Chelsea Launch complaint

[shaolinpunk]

Can Torres appeal,or does the fact of the 2 yellows = red mean he can't?

Only straight red cards can be appealed

 

[withdeanwombat]

Only straight red cards can be appealed

Yes,that's what I thought.So,since he was running at speed and was met by Evans' studs and was brought down,he'll face the statutory ban whilst this dreadful ref walks away.

Something seriously wrong with these daft regulations.

 

[Common as Mook]

One rule for United, one rule for everyone else. Always been the case and I can't believe anyone is that shocked.

 

[shaolinpunk]

With regards to the complaint about verbals from the ref, obviously if there is anything racist etc in what he says it's unacceptable, but beyond that I don't see why refs shouldn't be able to tell players who have been mouthing off at him where to go in equal measure

 

[Acker79]

I think some people are arguing this as if it has to be one of the other either; clattenberg screwed up a clear foul, or, it was a dive the contact everyone sees wasn't there really there shut up.

For me, it's both.

It was a foul, and clattenberg made the wrong decision. But, Torres did go down flamboyantly, and if we want referees to clamp down on diving, falling flamboyantly when fouled risks being misinterpreted (at least until diving is eliminated). I would rather incidents like this occurred as a cost of driving out diving (and hopefully reduce those falls that exaggerate the foul) than referees just gave up on punishing diving (though I suspect incidents like this will lead to pressure on referees to only caution players for diving when they are absolutely certain, causing diving to resurge).

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

Depends on the system, the ones I have seen are all push to talk.

They have changed them recently

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

If its found that Chelsea have claimed it to be racist and if proved to be lying the players should be banned for a long time.

 

[T soprano]

Apparently the man utd team bus was late getting away from Stamford bridge on Sunday while they were waiting for ref mark Clattenberg and his assistants to board the coach

 

[Ninja Elephant]

One rule for United, one rule for everyone else. Always been the case and I can't believe anyone is that shocked.

Do you really believe that to be true?

 

[Bwian]

Exactly - The problem is that you'll have to convince the "there was contact, so it's not a dive" brigade - Unfortunately there's a bizarre myth around that contact = foul, mostly propagated by ex player pundits....

There's contact and there's going in with studs-something that Evans appears to be quite good at, he has proven that recently and was lucky to stay on the pitch when Shelvey got sent off. There's no doubt that Torres made a meal of the contact but that does not excuse Evans for being a snidey, dirty little twat and even former United player Gary Neville supported Torres this time and he talks a lot of sense most of the time despite being a Manc-his views are surprisingly unbiased.

As for Fergie's comments, he is a hypocrite of such proportions. He has enforcers and divers in all of his teams but has the audacity to point the finger at somebody like Torres for diving? He needs to look closer to home.

 

[Seagull over Canaryland]

I admire anyone who bothers to be a Ref these days. Even our so called best Refs seem so fallible. So much abuse from players, managers, and fans but given very little protection to do their job properly. The Refs are under huge pressure but have very little support. Too many times the Refs Assistant's fail to help the Ref make the right decision either.

I hate the thought of having technology involved but as it now seems to be open season for anyone to Refs off in the media, make allegations of racism etc, it's time for the Ref's microphone to be audible to all like in Rugby. Make the transcripts available to Disciplinary hearings. Plus give Refs other reasonable tools to do their job i.e. access to video replays and maybe a sin bin. Might improve behaviour on the pitch as well as eradicate many poor decisions by Refs. There's too much 'simulation', calling for yellow/red cards or claiming its your throw in when you quite clearly kicked it out. No wonder kids now think this is acceptable at junior level. There is far too much at stake in games like Chelsea v Man U to get so many game changing decisions wrong.

Listening to understandable complaints from Chelsea fans on phone-ins last night I liked it when Alan Green pointed out 'if you think Refs in the Prem are bad, in the Championship they are even worse'. Very true.

Having played for years in Sunday and Midweek leagues and watched footie for nearly 50 years swearing was and is a part of the competitive game and Refs used to tell persistently gobby players to piss off all the time. If the players were stupid enough to continue they deserved a card. No one blinked at this. I can understand even professional Refs having the odd lapse and giving some back. No excuse for making alleged racist comments, Clattenberg should know better.

