US election (merged threads)

[Peteinblack]

Farage is fiercely anti-establishment. He is well placed to see the corruption and deceit that goes on. He is unpopular because he goes public with it. The ruling elite hate having their feathers ruffled. Anyone who wants change is not the Establishment. The Establishment want the staus quo maintained. Its in their vested interest. Turkeys don't vote for Christmas.
Trump and Farage both want change.

Trump and Farage are both part of the corporate elite - Farage a private-school, Thatcher-worshipping, City trader, and Trump a billionaire businessmen and property tycoon. They will do nothing to tackle low pay for working class people or provide affordable housing for low-earners and young people. The top 1% will continue lining their pockets, while the working class are fed more scapegoats to divert their attention from the fact that it is neo-liberalism (rampant free-market Capitalism) and globalisation which is destroying jobs and driving down wages.

Neither Farage nor Trump will do anything to tackle the power or wealth of the corporate elites on behalf of the working class or blue collar workers. The whole 'we are out there on the side of the people against the elites ' is a giant con - it would be funny if it was not so tragic.

 

[alfredmizen]

Can you buy D.I.Y. nuclear bunkers on eBay?

Far more likely to be a war under interventionist Clinton.

 

[peterward]

the New, New World Order

 

[Dick Swiveller]

I'm not a fan of Trump, but I can understand why he won. Americans are fed up with the establishment, fed up with big government, fed up with uncontrolled immigration. They want their country back. Fair enough. So do I. I want my country back. I don't want my hard earned money being handed out willy-nilly around the world to corrupt governments and dictators in the form of "foreign aid". I don't want my money being handed out to lazy work-shy individuals who believe the world owes them a living. I don't want any more immigration into this country unless they are people we really need who can bring something very positive to the UK. I don't want Political Correctness ruling the roost. I don't want faith schools. I could go on ....

You don't want black women presenting the Sky at Night. You don't want a lady with an amputated arm presenting the weather. Don't forget them in your wish list.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Corbin went to private school, Blair, Hartman,half the bloody Labour Party have, so what's your point GB ?

Pretty obvious - Farage is a part of the same elite.

 

[Driver8]

So your word on who`s dangerous goes...Not the 60 ish million who voted Trump. You sound more like Saddam Hussien or Gaddaffi...They murdered opponents.

The man is a lunatic with a huge nuclear arsenal. You don't think that is dangerous?

 

[NooBHA]

I feel so sad this morning.

I felt so sad at the Brexit vote as well.

I believe 100% in the Democratic process as set out by the laws of the land and we must accept what has happened in both instances and if I want to be honest and true to my beliefs I have to accept these decisions as well

On the flip side to this I am wondering why human beings are willing to follow such people in life. - We don't seem to be learning from history that self serving leaders take us down the wrong paths and we look back many years later with distain and blame the Economic situation at the time for putting such leaders into power.

Some people obviously think this is a great decision by the American people and the world, I just feel for the people who will become the victims of this decision. Life will go on as normal I suppose but not for everyone.

 

[jakarta]

This seems like the place for this. I've been told that Republican internal polling puts Clinton four points ahead. Don't have any info from the Democrats.

Enjoy your evening ��������������������

Are you related to Herr Tubthumper by any chance?

 

[Prince Monolulu]

It's early doors, let's see what happens.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

Obviously some of the circumstances that led to Brexit and Trump being elected president are similar and have a common denominator. It is nonsense to compare the two leaders though. Farage was always about leaving the EU, consistently and constantly since the early 90's. Trump as president is a wholly different thing. Some of his comments make Farage seem much more reasonable. Farage is far more predictable than Trump, and this is what bothers me most, that on the hoof decision making and the extreme comments he makes are now able to become real policy rather than hot air. For better or worse, Trump will affect life across the globe whether one is an American or a citizen of another country.

 

[Peteinblack]

View attachment 79279

What happens when democracy morphs into Idiotocracy

 

[Normski1989]

So you are basing our defence policy on the EU rather than NATO ? Scary........

If the US and Russia decided to start a war, NATO wouldn't hold up. Especially as the US is the largest country within NATO and we've burnt our bridges with a lot of our EU allies.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Far more likely to be a war under interventionist Clinton.

 

[heathgate]

Like Brexit, this is a vote against Liberalism. Democracy at its most granular level is 'the will of the majority', so in the case of the US, 78% of the population is white... and talk of Black's and Latinos mobilizing socially and politically, did nothing other than encourage the circling of the wagons.

You cannot have a system that is put in place by a majority vote, then proceed to put the interests of the minority sector at the top of your priorities... as you see, the Americans have rejected that.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[Diego Napier]

Farage is fiercely anti-establishment. He is well placed to see the corruption and deceit that goes on. He is unpopular because he goes public with it. The ruling elite hate having their feathers ruffled. Anyone who wants change is not the Establishment. The Establishment want the staus quo maintained. Its in their vested interest. Turkeys don't vote for Christmas.
Trump and Farage both want change.

