[Politics] Brexit

[Lever]

I Sir don't give a god damn about what you think. Why would I?

I don't expect you to.... but I thought you were claiming to be an observer of behaviours rather someone who is inclined to pass judgements on them eg on such matters as intimidation and threatening behaviour. Isn't that what you said? If so, do you believe you are consistent in your beliefs?

It's not what I say to you that matters, it's what you tell yourself.....

 

[WATFORD zero]

I think we all know now that Customs Union and Freedom of Movement, or variations thereof, is the only end that will get a majority in the Commons.

Totally agree.

I think Meg called it nearly 3 years ago, and despite the 3 years of waffle and politicking since

I really can't see anything beyond the three options

1/ Soft Brexit with No borders and regulatory alignment

2/ No agreement and WTO

3/ Withdraw article 50

Shirley, any negotiation now will only be minor fine-tuning on one of the above

Who could have guessed

 

[Mellotron]

I would hope that everyone on here would condemn this vile behaviour utterly and unequivocally rather than wringing their hands and saying it's somehow a historical inevitability......

Unfortunately if you condemn this you could be seen as “politically biased”.

 

[Weststander]

I think Meg called it 3 years ago, despite all the waffling since

Great foresight, but I’d also compliment you on flexible thinking. Almost everyone else in this thread, sometimes irrationally, entrenched in views.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Do you think Corbyn will look to reach a compromise deal, that is, give and take?

Labour had six tests. Whether Corbyn will try to bring them in, I don't know. May listens to people and then does her own thing.

 

[WATFORD zero]

Great foresight, but also I’d also compliment you on flexible thinking. Almost everyone else in this thread, sometimes irrationally, entrenched in views.

I don't think so.

From the day after the referendum, It was obvious the EU wouldn't renege on their principles (or there would be no EU) amd the only offer would be the softest of soft Brexits.

When we didn't start building Border posts, lorry parks at the ports, initiate the development of the IT systems and infrastructure and submit our WTO schedules within the first couple of months, it was obvious 'no deal' was a non-starter.

We can still withdraw or delay article 50 for a GE or second referendum.

I'd like to pretend I'm a political genius, but it only really needed a fairly basic level of common sense to see what would happen

Just between you and me, there was never any crystal ball

 

[dingodan]

I would have thought, as a general rule, if you want to be a successful politician and persuade people that what you are saying is correct, don't day one thing and then get others to claim you meant something entirely different

(Just as a general rule for politicians)

Did he "get me to" claim he meant something different?

No. I just read/listened to what he said.

But you are correct in a way. Don't misspeak, because those who are dishonest and have no decency whatsoever will cut up the video/quote to try to spin it, they'll hide the fact it was an error and pretend you meant something you didn't, hoping that others who didn't hear the full context will fall for it.

Shame there are so many of those kinds of people around.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Do you think Corbyn will look to reach a compromise deal, that is, give and take?

Why should he? Oh, I forgot. He has not carried a principled stand. So....no. For point scoring twatweaselness reasons. Who knew?

 

[A1X]

[TWEET]1113163441471188992[/TWEET]

[TWEET]1113166400993067009[/TWEET]

To be fair, they had the chance to vote for a Hard and guaranteed Brexit several times, and kept failing to do so in their desperate bid for unicorns. Now reality has come and stuck a unicorn horn up their collective backside. You'd need a heart of stone not to laugh.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Labour had six tests. Whether Corbyn will try to bring them in, I don't know. May listens to people and then does her own thing.

And yet I prefer May to Corbyn. That said, I prefer diarrhoea to vomiting.

 

[peterward]

Well if you don't know (or still can't decide) which it was you voted for 3 years ago (Norway, Canada, CU, Single Market, Hard Border, No deal, WTO etc etc) then it certainly makes sense to have a referendum to try and find out which it is you and the rest of the electorate want. What I cannot imagine, is why you would want one particular option taken out ?

Or maybe I can

I have a very good grasp of the functioning of the EU and all the various options being touted as Brexit options. I personally voted for a WTO (which would quite quickly turn into a trade agreement with the EU) but becuase of the division in the country, would personally accept what is not the clean brexit I hoped for, that would placate remainers to a degree and would get us OUT of the undemocratic political union. The remain establishment have branded the true brexit as crashing off a cliff. It's bollox. For rubber stamp parliamentarians brexit is a problem to be managed not an opportunity to be seized.

As for knowing what I was voting for, I will concede I did not anticipate that we would end up with a remain PM in a remain cabinet with a remain parliament and a remain speaker all willing to ignore the democratic decision they all promised to uphold. This in defience of the 2 main parties manifestos to take us out of SM, CU and ECJ whilst ignoring centuries of parliamentary precedent. Its destroying the credibility we live in a free and fair democracy where citizens decide at the ballot box.

Could you imagine if the SNP had won Indyref1 and similar deceit, obfuscation and chicanery had been used to try and keep them in? We'd have 1000's of Robert the Bruce wannabes causing chaos.

