[Politics] Brexit

[pastafarian]

Think yourself lucky that he just leaves it at not reading what's in your posts. In the past, he's actually edited my posts and then quoted his edited versions to try and support his argument

(To tell the truth, his posts are such an utter irrelevance now, I can't even be arsed to check)

The rest of your post was irrelevant nonsense, it was not included because it was irrelevant, the wording was not edited.
I havnt edited the wording in someones post like you did previously
Try and be honest for once

 

[Simster]

It splits the Leave option when you have it versus remain, because you dont want to believe it actually does is an opinion you have convinced yourself is true

READ his fcking post, you clown.

Sure, he advocates two leave options and a remain but then takes the top two for a run off. That actually leaves the possibility of remain being off the table come a second (third) round, but not Brexit. It is a nod to the fact that leave won that he suggested this FFS.

Only a zealous leaver who refuses to accept people's opinions might have changed could argue what you're arguing, it is absolutely laughable.

 

[Bold Seagull]

No one's throwing their toys out of the pram it must be pretty obvious to even people like you that the Democratic vote to Leave the EU is being blatantly ignored for personal agendas from MP's that want to stall the process and in the worse case scenario over turn it, if you think that's acceptable well i have no hope for you
Regards
DF

I'll explain where I am then.

1. Cameron should have never called a referendum unless he had a sizeable majority in the commons (our Sovereign Parliament remember). The outcome of the referendum was never going to be enacted successfully by a government without it's own substantial majority. However he ploughed ahead anyway, then promptly resigned. May also knew and realised this hence went to the polls in 2017, in which their majority reduced.

2. These aren't personal agendas in all cases, Labour went to the polls on a soft Brexit manifesto. May went to the polls on a harder vision that she would negotiate. Greens, SNP and Libs all went to the polls on a manifesto of Remain. These aren't agendas, these were policies the public voted on when it elected it's MPs.

3. You cannot make huge constitutional changes without either i) a large majority or ii) cross party concession and agreement. That is how Parliament has always worked. The vote to Leave is not being ignored, the issue of HOW to leave is simply not being agreed - that is democracy like it or not.

4. If you cannot accept that a referendum result has to be enacted by consensus in Parliament, then I have no hope for you. If you thought it was as simple as saying I voted to leave therefore leave, then you are simply confirming you don't have any understanding of what is at stake.

5. In conclusion, the Tories effectively for 3 years ignoring their small parliamentary majority, ignoring their own rebels and party splits, have ploughed on as if they have a 100+ seat majority in the commons anyway as if they were somehow going to magic this through, rather than seek consensus at an early stage. Who killed the only Brexit deal we have to date? The very Tories who have now grabbed power. If you feel you have been let down, perhaps take a look at the government front benches. They didn't have their whip removed when they voted against the government...

 

[lawros left foot]

The first duty of a member of Parliament is to do what he thinks in his faithful and disinterested judgement is right and necessary for the honour and safety of Great Britain. His second duty is to his constituents, of whom he is the representative but not the delegate. Burke's famous declaration on this subject is well known. It is only in the third place that his duty to party organization or programme takes rank. All these three loyalties should be observed, but there is no doubt of the order in which they stand under any healthy manifestation of democracy.

Written by a bloke who knew a bit about Parliamentary democracy.

 

[WATFORD zero]

It splits the Leave option when you have it versus remain, because you dont want to believe it actually does is an opinion you have convinced yourself is true

Are those words actually in the right order ?

I realise my last reply may have been somewhat long, complicated and hard to understand, verbose even, so to summarise

READ his fcking post, you clown.

 

[Igzilla]

The first duty of a member of Parliament is to do what he thinks in his faithful and disinterested judgement is right and necessary for the honour and safety of Great Britain. His second duty is to his constituents, of whom he is the representative but not the delegate. Burke's famous declaration on this subject is well known. It is only in the third place that his duty to party organization or programme takes rank. All these three loyalties should be observed, but there is no doubt of the order in which they stand under any healthy manifestation of democracy.

Written by a bloke who knew a bit about Parliamentary democracy.

Careful now - sounds like an undemocratic loon, surely??

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

https://www.brittanyferriesfreight.co.uk/ferry-routes/ireland/roscoff-cork

Roscoff to Cork is a 13 hour crossing, with only 2 sailings per week.

Cheers!

Perhaps Boris is right about the rish border, then. Let's have it open (apart from big lorries and trains, and let's face it there are precious few massive cross boarder roads that can accomodate big lorries over there) and see what happens.... Brexit? Doddle!

 

[pastafarian]

[MENTION=21401]pastafarian[/MENTION] can I have your input on this please.

I'm asking as you and [MENTION=396]WATFORD zero[/MENTION] in particular are frequently banging on about tariffs WTO and the such like that is way way above my comfort level.

It started way back on page #2425, this morning with this from [MENTION=17322]Lenny Rider[/MENTION]:-

Not a huge fan of his but good point from Farage on BBC Breakfast, the project fear lot talk of huge fuel shortages at the petrol pumps after a No Deal Brexit, but none of that fuel comes from the EU, so how will there be shortages?

As I've already said where it not for Farrage's name I may well have taken that at face value, instead I found this:-

There are six major petroleum refineries in the UK, supporting around 120,000 jobs directly and contributing about £8.6bn to the economy.