Farage and Trump are the establishment. They are the ruling elite. They both want power not change. On the back of an electorate who believe what they tell them.

 

[JCL666]

Trump and Farage are both part of the corporate elite - Farage a private-school, Thatcher-worshipping, City trader, and Trump a billionaire businessmen and property tycoon. They will do nothing to tackle low pay for working class people or provide affordable housing for low-earners and young people. The top 1% will continue lining their pockets, while the working class are fed more scapegoats to divert their attention from the fact that it is neo-liberalism (rampant free-market Capitalism) and globalisation which is destroying jobs and driving down wages.

Neither Farage nor Trump will do anything to tackle the power or wealth of the corporate elites on behalf of the working class or blue collar workers. The whole 'we are out there on the side of the people against the elites ' is a giant con - it would be funny if it was not so tragic.

Sums it up for me. They both have manipulated popular discontent in order to further their own agendas,

 

[beorhthelm]

Well at least we can now celebrate with Brexit, Trump and a hard won victory of the downtrodden against the political elite.

We will now see the wealthy, powerful and political elite changing, losing some of that wealth and power, it being distributed more evenly amongst the populace and any downsides to these results will surely be outweighed by this

neither Brexit or US elections are votes for more socialist ideals, so where do you make the leap to wealth and power being more distributed as a result?

 

[Hastings gull]

Just two points:
1. If you seek out statistics about such things, the Daily Mail has a far, far higher level of complaints being made about its content than any other newspaper - in fact possibly as much as all the other papers put together. Coupled to that, it has a far far higher % of those complaints being upheld. In other words, it is not too bothered about the facts of the matter and constantly prints lies.

2. In terms of the"it's a matter of process" comment, a major part of the argument for BREXIT was about sovereignty for many people. If you then try to subvert or ignore THE LAW OF THE LAND, that is not "democracy", it is anarchy. It will not stop BREXIT happening, it will just make sure it is achieved in the right way.

If Farage persists in his comments about leading a march of 100,000 people on the day of the appeal against the High Court Judgement, he is being stupid and only encouraging comparisons of himself to Hitler. There has been an old German Newspaper headline from 1933 circulating about this very matter and Hitler seeking to shut up the independent judiciary then. farage is descending to the same level. At least May seems to acknowledge the independence of the judiciary, even if it might be getting in the way.

Your post just shows exactly what I was talking about.
Whilst you may be right about the DM and the complaints, that is not really relevant, is it? I was referring to the readers not the paper. “The other words” is of course your interpretation. In any case, what proof have you got that the “lies” they tell, are believed by the readership? Would I be right in thinking that you look down on those plebs and assume they believe everything they read? I assume that is the point you are making, by bringing in the issue of complaints and alleged lies.
Whilst you are quite right about subverting the law, and may be right that Brexit will not be stopped, you know as well as I do that this is not about process, rather obstruction. I submit to you that if you think this is really only a principle about process, you are being very naïve.
Millions of honest folk went to the polls on June 23rd, on both sides, assuming that whoever won, would have their wishes acceded to. Brexit won and now they see, rightly or wrongly, that an urban elite is trying to block it, because they know best. We both know that this is how the current developments will be viewed in millions of households. You might not like it, but that is the reality, is it not?
I agree that Farage was not at his best by stirring up problems with large demos, but in his defence, he is far more aware than the Westminster Bubble as to how folk feel, and the voting patterns that we saw last night, demonstrated that he is quite right. As I wrote - you cannot expect people to be ignored and loyal

 

[daveybgtt]

Liberals......ASSEMBLE!

 

[peterward]

The man is a lunatic with a huge nuclear arsenal. You don't think that is dangerous?

Not as dangerous at this stage, as potentially abandoning NATO members.

Its always been the case that an attack on one member that will illicit a response of war from all other members, has prevented Russian Adventurism. Russia is a mafia state, with a leader hellbent on reversing the collapse of the soviet union "the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century" (his words), he's broken off parts of Moldova, he's invaded and broken off part of Georgia, he's invaded and stolen Crimea and has invaded Donbas in Ukraine East killing over 10,000 and shooting down a civilian airliner in the process, he's daily playing brinkmanship games with the baltic states Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania pushing them to see what he can get away with.

His bombers are buzzing the UK, he's done simulated nuclear bombing runs on Sweden, he's funding all the far right and far left movements in the EU, who are against the EU. He's trying to weaken, divide and ultimately destroy it. But for all his intimidation and brinkmanship, the NATO pact has prevented any real attack on a NATO member as yet, but now we have trump, who has many pro Russian political advisors, talking about abandoning the NATO pact. That is the green light for Putin, the serial opportunist who will always go up to and after the maximum he thinks he can get away with.

There will be some seriously worried people this morning in Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania