[Politics] Brexit

[Baldseagull]

Anyone who claims election irregularities had any, let alone a decisive impact on the result without a shred of evidence is just looking for an excuse to undermine a result they don't like .. see undemocratic loons. Yeah, it's mainly about definitions ....

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/03/labours-pockets-of-anti-semitism-the-evidence/

I just watched the documantary The Great Hack on Netflix, I recommend it to you to watch.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Personally I can't recall The Times of London referencing articles from the Guido Fawkes oddballs site, but then I do refuse to read Melanie Phillips and Quentin Letts because they're ****s, so I may have missed it.

I wonder if you and that Irish alcoholic bloke who runs that site actually take their antisemitism stance to the real heart of the problem in modern Britain - pubs on a Sunday afternoon when Chelsea are playing Tottenham and explain to pub going Chelsea fans that calling Harry Kane a '****ing big nosed Jewish ****' is utterly abhorrent and totally wrong or do you and him prefer to do it online for the sole purpose of hysterically attacking the Labour Party? For some reason I suspect it's just the latter.

Ironic that you bring up antisemitism, that was the last time The Times of London referenced the Guido Fawkes site...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/bbc-under-fire-over-antisemitic-imam-qnrd7635l

... obviously, you missed it as it highlighted yet another Labour party member's anti-Semitic views. Just hysterical smears no doubt.

There are numerous other mentions, a few examples ...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tory-leadership-candidates-threaten-bbc-debate-boycott-0mxqglhnc

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...tacks-the-lobbys-trade-in-favours-k2rj695ll0d

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/request-for-footage-of-mps-alleged-groping-qw7dm9rrs

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/request-for-footage-of-mps-alleged-groping-qw7dm9rrs

.... none involving Melanie Phillips or Quentin Letts.

On the topic of antisemitism, not sure the wider Jewish community would agree that the real heart of the problem is in pubs on a Sunday, many of their community leaders seem to think having a potential governing party incapable of tackling numerous cases of antisemitism within its ranks could be rather problematic. But no surprise that someone intending to vote them into government and posts dozens, hundreds of critical comments about toffs, Tories, public school types but to my memory has not made one critical comment about Labours antisemitism issues seeks to downplay Labours problems.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Ironic that you bring up antisemitism, that was the last time The Times of London referenced the Guido Fawkes site...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/bbc-under-fire-over-antisemitic-imam-qnrd7635l

... obviously, you missed it as it highlighted yet another Labour party member's anti-Semitic views. Just hysterical smears no doubt.

There are numerous other mentions, a few examples ...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tory-leadership-candidates-threaten-bbc-debate-boycott-0mxqglhnc

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...tacks-the-lobbys-trade-in-favours-k2rj695ll0d

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/request-for-footage-of-mps-alleged-groping-qw7dm9rrs

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/request-for-footage-of-mps-alleged-groping-qw7dm9rrs

.... none involving Melanie Phillips or Quentin Letts.

On the topic of antisemitism, not sure the wider Jewish community would agree that the real heart of the problem is in pubs on a Sunday, many of their community leaders seem to think having a potential governing party incapable of tackling numerous cases of antisemitism within its ranks could be rather problematic. But no surprise that someone intending to vote them into government and posts dozens, hundreds of critical comments about toffs, Tories, public school types but to my memory has not made one critical comment about Labours antisemitism issues seeks to downplay Labours problems.

A truly remarkable piece of research and a far better use of your time than trying to prove I have changed my position on Brexit in the last 3 years,

But why put it on the Brexit thread?

I can't be arsed, but see the image for your mate Pasta further up

Clue: it's got an arrow and a point which may not be in the same hemisphere. Do you think I should have just said whataboutism

 

[Sussex Nomad]

I love Boris, I love England, Scotland can do one, EU can do one, Corbyn loves terrorists and doesn't know the words to our national anthem, the future is bright, the future is Boris.

 

[Sussex Nomad]

To be fair the commie Corbyn doesn't even know whether he supports Brexit or not, he's a very confused Marxist.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Maybe - but a bit more digging reveals that it was also mentioned quite widely before the referendum - and specifically about Boris.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/feb/22/no-boris-johnson-you-cant-have-your-brexit-cake-and-eat-it-too
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36512743
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36505735
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/george-osborne-treasury-brexit_uk_5714c297e4b0f22f0219d7ad?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAACqSCI2hr5wIlr9ZGcqmbE2QTh_M0mRuVlvjt_MeiUJuR0u95ja83sfW7NgoH8jsNrqkn5at_3N0m7C4TuhW-qD-WHVytMdTmmL1MEzLEqqlMkaQnrYE56StRiGHs4aW-D7kmRpVvEGEZZ8D6INaGIklB3PDugrBqecUjloBWgJV

Yes mentioned widely by critics of the leave campaign most of which seem to relate to one jokey comment by Boris.

