'Travellers' now in Rottingdean

[Eeyore]

To be charged you would need to be arrested, to be arrested you would need to be identified, does NSC hold that personal information? Its unlikely you would be charged with any offence just for using the word, it would depend on the context of course. Its more likely the site admin would be spoken to in the first instance and we don't want that do we!?

NSC could be asked to provide personal information. The techies at the Police would have very little difficulty in identifying people through email/IP addresses.

Personally I think it's best, for the sake of saving moderators the worry-real or imagined-to use appropriate language on what is a public forum.

 

[c0lz]

A word of warning for people using the word 'pikey': you open yourself up to being charged under racism laws, so it's probably best you don't go there.

Could you point out the racism laws on the word pikey as this is not the first time its been mention and i have never found it.

 

[The Fifth Column]

NSC could be asked to provide personal information. The techies at the Police would have very little difficulty in identifying people through email/IP addresses.

Personally I think it's best, for the sake of saving moderators the worry-real or imagined-to use appropriate language on what is a public forum.

I think you are overestimating the skills of the police 'techies', an IP address only ever really identifies a location/ID of a computer and even then they can be spoofed or masked and it doesnt identify a person, to do that you would have to prove a link between a particular person and that IP address. This has and continues to be a largely untested area in law and the easiest defence would be to say your wireless router was insecure and that someone must have been piggy backing your connection. Also investigating stuff like this costs the police a fortune and i doubt very much that investigating someone simply for using the word 'pikey' in an internet forum would pass the public interest test or be seen to be a good use of police resources, it would have to be a sustained, aggressive and seriously abusive use of the word and/or be accompanied by some other facts or behaviour to make any prosecution likely. The DPP, Kier Starmer published guidelines on issues such as this last year and basically you can be abusive and even racist to a certain degree without having to worry about getting prosecuted. Just calling someone a nasty name even if it contains racist terms isnt an offence on its own and even less so now the word insulting has been removed from the public order act. In essence just using the word 'pikey' isnt going to get anyone on NSC arrested or prosecuted unless it is used in a grossly offensive manner but Bozza is the boss and if it causes him grief and he gets spoken to by PC Harry Potter then it is probably best used rarely if at all. Im going to have to stop using it and will use the term irish migrant seasonal worker instead

 

[Leighgull]

Came across this:

Best AnswerAsker's
"Pikey"

Halliwell’s Dictionary of Archaic and Provincial Words (Halliwell, 1889) lists ‘piker’ as an East Sussexword for a tramp and ‘pikey’ as a Kent word for a gypsy. A Dictionary of The Kentish Dialect and Provincialisms (Parish & Shaw, 1887) defines a ‘piky’ as “a turnpike traveller; a vagabond and so generally a low fellow”. The word derives from the word ‘pike’ a shortened version of ‘turnpike’, “a road on which a toll was collected at a toll gate”9.

One website says that there are many such travellers in Kent “because of the summer hop picking” (5). This website also asserts that Pikeys are different to true gypsies in that they are of Irish descent, as opposed to having Romany heritage. Many of the scallies who are today called ‘pikeys’ probably have no connection to these travellers of Irish descent but it is easy to see how the word has remained. Travellers are often viewed as a nuisance and slightly dishonest and uncultured so, to the people of Kent, ‘pikey’ is an idea (l) way of referring to the scallies of today.
Source:
http://www.sarahbromley.co.uk/scally/sum...
Asker's Rating & Comment

I'm not sure whether this term can be seen as a racist slur as it describes a geography rather than a racial characteristic. If we fast forward to today it is like calling them "roadies" or "highwayers" it's not derogatory in the same way as the "n" word for example.

On the other hand there have been examples of celebs being accused of racism, Martin Brundle, Richard Hammond, so if the travellers are offended by it, keep clear.

 

[See-Goals]

Have you ever been to South London? I lived there for 3 years and don't think I met a singke person of the traveling fraternity.

I've worked in Croydon for 7.5 years and haven't either.

Can't work out where this lazy stereotype came from.

 

[Goldstone1976]

Halliwell’s Dictionary of Archaic and Provincial Words (Halliwell, 1889) A Dictionary of The Kentish Dialect and Provincialisms (Parish & Shaw, 1887)

On the other hand there have been examples of celebs being accused of racism, Martin Brundle, Richard Hammond, so if the travellers are offended by it, keep clear.

Well, maybe so, but I'd be pretty sure that a dictionary that was published in the late C19 would have somewhat different definitions to those in common usage now for many words - such as "gay", for example.

"Keeping clear" would seem to be excellent advice, the more so since Bozza implies that he has already been contacted about the use of the offending term on NSC...

 

[pastafarian]

What if the site admin had already been spoken to?

This would negate all discussion..

Has the site admin been spoken to then?

 

[wellquickwoody]

What if the site admin had already been spoken to?

I will happily adhere to Bozza's advice as it his site and he doesn't deserve the grief.

That said, nice to know our constabulary have their priorities sorted so well

That combined with their fundraising for Irish Migrant Seasonal Worker charities FFS!

