[Albion] Why Are We So Wasteful?

[throbinson]

No one seems to be able to take on defenders and drive into the box anything can happen when you do that. We take to long getting the ball in the box whip it in early high and low, although that does need our frontmen to actually get in the box

 

[Hugo Rune]

No one seems to be able to take on defenders and drive into the box anything can happen when you do that

Lamptey does that when he gets the chance.

 

[Swansman]

Shooting practice is something that has limited effect. If you are a 25 year old player, you've probably been practising shooting for 20 years or so. Another couple of weeks or months is going to do very little difference and I can promise that they shoot a bit in training sessions as it is (although should be said that Potter is a fan of the the modern holistic training methods where everything is put into match like situations, non of that stand-in-a-line, get a pass and get a free shot on goal that nearly never happens in reality).

If you ask a 27 year old striker who recently started scoring a lot of goals they will rarely point to the amount of practice. It happens once in a while, "I stayed for 30 minutes after the training sessions and just practiced shooting", but the far more common reply will be something like "I decided/the coach told me to watch how Marco van Basten moved inside the penalty area" or "striker X told me how to think in this and this situation". Some players may improve from this, some may not, some may not be skilled enough or able to read the game enough to the point where this type of advice matters.

Does this mean its a coaching thing? To some extent maybe yes, there is no way of knowing for sure unless you attend all training sessions and all personal coach-to-manager talks and similar, but surely its possible to speculate. Potter used to play as defender, so did Bruno, Billy Reid was a defender/midfielder. They still probably know a lot of shit about how to develop skills and getting dangerous areas etc. but they may not know a lot about the "striker brain". Would adding a striker coach help? Maybe. But you imagine it would also help to sign experienced strikers, like Welbeck, but its never a guarantee. Just because you are experienced and know how to do things doesnt mean you are good at explaining it to others. A good horse is not always a good rider.

 

[throbinson]

Lamptey does that when he gets the chance.

It’s a shame he is currently injured

 

[zefarelly]

Is the correct answer “because we have a manager out of his depth at this level”?

That's not possible.

 

[PortuGull]

I think i was clear. What are you talking about?


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err... "conversation rate"...

 

[b.w.2.]

Shooting practice is something that has limited effect. If you are a 25 year old player, you've probably been practising shooting for 20 years or so. Another couple of weeks or months is going to do very little difference and I can promise that they shoot a bit in training sessions as it is (although should be said that Potter is a fan of the the modern holistic training methods where everything is put into match like situations, non of that stand-in-a-line, get a pass and get a free shot on goal that nearly never happens in reality).

If you ask a 27 year old striker who recently started scoring a lot of goals they will rarely point to the amount of practice. It happens once in a while, "I stayed for 30 minutes after the training sessions and just practiced shooting", but the far more common reply will be something like "I decided/the coach told me to watch how Marco van Basten moved inside the penalty area" or "striker X told me how to think in this and this situation". Some players may improve from this, some may not, some may not be skilled enough or able to read the game enough to the point where this type of advice matters.

Does this mean its a coaching thing? To some extent maybe yes, there is no way of knowing for sure unless you attend all training sessions and all personal coach-to-manager talks and similar, but surely its possible to speculate. Potter used to play as defender, so did Bruno, Billy Reid was a defender/midfielder. They still probably know a lot of shit about how to develop skills and getting dangerous areas etc. but they may not know a lot about the "striker brain". Would adding a striker coach help? Maybe. But you imagine it would also help to sign experienced strikers, like Welbeck, but its never a guarantee. Just because you are experienced and know how to do things doesnt mean you are good at explaining it to others. A good horse is not always a good rider.

This is a great post. But... it is not just Andy Cole saying practice is key. Harry Kane is another example. With all due respect, I would trust their opinions on this over yours, or Potter’s for that matter.


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[KZNSeagull]

Lamptey does that when he gets the chance.

And Ali Mac

 

[zefarelly]

Can you coach a player to have a killer instinct in front of goal? The last Albion player to have that consistent knack of knowing where the goal was - and scoring - was Glenn Murray. Perhaps the best of the bunch at the moment is Neal Maupay and that was a glaring miss of his when he could have made it 3-1. I can only think that it’s a confidence issue amongst all the players. A sight on goal and the attempt is rushed, or a player panicking and deciding to pass when shooting would have been the better option (and of course the reverse decision).

The unsettling thing is that so many attempts are not on target and some so wayward it beggars belief. Maybe Potter needs to put his psychological techniques to the test, a bit of ballet practice for the lads? I’m sure that’ll keep them on their toes.

I think players have an instinct. Watch the replays and Zeqiri had a deft touch of a shot that looked good, unfortunately it only got half a yard before being blocked by a defender . His shot ( saved) on the flay the other week was good too, it'll come as long as he gets game time and maintains confidence ( scoring would help)

Maupay has had numerous chances with time and space and has completely lost his confidence and any instinct he may have had. There may be an element of ability involved, but you can only assume it's confidence. He's shot. I understand why we start the new boys or no recognised strikers, they're so poor you know they're not going to score.

 

[Uh_huh_him]

Firstly, the cost of NOT investing is at least 100 million a season. We need to roll the dice.
Secondly, I totally agree. A younger Muzza would have buried that late Maupay chance. Muzza had it. Have any of our current strikers got it?

