[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...

[Bob!]

...

 

[Machiavelli]

Did I read that one of the other four groups are called the Common Sense Group?!

That’s irony finished then.

Common sense is the most ridiculous notion ever. Whenever it's invoked, you know they're trying to shut down the debate.

 

[A1X]

Common sense is the most ridiculous notion ever. Whenever it's invoked, you know they're trying to shut down the debate.

It’s also something everyone sees differently. I believe it’s “common sense” for the state to own and run the major arteries of national infrastructure (utilities & transport), something the “Common sense group” in the Tory party would presumably baulk at.

 

[Cordwainer]

Apparently Lee Anderson is a member of the group. So that’s the common bit dealt with..just leaves the sense bit to do.

 

[Audax]

So. 29 abstained as rebels. That's enough to see the bill defeated at 3rd reading if they don't get what they want.

Today was a let off fir Rishi, but he's well and truly on notice. Expect the Lords to rip the bill a new one, and Rishi will then be in a very difficult place. Bring it back in a form that the 29 can accept and he risks losing the One Nation tories (and Rwanda as partner). Water it down or leave it unchanged and the 29 torpedo it.

Not sure he can win this. Think he's stuck. Now expecting January might see him call a snap election and try to win it on a "Stop the Boats" slogan ala Boris with "Get Brexit Done". It'll be the only route left.

 

[Bodian]

So. 29 abstained as rebels. That's enough to see the bill defeated at 3rd reading if they don't get what they want.

Today was a let off fir Rishi, but he's well and truly on notice. Expect the Lords to rip the bill a new one, and Rishi will then be in a very difficult place. Bring it back in a form that the 29 can accept and he risks losing the One Nation tories (and Rwanda as partner). Water it down or leave it unchanged and the 29 torpedo it.

Not sure he can win this. Think he's stuck. Now expecting January might see him call a snap election and try to win it on a "Stop the Boats" slogan ala Boris with "Get Brexit Done". It'll be the only route left.

Not so sure. It's all noise and bluster - and the Tories will eventually fall into line to stay in power. After all - they all know this bill is a nonsense and won't work - so why would they actually sacrifice themselves on something that's not going to happen anyway. They'll look after themselves as always.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

It’s also something everyone sees differently. I believe it’s “common sense” for the state to own and run the major arteries of national infrastructure (utilities & transport), something the “Common sense group” in the Tory party would presumably baulk at.

Common sense is different things to different people. I did an MBA many years ago and it quoted an example of a nuclear physicist and the people who do the cleaning in his offices/laboratory - both being totally incapable of doing the other’s job.

 

[armchairclubber]

Not so sure. It's all noise and bluster - and the Tories will eventually fall into line to stay in power. After all - they all know this bill is a nonsense and won't work - so why would they actually sacrifice themselves on something that's not going to happen anyway. They'll look after themselves as always.

Even slimey Jenrick couldn't bring himself to vote against the bill.

 

[Machiavelli]

It’s also something everyone sees differently. I believe it’s “common sense” for the state to own and run the major arteries of national infrastructure (utilities & transport), something the “Common sense group” in the Tory party would presumably baulk at.

You're proving my point very well -- it's polysemic.

 

[nicko31]

So basically kick the can down the road.

The Tory right are crack addicts looking for a bigger and bigger hit. Prepare for another meltdown in the new year

 

[TomandJerry]

UK GDP contracted by 0.3% on a monthly basis, new data from the Office for National Statistics shows, following growth of 0.2% in September.

That’s worse than 0% change in GDP expected by economists for October.

 

[jimhigham]

So. 29 abstained as rebels. That's enough to see the bill defeated at 3rd reading if they don't get what they want.

Today was a let off fir Rishi, but he's well and truly on notice. Expect the Lords to rip the bill a new one, and Rishi will then be in a very difficult place. Bring it back in a form that the 29 can accept and he risks losing the One Nation tories (and Rwanda as partner). Water it down or leave it unchanged and the 29 torpedo it.

Not sure he can win this. Think he's stuck. Now expecting January might see him call a snap election and try to win it on a "Stop the Boats" slogan ala Boris with "Get Brexit Done". It'll be the only route left.

The number of abstaining rebels would be enough to defeat the bill at the Committee Stage but…

…the government has parked this for a little while. It’s not going to be the first business after the recess. Looks like they’re going to try and take the heat out of the situation and dial down the urgency. This will give them time to work on the rebels. They only need a handful to return to get them over the line and it’s amazing what you can achieve with a gong here or there. Those rebels in less age seats might find themselves hiring out some ermine robes in return for their support.