The concern, which is shared by both the Scottish and Welsh governments, relates to the UK government's decision not to apply tariffs - taxes on trade - to imports of petrol in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

The decision was made to lessen the inflationary impact on prices in the event of a no-deal Brexit.

The current tariff on fuel imports from non-EU countries is 4.7%.

However, under World Trade Organization (WTO) rules, a zero tariff rate must apply to petrol imports from all countries, opening up the UK to Russian fuel imports.

At the same time, the EU has said it will apply a tariff, under WTO rules, of 4.7% to UK exports, making the trade with, for example, Ireland "uneconomical", according to insiders.


Should you chose to help me see the positives in this situation, I should say the investigating continued into a few other articles dispelling some other 'facts' along the way.

What dont you understand?
If we ourselves set our import rate for fuel at 0%, all fuel being imported into the UK will be at 0%
Currently imports that arrive from outside the EU are at 4.7% because we are in a customs union.
Outside of being in the customs union if we exported fuel to the EU it would subject to a 4.7% tariff......i will take it at face value 4.7% being quoted is the correct figure

 

[pastafarian]

Are those words actually in the right order ?

I realise my last reply may have been somewhat long, complicated and hard to understand, verbose even, so to summarise

READ his fcking post, you clown.

Read mine you berk, something isnt true because you simply want it to be

 

[Ernest]

Plus the Lib Dems already have a candidate selected for Liverpool Wavertree at the next election, though with a 80% Labour vote share I doubt she'll be standing there again.

I bet the Lib Dem prospective candidates in seats who will be booted out for her , Chuckle, Lee and any others will be well pleased

 

[Mellotron]

Why did you want such a barbaric thing? How odd.

Says man who supports No Deal Brexit

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

I knew [MENTION=22389]bashlsdir[/MENTION] wouldn't. Mind you, I knew [MENTION=18559]dingodan[/MENTION] wouldn't either.

It's funny, bashlsdir loves to take great offence if you take a view on his limited will/ability to answer questions coherently, but when presented with real debate, he runs away. Absolutely pathetic.

As for dingodan, well he acts like he's above all that analysis nonsense. He's a conspirasist who doesn't need to bother with actual in-depth reasoning. It's far too much like pointless hard work I'm sure.

Including misreading one of my posts as me being rude about his parents (WTAF). I have the other fella on ignore.

One of the things that redeems people in conflict is the ability to back off rather than carry on like John Cleese as the (eventually) limbless knight in Holy Grail.

 

[pastafarian]

READ his fcking post, you clown.

Sure, he advocates two leave options and a remain but then takes the top two for a run off. That actually leaves the possibility of remain being off the table come a second (third) round, but not Brexit. It is a nod to the fact that leave won that he suggested this FFS.

Only a zealous leaver who refuses to accept people's opinions might have changed could argue what you're arguing, it is absolutely laughable.

If you want to nod that Leave has already won Remain does not need to be included in a ballot at all. We have already voted NOT to remain.
You can skip straight to question two and ask how should we leave.

 

[lawros left foot]

If you want to nod that Leave has already won Remain does not need to be included in a ballot at all. We have already voted NOT to remain.
You can skip straight to question two and ask how should we leave.

In 1975 we voted to remain, and by a much bigger majority.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Says man who supports No Deal Brexit

Well I never, here's one. The connection between fox hunting and No Deal? Love to hear this one.........

 

[Mellotron]

Well I never, here's one. The connection between fox hunting and No Deal? Love to hear this one.........

Unsurprisingly, you misunderstood my point.

You seem to be against barbarism, yet are fine with a course of action that will endanger lives.

 

[ManOfSussex]

I bet the Lib Dem prospective candidates in seats who will be booted out for her , Chuckle, Lee and any others will be well pleased

I read Umunna jumped on-board first in the hope he'd be rewarded with Twickenham, as Cable is standing down, or Richmond Park to take on Zac Goldsmith. I guess some of them will fight their current seats for The Lib Dems, but not the likes of Berger with the majorities they'd be facing.

 

[WATFORD zero]

What dont you understand?
If we ourselves set our import rate for fuel at 0%, all fuel being imported into the UK will be at 0%
Currently imports that arrive from outside the EU are at 4.7% because we are in a customs union.
Outside of being in the customs union if we exported fuel to the EU it would subject to a 4.7% tariff......i will take it at face value 4.7% being quoted is the correct figure

So, in summary, Russia under 'no deal' can export fuel to Britain at zero import rate instead of the 4.7% they currently pay.

Any Fuel that Britain exports to the EU after 'no deal' will be subject to an import rate of 4.7% instead of the zero import rate we currently pay.

I can't see any issues with that, but apparently the British fuel industry thinks differently

 

[Stat Brother]

What dont you understand?
If we ourselves set our import rate for fuel at 0%, all fuel being imported into the UK will be at 0%
Currently imports that arrive from outside the EU are at 4.7% because we are in a customs union.
Outside of being in the customs union if we exported fuel to the EU it would subject to a 4.7% tariff......i will take it at face value 4.7% being quoted is the correct figure

Yes those are the facts of a No Deal withdrawal on one industry.

I'm more curious as to your opinion on such a deal, specifically if there's a plus side to such an arrangement.
A plus side to an industry that directly employs 120.000 people and generates £8.7bn.

.

 

[Is it PotG?]

Unsurprisingly, you misunderstood my point.

You seem to be against barbarism, yet are fine with a course of action that will endanger lives.

Absolutely ridiculous comment. Explains a lot.