Turkish Fans & minutes Silence in Instanbal

[soistes]

But see

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-not-a-mark-of-disrespect-claim-a6738741.html

A lot of Turks arguing that they were making the point about all the Turks that had been killed in similar (including ISIS) terror attacks, but which had not led to this sort of commemoration, minutes silence etc etc. If true (and, of course, it may just be an excuse), they may have a point.

 

[Hastings gull]

Incredible - some people judging an entire nation by the actions of their football fans. I suppose we're fortunate that others didn't do that with us in the past.

Football culture in many other countries is often one that they go out of their way to intimidate, upset and offend - booing or even failing to show respect during moments of commemoration is of course deplorable, but it is also completely unsurprising within these hostile football cultures.

I listened to it and in all honesty was expecting the odd jeer, much liked we heard from a very small section of Bosnia fans against Ireland, where you really could say that it was a tiny minority. But this clearly involved thousands, which is deeply worrying. I accept that to an extent,football culture is as you say in other countries, and can be unjustifiably hostile. But this was quite deliberately done to ruin what should have been a poignant moment, and whatever you think, it involved large numbers of one nationality, whatever spin you want to put on it. These people clearly exist en masse - how many more football fans there think like that but were not at the match?Yes, it may not reflect the views of the majority, but equally, the opposite may be true, though one hopes not.

I

 

[Buzzer]

But see

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-not-a-mark-of-disrespect-claim-a6738741.html

A lot of Turks arguing that they were making the point about all the Turks that had been killed in similar (including ISIS) terror attacks, but which had not led to this sort of commemoration, minutes silence etc etc. If true (and, of course, it may just be an excuse), they may have a point.

I'd be more inclined to believe that explanation if they hadn't chanted 'Allahu Akbar'.

 

[Hastings gull]

But see

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-not-a-mark-of-disrespect-claim-a6738741.html

A lot of Turks arguing that they were making the point about all the Turks that had been killed in similar (including ISIS) terror attacks, but which had not led to this sort of commemoration, minutes silence etc etc. If true (and, of course, it may just be an excuse), they may have a point.

But that would not stop them doing much the same for their own, who had been killed, or asking other federations to hold a silence, if they are away.

 

[The Kid Frankie]

Don't fancy showing respect? Fine **** it don't come to the Euros next year. Fair enough it might be a minority - but that's enough for me to be inclined to think they can **** off rather than join the party next June. Give the place to someone like Denmark.

 

[soistes]

I'd be more inclined to believe that explanation if they hadn't chanted 'Allahu Akbar'.

Yes, on balance, I probably agree with you.

As a confirmed atheist, however, I do find it sort of satisfying that a bunch of fans chanting "God is great" at a football match is now seen as one of the most offensive things that could happen.

 

[Franks Wild Years]

Right, so to jump into this can of worms.

It seems that it's not unusual in Turkey for a minutes silence to be chanted through, so maybe this is just a different cultural interpretation of a minutes silence. Don't we sometimes do a minutes applause ?
Also I can't really work out what they're chanting so how do you know that they're chanting 'allahu akbar' doesn't sound like it to me, but its hard to tell

According to a Turkish colleague whats is probably being chanted is “sehitler olmez, vatan bolunmez” Which means something like “martyrs do not die they are immortal, our land is undefeatable.” which refers to turkish people who are killed in similar circumstances, so for instance when Turks have been killed by the PKK and after the recent suicide bombings in Turkey this is the response.

So at first glance this might appear to be massively disrespectful but just maybe it's been misinterpreted by a few people who are more interested in stirring up more hatred .

Whilst I agree that Turkey has an atrocious record on human/womens/Kurdish/Armenian rights and I would never support them joining the EU I think we should remember that a lot of Turkish people have suffered at the hands of Isis and if we're scared of infiltration my terrorists coming in as bogus refugees then they must be bricking it.

 

[northernseagull]

But see

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-not-a-mark-of-disrespect-claim-a6738741.html

A lot of Turks arguing that they were making the point about all the Turks that had been killed in similar (including ISIS) terror attacks, but which had not led to this sort of commemoration, minutes silence etc etc. If true (and, of course, it may just be an excuse), they may have a point.