 

[kevo]

It was a foul, and clattenberg made the wrong decision. But, Torres did go down flamboyantly, and if we want referees to clamp down on diving, falling flamboyantly when fouled risks being misinterpreted (at least until diving is eliminated). I would rather incidents like this occurred as a cost of driving out diving (and hopefully reduce those falls that exaggerate the foul) than referees just gave up on punishing diving (though I suspect incidents like this will lead to pressure on referees to only caution players for diving when they are absolutely certain, causing diving to resurge).

This is correct IMO. It was a bad decision - and I think Clattenberg is a poor referee who has made countless high profile bad decisions in the past - as it was clearly a foul. However, Torres also made a bit of a meal out of it - there was absolutely no attempt to stay on his feet - as said above, he fell flamboyantly.... Can't believe I'm agreeing with Fergie, but there you go!

 

[Mellotron]

The fact he was giving out yellow cards every ten seconds towards the end suggests that - whatever you felt the outcome of the foul on Torres should've been - Clatterburg seriously lost all control of that match.

 

[Durlston]

I hate Chelsea and everything about the club so I find it funny that they're whinging tarts.

 

[nwgull]

Probably was a foul on Torres, but he went down so easily and flamboyantly that you can see why it looked like a dive, so tough sh1t. If refs start booking all extravagant dives - whether there's contact or not - then might encourage players to only go down when they're genuinely tripped.

Players make bad decisions and have bad games; refs make bad decisions and have bad games. Players, managers and fans need to stop acting like children and deal with it. Brendan Rogers showed class in the post match interview when asked about Liverpool's wrongly disallowed last minute goal in the merseyside derby.

 

[Common as Mook]

Do you really believe that to be true?

Obviously that's a bit of an overreaction. However, I can genuinely say I have never seen one team get so many favourable decisions over the course of the last 20 years. It's becoming ridiculous.

 

[ATFC Seagull]

I admire anyone who bothers to be a Ref these days. Even our so called best Refs seem so fallible. So much abuse from players, managers, and fans but given very little protection to do their job properly. The Refs are under huge pressure but have very little support. Too many times the Refs Assistant's fail to help the Ref make the right decision either.

I hate the thought of having technology involved but as it now seems to be open season for anyone to Refs off in the media, make allegations of racism etc, it's time for the Ref's microphone to be audible to all like in Rugby. Make the transcripts available to Disciplinary hearings. Plus give Refs other reasonable tools to do their job i.e. access to video replays and maybe a sin bin. Might improve behaviour on the pitch as well as eradicate many poor decisions by Refs. There's too much 'simulation', calling for yellow/red cards or claiming its your throw in when you quite clearly kicked it out. No wonder kids now think this is acceptable at junior level. There is far too much at stake in games like Chelsea v Man U to get so many game changing decisions wrong.

I follow the NFL and these days it is very rare (apart from earlier in the season when replacement refs were in) that a key decision is wrong, and even rarer that after a game players/commentators/coaches will be talking about decisions. It is also very unusual to see the officials get any abuse from players and when they do it is big news - a player was ejected (sent off) yesterday for something that would seem quite standard in the premiership. It seems to me the things that contribute to this situation are:

A lot more refs doing one game keeping an eye on different aspects/areas of the pitch
Fully professional teams
The same refereeing "teams" working together every week
Stuff like timekeeping not being the officials on the field's job
A good system using technology (which has admittedly taken a few different rule changes to get right).

I know the idea in football is that the game is the same at all levels, and none of the above would really be practical beyond probably the top 4 divisions (if that) in this country, but it works...

 

[mikeyjh]

Players make bad decisions and have bad games; refs make bad decisions and have bad games. Players, managers and fans need to stop acting like children and deal with it. Brendan Rogers showed class in the post match interview when asked about Liverpool's wrongly disallowed last minute goal in the merseyside derby.

I concur, fed up to my back teeth of hearing about referees all the time, I cannot stand managers who always moan on about referees - Players win and lose games, very occasionally referees have an impact, but as they say - These things even themselves out over a season.

 

[fisons]

One rule for United, one rule for everyone else. Always been the case and I can't believe anyone is that shocked.

In what way do you think this absolute gibberish helps the debate?