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Came across this:

Best AnswerAsker's
"Pikey"

Halliwell’s Dictionary of Archaic and Provincial Words (Halliwell, 1889) lists ‘piker’ as an East Sussexword for a tramp and ‘pikey’ as a Kent word for a gypsy. A Dictionary of The Kentish Dialect and Provincialisms (Parish & Shaw, 1887) defines a ‘piky’ as “a turnpike traveller; a vagabond and so generally a low fellow”. The word derives from the word ‘pike’ a shortened version of ‘turnpike’, “a road on which a toll was collected at a toll gate”9.

One website says that there are many such travellers in Kent “because of the summer hop picking” (5). This website also asserts that Pikeys are different to true gypsies in that they are of Irish descent, as opposed to having Romany heritage. Many of the scallies who are today called ‘pikeys’ probably have no connection to these travellers of Irish descent but it is easy to see how the word has remained. Travellers are often viewed as a nuisance and slightly dishonest and uncultured so, to the people of Kent, ‘pikey’ is an idea (l) way of referring to the scallies of today.
Source:
http://www.sarahbromley.co.uk/scally/sum...
Asker's Rating & Comment

I'm not sure whether this term can be seen as a racist slur as it describes a geography rather than a racial characteristic. If we fast forward to today it is like calling them "roadies" or "highwayers" it's not derogatory in the same way as the "n" word for example.

On the other hand there have been examples of celebs being accused of racism, Martin Brundle, Richard Hammond, so if the travellers are offended by it, keep clear.

My Dad used to call them tinkers, which literally referred to those who used to repair kettles, saucepans etc, but became a general word for travellers too.

In answer to the above, the constabulary carry out the law which is passed by politicians.

 

[BN9 BHA]

Have you ever been to South London? I lived there for 3 years and don't think I met a singke person of the traveling fraternity.

I've worked in Croydon for 7.5 years and haven't either.

Can't work out where this lazy stereotype came from.

Because they are all in Brighton & Hove

 

[carlzeiss]

Not saying it is OK to use the word Pikey but :-

http://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/news/exclusive-millwall-fan-gary-on-a87428/

 

[Goldstone1976]

Not saying it is OK to use the word Pikey but :-

http://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/news/exclusive-millwall-fan-gary-on-a87428/

All that article shows is that the Court were happy for a Gillingham supporter to use the word at a Gillingham match; the Gills epithet often including the word "pikey". It's similar to Spurs fans wanting to continue use the word "Yid". Few people think it's ok for others to use the word, especially in a derogatory way. Since this a BHA forum, I doubt the Court would have reached the same decision were the OB to prosecute a user here.

 

[c0lz]

All that article shows is that the Court were happy for a Gillingham supporter to use the word at a Gillingham match; the Gills epithet often including the word "pikey". It's similar to Spurs fans wanting to continue use the word "Yid". Few people think it's ok for others to use the word, especially in a derogatory way. Since this a BHA forum, I doubt the Court would have reached the same decision were the OB to prosecute a user here.

I think that if any one was charged with using the word pikey that a solicitor who was defending them would use a tried and tested case.

 

[Triggaaar]

What other word can we use to describe a person who lives in South London and behaves like a **** ?

Chav?

Although a lot of us would have just used 'pikey' as a general term for chav types, it is a racist term against travelers, so let's move on and use other words.

When it comes to describing the travelers, stick to the aspect you don't like. I suspect most of us don't mind travelers at all. Their tradition of moving around and working the land is quite romantic. It's the criminal behaviour of some groups that most of us abhor, so thieving vandal scum could work.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Have you ever been to South London? I lived there for 3 years and don't think I met a singke person of the traveling fraternity.

I've worked in Croydon for 7.5 years and haven't either.

Can't work out where this lazy stereotype came from.

The word isn't entirely associated to describe travellers in modern parlance , are you telling me you haven't come across this social underclass at all ?

 

[DNB_Seagull]

I remember when gypos came to the school where I live and they set up camp on the PE fields and there two little 12 year old boys
staring and intimidating year 8 girls. When the teacher politely asked them to ask they're boys to stop staring he got told to '**** off'

Same gypos asked for my cake I made in food tech. It was shit and gladly gave it to him but I can't stand palace fans.

 

[Goldstone1976]

I think that if any one was charged with using the word pikey that a solicitor who was defending them would use a tried and tested case.

You can't just pick and choose which elements of a case you're going to cite. The fact that the accused was a Gillingham fan at a Gillingham game is absolutely material to the case!

 

[See-Goals]

The word isn't entirely associated to describe travellers in modern parlance , are you telling me you haven't come across this social underclass at all ?

Of course, but I still can't relate it to Croydon.

Still, guess It's easier to parrot everyone else.

 

[c0lz]

You can't just pick and choose which elements of a case you're going to cite. The fact that the accused was a Gillingham fan at a Gillingham game is absolutely material to the case!

Elements of a case is the word pikey and it is deemed racist?. are you really saying its ok to say it in one town/city and not another.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

The word isn't entirely associated to describe travellers in modern parlance , are you telling me you haven't come across this social underclass at all ?

Social snobbery from a man living and working in Grimsby? Well, I'll be...