"Have our cake and eat it" is not a direct quote from anyone from vote leaveduring the campaign, in the post you quoted, it has not been placed in quotation marks so I am not sure why you think that it should have been, but telling people there would be "no downside, only a very considerable upside" is equivalent. Here is a list of things said which imply all good, no bad, many clearly incompatible with each other, i.e. cake and eat it scenarios. https://infacts.org/cut-keep-list-top-19-brexiteer-promises/

Which is why I asked the Impster to define what he meant by 'have our cake and eat it'. It's equivalent in your view but not mine as any campaign highlights what they perceive as the benefits rather than focus on any negatives. To me 'Cake and eat it' implies having the same supposed benefits of EU membership (eg same access to the single market) with the supposed benefits of leaving (eg more control of immigration).

 

[Baldseagull]

Yes mentioned widely by critics of the leave campaign most of which seem to relate to one jokey comment by Boris.



Which is why I asked the Impster to define what he meant by 'have our cake and eat it'. It's equivalent in your view but not mine as any campaign highlights what they perceive as the benefits rather than focus on any negatives. To me 'Cake and eat it' implies having the same supposed benefits of EU membership (eg same access to the single market) with the supposed benefits of leaving (eg more control of immigration).

And that was said.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

A truly remarkable piece of research and a far better use of your time than trying to prove I have changed my position on Brexit in the last 3 years,

But why put it on the Brexit thread?

I can't be arsed, but see the image for your mate Pasta further up

Clue: it's got an arrow and a point which may not be in the same hemisphere. Do you think I should have just said whataboutism

[MENTION=21401]pastafarian[/MENTION] proved that some time ago but at least you admitted it in the end. Using the search function on the Times site isn't all that time-consuming (about 5 mins) and much better than on here although I have some way to go to match your epic NSC trawls through the posting history of numerous peeps.

 

[clapham_gull]

What makes you think he supports an amnesty for all illegal immigrants. That isnt what he said in parliament this week.

I can answer that, he does.

He proposed the same when he was Mayor of London.

It's hilarious that the frothing at the mouth brigade have chose as their leader someone as "socially liberal" (albeit opportunist) as Boris.

He is right wing on a number of issues (and says the wrong things), but when it comes to immigration he is poles apart from the rest of the cabinet.

He'd personally like to keep freedom of movement OUTSIDE of the EU.



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[JC Footy Genius]

And that was said.

Yes, I alluded to a couple of comments in my answer to the Impster. I think one person may have said it which hardly makes it the central theme/giant con of the referendum campaign.

 

[Sussex Nomad]

I can answer that, he does.

He proposed the same when he was Mayor of London.

It's hilarious that the frothing at the mouth brigade have chose as their leader someone as "socially liberal" (albeit opportunist) as Boris.

He is right wing on a number of issues (and says the wrong things), but when it comes to immigration he is poles apart from the rest of the cabinet.

He'd personally like to keep freedom of movement OUTSIDE of the EU.

You've just debunked the racist theory you horrible little man.

 

[Mr H]

 

[Baldseagull]

Yes, I alluded to a couple of comments in my answer to the Impster. I think one person may have said it which hardly makes it the central theme/giant con of the referendum campaign.

“There is a European free trade zone from Iceland to the Russian border and we will be part of it… Britain will have access to the Single Market after we vote leave… The idea that our trade will suffer because we stop imposing terrible rules such as the Clinical Trial Directive is silly.” Vote Leave

"We can control our Borders and have a fairer system which welcomes people based on the skills they have, not the passport they hold" Vote Leave

 

[clapham_gull]

You've just debunked the racist theory you horrible little man.

Not all, maybe a bit complex for you ?

The new right of the Tory party have a utopian vision of a low regulation tax haven.

It's a neo liberal vision and has little to do with the historic concerns of the Conservatives.

They have little concern for immigration because they know their future economy will need immigrants to do the low paid unregulated jobs.