Thanks for posting that... I thought there was more to this than meets the eye. So much hypocrisy from the west.

 

[Sheebo]

Basically terrorists who are in the main muslims and Turkish fans are reknowned for being rasict against any nation other than themselves. and even them at times. I wouldnt expect you to recognise that as I would imagine you have trouble recognising your own nose.if it could cause an argument.

Congratulations - you win the prize for not getting what someone was saying on NSC for the 1000th time - wasn't even having a dig at you, I was playing devils advocate. Thanks for the insult though, appreciate it

 

[Buzzer]

Ankara-based Reuters correspondent Ece Toksabay was at the match and is adamant that they chanted Allahu Akhbar.

[tweet]666724016367886336[/tweet]

That's good enough for me.

 

[vegster]

I'm fully expecting Bozza to blame Corbyn for this.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Probably only a vocal minority disrespecting the minutes silence but is anyone looking forward to Turkey (77+ million population) joining the EU ?

Nope, our politicians here and in the EU just don't get it do they.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

The Kemalites must really want to shoot these kinds of people in the face.

 

[Franks Wild Years]

Ankara-based Reuters correspondent Ece Toksabay was at the match and is adamant that they chanted Allahu Akhbar.

[tweet]666724016367886336[/tweet]

That's good enough for me.

Like the Sun reporter who accused us of chanting 'Sieg Heil' at Millwall a few years ago ?

 

[soistes]

Probably only a vocal minority disrespecting the minutes silence but is anyone looking forward to Turkey (77+ million population) joining the EU ?

Well,

First, it ain't going to happen -- most EU countries are now opposed, as indeed are most of the Turkish population themselves
http://www.dailysabah.com/nation/20...rkish-support-for-eu-membership-at-record-low

Second, and arguably,
Turkey joining the EU and becoming more integrated with the West, was perhaps the only thing that could have been done to support and reinforce the secular legacy of Ataturk (which is increasingly being eroded) and act as a bulwark against the growing Islamisation of a massive country on the borders of Europe. It's probably now too late, judging by the latest election results, and the growing strength of religious oriented parties.

 

[albionite]

Like the Sun reporter who accused us of chanting 'Sieg Heil' at Millwall a few years ago ?

Sure he accused millwall of chanting 'sieg heil'

 

[Saladpack Seagull]

Well my wife's grandfather always told her "never trust a turk"

Probably depends on which Turk you're being asked to trust, Gazwag. My late Dad's pearls of wisdom included the phrase "Never trust the Welsh, little men or cripples." He never really expanded on that one, but then we're talking about a Dad whose "Birds and Bees" chat in its entirety was "Well, you've seen dogs doing it on the farm, haven't you? Well, it's like that...." A man of few words who stated that he went to war because the Germans were "a bloody nuisance". Fortunately I did not have to rely on these nuggets of wisdom as I had a good education...... Dad had left school at the age of 12 to work on the family farm; Loved him to bits, but some of the "sayings" were controversial to say the least. That's Dads for you......

 

[Buzzer]

Like the Sun reporter who accused us of chanting 'Sieg Heil' at Millwall a few years ago ?

I'd like to think that a Reuters correspondent is a little more reliable than a Sun journalist.

 

[Eeyore]

Doubtless there are some who are revelling in it, so I understand people's anger.

But additionally there are some who may be miffed that their own losses aren't regarded worthy of such respect.

I would still imagine that much of the crowd was silent, and sweeping generalisations really aren't called for.

It was a friendly against Greece too. Not the best station for impeccable manners.

 

[symyjym]

But see

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-not-a-mark-of-disrespect-claim-a6738741.html

A lot of Turks arguing that they were making the point about all the Turks that had been killed in similar (including ISIS) terror attacks, but which had not led to this sort of commemoration, minutes silence etc etc. If true (and, of course, it may just be an excuse), they may have a point.

After reading the article I understand the points made and it does look like we have forgotten the terror attacks in Turkey and Beirut and all the othew attrocities. If they were chanting Allahu Akbar I couldn't really hear it on the video. My first reaction was shock though.