same methods) would be a close run thing.

10-0 my ass.

 

[Kosh]

It's really not. Imagine Sadio Mane's pace and skill against 1980s defending and (lack of) fitness. You'd be wanting to stop the fight in the second round. He wouldn't even have to run at full speed.

Again 80s Mane would be as slow or as quick as those around him - times and athletics in the game have indeed changed, but claiming 80s Mane would be the same as 2020s Mane is, again, laughable. It’s school boy stuff, he’d be a God back then, yet 2020s Lawrenson would be a beast.

 

[dazzer6666]

My post was assuming it would be on today's pitches.

And you're right.

It would probably be more like 12 or 13-0. It would be laughable.

My favourite example of this is always Glen Johnson. Absolutely mediocre modern footballer, yet has a highlights reel that if he was playing in the 60s he'd be seen as one of the best players of all time.

Depends on what levelling-up criteria are used really. Pitches would make a big difference, current vs 80s fitness levels (and recovery protocols) are also markedly different. One positive aspect from the earlier years for me would perhaps be the more natural talent that flourished, rather than players who have been coached and drilled to extreme levels - maybe a Kenny Dalglish type example who'd still look a genius in today's game ?? It's impossible to compare directly though

 

[GT49er]

You can’t take the comparison in simple terms, as the old team would be as fit as the current crop if they met today. The 10-0 stuff, is therefore laughable. You have to see this, surely? Okay if the old crop turned up (as they were) and tried to run with the current players then obviously they’d be out paced etc. And take a battering. However, that comparison is simply biased and unfair. I stand by the fact that any match up today (between two teams training with the same methods) would be a close run thing.

10-0 my ass.

Again 80s Mane would be as slow or as quick as those around him - times and athletics in the game have indeed changed, but claiming 80s Mane would be the same as 2020s Mane is, again, laughable. It’s school boy stuff, he’d be a God back then, yet 2020s Lawrenson would be a beast.

You're wasting your breath - he won't accept any of it. It's almost like trying to argue with BG...................

 

[Kosh]

You're wasting your breath - he won't accept any of it. It's almost like trying to argue with BG...................

Ha! I know.

Still; I can’t abide erroneous generalisations based on questionable parameters... oh well

 

[Spiros]

It's really not. Imagine Sadio Mane's pace and skill against 1980s defending and (lack of) fitness. You'd be wanting to stop the fight in the second round. He wouldn't even have to run at full speed.

Imagine Sadio Mane, Mo Salah and Roberto Firmino against 80s defending with 80s refereeing / rule interpretations. They would all be on the receiving end of early 'reducers' which would slow them down and make them less keen to get the ball. When you look back at some of the assaults that passed as tackles it's amazing that any skilful players thrived at all

 

[schmunk]

Imagine Sadio Mane, Mo Salah and Roberto Firmino against 80s defending with 80s refereeing / rule interpretations. They would all be on the receiving end of early 'reducers' which would slow them down and make them less keen to get the ball. When you look back at some of the assaults that passed as tackles it's amazing that any skilful players thrived at all

...and in the return leg the 80s players play to 2020 rules and are down to 8 men within the first 10 minutes...

I'm in camp Mellotron - even equalising for pace and fitness, modern footballers are better scouted, better drilled and better tactically than all before them. In the same vein I'd expect a 'normalised' Hamilton to beat Fangio every time.

 

[dazzer6666]

Imagine Sadio Mane, Mo Salah and Roberto Firmino against 80s defending with 80s refereeing / rule interpretations. They would all be on the receiving end of early 'reducers' which would slow them down and make them less keen to get the ball. When you look back at some of the assaults that passed as tackles it's amazing that any skilful players thrived at all

Tommy Smith would have at least let Mane know where he was...............

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

I fail to see the significance of your so called parameters vs mine. They’re one in the same. You’re suggesting that if peak era Liverpool existed today they’d be as unfit as they were in the 80s (hmmmmm) why would this be the case? They’d be as fit as today’s other top level players surely? So, if they lined up in this fantasy game, they’d be as quick and built as the players they were against... if we take this current ‘pool team back to the 80s and with my parameters make them as unfit (your allusion, not mine) then surely it’d be close... very close. Indeed I think the old boys would triumph. No mercenaries in that team, oh no.

You can’t take the comparison in simple terms, as the old team would be as fit as the current crop if they met today. The 10-0 stuff, is therefore laughable. You have to see this, surely? Okay if the old crop turned up (as they were) and tried to run with the current players then obviously they’d be out paced etc. And take a battering. However, that comparison is simply biased and unfair. I stand by the fact that any match up today (between two teams training with the same methods) would be a close run thing.

10-0 my ass.

Even taking fitness out of it (and thats the basis of the 10-0 comment), tactics, training methods, player development, player psychology and so on have all improved as well. Improvement simply happens over time in all walks of life. So maybe the raw 8-year old players would be the same; but after the academies and clubs have turned them into elite level players, the modern team would be much better than the 80's team. Thats my opinion, anyhow.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

...and in the return leg the 80s players play to 2020 rules and are down to 8 men within the first 10 minutes....

Blah, Blah, Blah....

Charles Charlie Charles knows all about this bullshite talk..

 

[GT49er]

Tommy Smith would have at least let Mane know where he was...............

.....and that would result in three and a half turns, with pike, and simultaneous face-clutching.............



.....only in this case it really would hurt!

 

[Horses Arse]

Even taking fitness out of it (and thats the basis of the 10-0 comment), tactics, training methods, player development, player psychology and so on have all improved as well. Improvement simply happens over time in all walks of life. So maybe the raw 8-year old players would be the same; but after the academies and clubs have turned them into elite level players, the modern team would be much better than the 80's team. Thats my opinion, anyhow.

hmm. It's a tricky one. I'm on the fence currently.

Would supporters be able to bring bottle tops into this match? Maybe the decider for me

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

hmm. It's a tricky one. I'm on the fence currently.

Would supporters be able to bring bottle tops into this match? Maybe the decider for me

No, but you can bring in an Umbrella, a transistor radio, a ham,cheese and pickle doorstop sandwich, a texan bar or curly wurly, a papercosh (Millwall Brick, a shuriken, stanley blades....

Oh don't forget to take your steel toe cap boots off and leave them with the Constable at the turnstyle......