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The 100m thing is a bit misleading though isn't it?
Either we scrap the wage policy and add £10 - £20m to 5 other player's wages and blow the £100m that way. Or we **** up 4 years of building a team ethos, by just rewarding the new Messiah.

TB probably believes if we can keep the squad together we would be in good shape to return before parachute payments end.
Balancing that against breaking club wage policy for one player?
I get why the club's policy is the way it is.

 

[b.w.2.]

err... "conversation rate"...

Wow! Chances taken as a % of chances made. We are woeful on this measure


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[Prettyboyshaw]

It’s not just the final shot it’s the amount of times we dawdle around the box and lose possession and the amount of simple final balls in or around the box that go nowhere near the player that should finish it off. Yesterday at least 5 or 6 great chances to set up a finish went nowhere near the target. We seem to panick get disposed or miss hit the final pass. That with so many shots missing the target = frustrating season x 10

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

After the recent debacle with Mrs T's Peruvian raspberries, I thought this was going to be a thread about sustainability

 

[PortuGull]

Wow! Chances taken as a % of chances made. We are woeful on this measure


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(sigh) as opposed to "conversion" rate

 

[Swansman]

This is a great post. But... it is not just Andy Cole saying practice is key. Harry Kane is another example. With all due respect, I would trust their opinions on this over yours, or Potter’s for that matter.


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Of course practice is key but that mostly goes for young players. At a certain age it becomes more difficult to develop your motorical skills. If you practice shooting every day between the age of 0 and 25 you are most likely going to improve more than if you practice every shooting every day between 25 and 50. This is the basis of a lot of the "he's a promising player" thing. Everyone understands Aaron Connolly might and probably will improve, just like no one looks at Glenn Murray thinking "maybe he could be better in a year or two?".

The older you get, the less the amount of practice matters. When Harry Kane or Andy Cole were 15, practising shooting for two hours surely gave them more than some coach saying "ey bro look at Romario". As time goes on, the latter insight is going to possibly matter more than the amount of practice.

 

[b.w.2.]

The 100m thing is a bit misleading though isn't it?
Either we scrap the wage policy and add £10 - £20m to 5 other player's wages and blow the £100m that way. Or we **** up 4 years of building a team ethos, by just rewarding the new Messiah.

TB probably believes if we can keep the squad together we would be in good shape to return before parachute payments end.
Balancing that against breaking club wage policy for one player?
I get why the club's policy is the way it is.

It is a gamble either way. I believe we should invest. It appears 19 out of 20 Prem chairman agree with me.

Take Newcastle as an example. They are clearly an awful team, but they have more points than us. If they survive it will be down to investment. Callum Wilson is a major reason why they may just survive. Without him relegation guaranteed for them.

Another example. Brewster went to Sheffield United. They invested about the same as Newcastle did in Wilson. He (Brewster) has zero goals. The roll of the dice for them has so far failed. But they did invest.

Finally, Villa invested well. Including a higher amount in Maupay’s old buddy Watkins. They are now where we want to be. End of argument.


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[Skaville]

The 100m thing is a bit misleading though isn't it?
Either we scrap the wage policy and add £10 - £20m to 5 other player's wages and blow the £100m that way. Or we **** up 4 years of building a team ethos, by just rewarding the new Messiah.

TB probably believes if we can keep the squad together we would be in good shape to return before parachute payments end.
Balancing that against breaking club wage policy for one player?
I get why the club's policy is the way it is.

Definitely and especially right now, in an economic crisis. Do we really want to do a Bolton? A Portsmouth?

 

[b.w.2.]

(sigh) as opposed to "conversion" rate

lol [emoji23] Bl00dy auto-correct


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[b.w.2.]

Of course practice is key but that mostly goes for young players. At a certain age it becomes more difficult to develop your motorical skills. If you practice shooting every day between the age of 0 and 25 you are most likely going to improve more than if you practice every shooting every day between 25 and 50. This is the basis of a lot of the "he's a promising player" thing. Everyone understands Aaron Connolly might and probably will improve, just like no one looks at Glenn Murray thinking "maybe he could be better in a year or two?".

The older you get, the less the amount of practice matters. When Harry Kane or Andy Cole were 15, practising shooting for two hours surely gave them more than some coach saying "ey bro look at Romario". As time goes on, the latter insight is going to possibly matter more than the amount of practice.

But... Mr Cole and Mr Kane still did/do it.


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[Skaville]

It is a gamble either way. I believe we should invest. It appears 19 out of 20 Prem chairman agree with me.

Take Newcastle as an example. They are clearly an awful team, but they have more points than us. If they survive it will be down to investment. Callum Wilson is a major reason why they may just survive. Without him relegation guaranteed for them.

Another example. Brewster went to Sheffield United. They invested about the same as Newcastle did in Wilson. He (Brewster) has zero goals. The roll of the dice for them has so far failed. But they did invest.

Finally, Villa invested well. Including a higher amount in Maupay’s old buddy Watkins. They are now where we want to be. End of argument.


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Hahaha! Ask Newcastle fans what they think of Mike Ashley’s investment over the past four seasons.

Villa are a massive club. They can afford a higher wage structure than us, they have owners with bigger pockets. They have spent £200m in three windows. They can afford the risk.

We tried it with Locadia and did a Sheffield United. Tony isn’t a fool.