You can still be racist and ship in workers from abroad.

I have no idea whether Boris is racist, but it's irrelevent.

The Brexit campaign run by Farage played on those who are.

But they personally couldn't give a shit.

Farage's wife is German and Boris Grandfather was Turkish.

Fortunately, a vision of a unregulated new liberal utopia doesn't sell many tickets but fears of immigration does.

They fooled you. Now watch them open the doors.


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[Sussex Nomad]

Not all, maybe a bit complex for you ?

The new right of the Tory party have a utopian vision of a low regulation tax haven.

It's a neo liberal vision and has little to do with the historic concerns of the Conservatives.

They have little concern for immigration because they know their future economy will need immigrants to do the low paid unregulated jobs.

You can still be racist and ship in workers from abroad.

I have no idea whether Boris is racist, but it's irrelevent.

The Brexit campaign run by Farage played on those who are.

But they personally couldn't give a shit.

Farage's wife is German and Boris Grandfather was Turkish.

Fortunately, a vision of a unregulated new liberal utopia doesn't sell many tickets but fears of immigration does.

They fooled you. Now watch them open the doors.


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How have they fooled me? It's all very well googling stuff but then to tell me they have fooled me? Please explain.

 

[clapham_gull]

How have they fooled me? It's all very well googling stuff but then to tell me they have fooled me? Please explain.

"Googling stuff", I read books and minutes of the London assembly.

Do you want me lend you some ?

( They don't need colouring in )

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[Sussex Nomad]

"Googling stuff", I read books and minutes of the London assembly.

Do you want me lend you some ?

( They don't need colouring in )

Sent from my BLA-L09 using Tapatalk

Silly boy.

 

[JCL666]

what is the point of this thread?

pretty sure no one has changed their opinion because of it.


it just seems full of bile and people getting angry.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Ironic that you bring up antisemitism, that was the last time The Times of London referenced the Guido Fawkes site...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/bbc-under-fire-over-antisemitic-imam-qnrd7635l

... obviously, you missed it as it highlighted yet another Labour party member's anti-Semitic views. Just hysterical smears no doubt.

There are numerous other mentions, a few examples ...

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tory-leadership-candidates-threaten-bbc-debate-boycott-0mxqglhnc

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...tacks-the-lobbys-trade-in-favours-k2rj695ll0d

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/request-for-footage-of-mps-alleged-groping-qw7dm9rrs

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/request-for-footage-of-mps-alleged-groping-qw7dm9rrs

.... none involving Melanie Phillips or Quentin Letts.

On the topic of antisemitism, not sure the wider Jewish community would agree that the real heart of the problem is in pubs on a Sunday, many of their community leaders seem to think having a potential governing party incapable of tackling numerous cases of antisemitism within its ranks could be rather problematic. But no surprise that someone intending to vote them into government and posts dozens, hundreds of critical comments about toffs, Tories, public school types but to my memory has not made one critical comment about Labours antisemitism issues seeks to downplay Labours problems.

Look, I don't have to read The Times of London, or any other publication you've found online to excite yourself with about antisemitism because I know, other than the Labour Party online, you don't give a **** about it.

In short - you're a ****.

 

[clapham_gull]

The vice chairman of immigration watch has already started a parliamentary petition regarding the "Boris Amnesty".



It caused much gnashing of teeth from the BNP when he proposed it as London Mayor in 2008 and 2009.

Happy to help Boris fans everywhere, didn't expect that did you ? Pour yourselves a drink...

From the London Assembly minutes:

... I think there is a good case, when we have about 500,000 illegal immigrants in London, for looking at ways of bringing them into the system and for allowing them to participate legally in the economy and to pay their taxes like everybody else, provided we do not thereby add an incentive to break the law. That is why an earned amnesty system would have very, very stringent procedures for vetting and for making sure that people were only allowed to benefit from the procedure if they had been here for some considerable time and established their good character.

if they prove they are of good character - and they are all big ifs - to allow them to earn their way as proper members of society and to contribute to this economy and to pay their taxes like everybody else because currently they are receiving benefits, they are receiving education and they are receiving health care and they are not allowed by our laws to contribute in the way that everybody else is.

I do think that it is the job - and one of the reasons why I think it is a good thing that we have a GLA and a Mayoralty - that we should be leading this discussion. It may be that this will be too politically difficult to achieve but it is right for us to be pursuing it. They did it in Spain with some success. There are economic benefits to be had.