 

[rippleman]

UK GDP contracted by 0.3% on a monthly basis, new data from the Office for National Statistics shows, following growth of 0.2% in September.

That’s worse than 0% change in GDP expected by economists for October.

That's what happens when you let the Bank of England have unfettered control of interest rates. You can't grow an economy with high interest rates and high taxation, both of which are a disincentive for businesses to invest.

Who benefits most from high interest rates? Hmmmmmm

 

[nicko31]

UK GDP contracted by 0.3% on a monthly basis, new data from the Office for National Statistics shows, following growth of 0.2% in September.

That’s worse than 0% change in GDP expected by economists for October.

High interest rates starting to bite, a lot of cheap money ending in 2024

 

[Tubby Mondays]

I’ve been wondering how interested voters are in this topic because the tories seem to be putting all their eggs in one basket on this issue.

When canvassing their core vote, nevermind swing voters, how are they going to be able to spin it as a success?

‘Yes we understand that you can’t pay your mortgage so you’re in danger of losing the property that you’ve worked hard to buy, and that your kids will never be able to buy or even rent one, and can only afford to live on beans and toast because we have crashed the economy, and that you have been on a waiting list for a hip replacement for 13 years because we don’t really do the NHS, and you lost several family members to Covid because we couldn’t do that either but we have come up with a pie in the sky scheme that has cost a fortune, deported no one and deterred no one either’.

Surely they need to be thinking about one or two other policies don’t they?

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

I’ve been wondering how interested voters are in this topic because the tories seem to be putting all their eggs in one basket on this issue.

When canvassing their core vote, nevermind swing voters, how are they going to be able to spin it as a success?

‘Yes we understand that you can’t pay your mortgage so you’re in danger of losing the property that you’ve worked hard to buy, and that your kids will never be able to buy or even rent one, and can only afford to live on beans and toast because we have crashed the economy, and that you have been on a waiting list for a hip replacement for 13 years because we don’t really do the NHS, and you lost several family members to Covid because we couldn’t do that either but we have come up with a pie in the sky scheme that has cost a fortune, deported no one and deterred no one either’.

Surely they need to be thinking about one or two other policies don’t they?

I was shocked when I saw this earlier



It's top in this poll, can only assume it's the same in other polls.

I guess it's because it's framed as "We have no money, it's down to spending it on boat people"

So people think all the money is being spent on that

 

[Tubby Mondays]

I was shocked when I saw this earlier



It's top in this poll, can only assume it's the same in other polls.

I guess it's because it's framed as "We have no money, it's down to spending it on boat people"

So people think all the money is being spent on that

They’re right though; it IS being handled badly by this disaster!

 

[beorhthelm]

I’ve been wondering how interested voters are in this topic because the tories seem to be putting all their eggs in one basket on this issue.

When canvassing their core vote, nevermind swing voters, how are they going to be able to spin it as a success?

‘Yes we understand that you can’t pay your mortgage so you’re in danger of losing the property that you’ve worked hard to buy, and that your kids will never be able to buy or even rent one, and can only afford to live on beans and toast because we have crashed the economy, and that you have been on a waiting list for a hip replacement for 13 years because we don’t really do the NHS, and you lost several family members to Covid because we couldn’t do that either but we have come up with a pie in the sky scheme that has cost a fortune, deported no one and deterred no one either’.

Surely they need to be thinking about one or two other policies don’t they?

must be under a rock or in denial, immigration has been a significant political issue for decades. for a large minority it is used as an excuse for many other problems, even if it doesn't directly affect them. being seen to do something becomes important, even if the underlying problem cant be resolved.

 

[The Clamp]

I’ve been wondering how interested voters are in this topic because the tories seem to be putting all their eggs in one basket on this issue.

When canvassing their core vote, nevermind swing voters, how are they going to be able to spin it as a success?

‘Yes we understand that you can’t pay your mortgage so you’re in danger of losing the property that you’ve worked hard to buy, and that your kids will never be able to buy or even rent one, and can only afford to live on beans and toast because we have crashed the economy, and that you have been on a waiting list for a hip replacement for 13 years because we don’t really do the NHS, and you lost several family members to Covid because we couldn’t do that either but we have come up with a pie in the sky scheme that has cost a fortune, deported no one and deterred no one either’.

Surely they need to be thinking about one or two other policies don’t they?

Never underestimate how many racist gammons there are in the U.K.

 

[The Clamp]

Labour really need to start laying into the Tory’s now and highlighting their manifold failures.
Really start hammering it home.

The odd shaky attempt at humour by Starmer at PMQ’s ain’t gonna cut it.

Go for the jugular. Destroy the ****s.