The remain/leave question was like 2 fellas with a radio.The default position was the radio is on, but the other fella wants it turned off. They can't agree, so they decide to flip for it and both swear to abide by the decision. When off wins, the "on" fella immediately calls for best of 3... When that doesn't work, he tries to block access to the on/off switch and starts a campaign of attrition....claiming the other guy surely didn't want it off...maybe he meant to just change the channel, or maybe what he really meant was he actually wanted to keep it on but just turn the volume down. Surely that will suffice.

"Do you want to leave the European Union" was already answered.

 

[pastafarian]

Here's one.

[tweet]1110114700396761088[/tweet]


@ledbydonkeys have got loads of these quotes from Brexiters on Twitter.

I cant believe you FBPE twitter types still keep saying with your cherry picked phrase that he was saying we remain members of the single market, he wasn’t, he was always quite clear we should be free of ECJ jurisdiction, the body that regulates the single market, free of the EU governance on the single market that imposes domestic technical standards and regulations on the whole economy, but trade with the single market with preferential parts of it, outside of being members of it, always maintainedd definitely not be in the EEA and was clear end free movement but compromise on parts of it. There is no way that is remaining members of the single market. He was always consistent on this.
Do you get some sort of weird kick out of believing without question random peoples twatter opinions and reposting the bullcrap..
Nearly everyone in the world has access to and trades with the single market, just on differing preferential terms.



Daniel Hannan:
“Repeat after me. Single market membership and single market access are not the same thing.”
“Britain, as a relatively large economy which exports more to non-EU than to EU markets, would be better off trading freely with the single market than belonging to it”

https://www.conservativehome.com/th...gle-market-access-are-not-the-same-thing.html

 

[A1X]

[TWEET]1112637637582602241[/TWEET]

 

[Weststander]

I don't think so.

From the day after the referendum, It was obvious the EU wouldn't renege on their principles (or there would be no EU) amd the only offer would be the softest of soft Brexits.

When we didn't start building Border posts, lorry parks at the ports, initiate the development of the IT systems and infrastructure and submit our WTO schedules within the first couple of months, it was obvious 'no deal; was a non-starter.

We can still withdraw or delay article 50 for a GE or second referendum.

I'd like to pretend I'm a political genius, but it only really needed a fairly basic level of common sense to see what would happen

Just between you and me, there was no crystal ball

Widening the discussion. As you know May, Hammond, Rudd, etc, were all career pro EU, as were Cameron and Osborne. It seems obvious now that Hard Brexit or anything like it will never happen. When the dust has settled on all this, say in 10 years time, they IMO will look back and be privately satisfied with our continued close union (in one form or other) with the EU. Not least because they believe in business.

I wonder if the Duncan-Smith’s of this world will by contrast always hurt? He’ll probably always hate May, but the maths were never there in the Commons for a Hard Brexit.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

[TWEET]1112637637582602241[/TWEET]

Yes, I posted that yesterday.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Did he "get me to" claim he meant something different?

No. I just read/listened to what he said.

But you are correct in a way. Don't misspeak, because those who are dishonest and have no decency whatsoever will cut up the video/quote to try to spin it, they'll hide the fact it was an error and pretend you meant something you didn't, hoping that others who didn't hear the full context will fall for it.

Shame there are so many of those kinds of people around.

£350Million, let's give it to the NHS instead.
24th June 2016 Oh we didn't really mean that.

 

[Triggaaar]

In 2010 they're popular, yet within a year of coalition with the Tories their tuition fees policy is cast aside and that is the end of them - full stop. Labour can take us into an illegal war, the Tories can divide the nation for decades re Brexit yet both parties are forgiven and carry on while one policy - tuition fees - destroys a party. I concede the Lib Dems made some mistakes but they've been given the electric chair for stealing a loaf of bread.

Sure, but if the voters aren't forgiving the Lib Dems, that's up to the voters, it's not the fault of the Tories.

 

[Weststander]

Could you imagine if the SNP had won Indyref1 and similar deceit, obfuscation and chicanery had been used to try and keep them in? We'd have 1000's of Robert the Bruce wannabes causing chaos.

Away from Brexit, that crossed my mind too. If the Scots voted 52:48 for independence, they’d go absolutely mental if the Commons and Cabinet put obstacles in the way of it becoming a full blown reality.

 

[peterward]

And yet I prefer May to Corbyn. That said, I prefer diarrhoea to vomiting.

The agony of choice! May is a useless, procrastinating bungler, now squatting in number 10. Cannot wait for her to be binned, but red Jezza's Marxist wonderland is not a place I want to visit either. If only the Lib Dems were not a pro EU party :-( no sensible, centrist Brexit supporting party exists

 

[pastafarian]

Or, Remain or Leave with a supplementary question for Leave voters asking which of two specific versions they prefer. The answers to the second question would be applied if Leave beat Remain.

WTF
We have already had a Remain or Leave referendum, you dont need to ask an "are you really sure" question again.
You have a decision to that question.
If you want a supplementary question asking which of the two versions of leaving (Deal or No Deal) should be applied, then ask away. Lets have that vote now on how we should Leave and put parliament out of its misery.
Your way doesnt even allow remainers though a vote on how we should Leave,....dont see why they should be excluded. your undemocratic loonery is reaching new heights.