[News] The World at War

[The Fits]

Amen. But we still pretend all lives are equal.

 

[The Fits]

Both their governments are f***ing mad basatrds. We can pretend we have skin in this one and pretend we are at risk, and pretend we can do anything about those mentalists OR we can just let them get on with it like any other sensible country will do.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Both their governments are f***ing mad basatrds. We can pretend we have skin in this one and pretend we are at risk, and pretend we can do anything about those mentalists OR we can just let them get on with it like any other sensible country will do.

The ordinary people of both countries deserve far far better. Left to their own devices they'd probably get along just fine, like most people anywhere. They've got far more common ground than they have differences

 

[Surf's Up]

And it's all in the name of God

 

[Zeberdi]

Haven't we been here before? When Blair lied to the British people that Iraq had WMDs as an excuse for us to invade the country (as instructed by the US) to enforce regime change. And then......it was discovered Iraq didn't have WMDs at all!

I'm not saying Iran doesn't have WMDs, just urging caution that we shouldn't necessarily accept the word of politicians.

Of course we have already seen Starmer licking round Trump; he will do whatever Trump tells him to do. Anybody still trusting Trump?

I think history may well look back and say this is an illegal attack too - that there’s no mandate under Article 51 for Israel’s arguments of ‘self-defence’ as a reason to attack Iran at this time.

Is Israel’s Use of Force Against Iran Justified by Self-Defence?

This morning, Israel launched a major military operation against Iran targeting its nuclear programme, including facilities, individual scientists and military leadership. In this post, I will provide a quick, preliminary analysis of the legality of Israel’s use of force against Iran as a...

www.ejiltalk.org

 

[armchairclubber]

I think history may well look back and say this is an illegal attack too - that there’s no mandate under Article 51 for Israel’s arguments of ‘self-defence’ as a reason to attack Iran at this time.

Is Israel’s Use of Force Against Iran Justified by Self-Defence?

This morning, Israel launched a major military operation against Iran targeting its nuclear programme, including facilities, individual scientists and military leadership. In this post, I will provide a quick, preliminary analysis of the legality of Israel’s use of force against Iran as a...

www.ejiltalk.org

Do you think it's possible that history may look back on this Labour Governments continued arming of Israel and other supportive actions as well as its lack of sanctions against Israel and find them illegal also? (as in defiance of the ICJ ruling)

 

[abc]

Just had a txt from a well connected friend in the (UK) defence industry; “The word is that Trump will let USA go all out at Iran as from tonight”.
Hope he’s wrong

 

[abc]

Also, apparently, “the us sent all their long range refuelling planes over to the ME yesterday”.

 

[Insel affe]

Also, apparently, “the us sent all their long range refuelling planes over to the ME yesterday”.

So I guess that is what he meant by "better than a ceasefire"
code for we will annihilate them and then there is no need for a ceasefire.

If we help them after signing that trade deal, Starmer can go Fk himself and not in my name thank you very much, he will go down in my estimation by a long, long way.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

So I guess that is what he meant by "better than a ceasefire"
code for we will annihilate them and then there is no need for a ceasefire.

If we help them after signing that trade deal, Starmer can go Fk himself and not in my name thank you very much, he will go down in my estimation by a long, long way.

It feels like it's coming doesn't it? The US attacking Iran's nuclear sites?

I'll be disgusted with America as i'm disgusted with Israel, but I don't think Starmer can really do much about it. He can't impose sanctions on America.

The best we can do is to be as far from this as possible militarily, but be ready to provide whatever consular and humanitarian assistance needed

 

[Insel affe]

It feels like it's coming doesn't it? The US attacking Iran's nuclear sites?

I'll be disgusted with America as i'm disgusted with Israel, but I don't think Starmer can really do much about it. He can't impose sanctions on America.

The best we can do is to be as far from this as possible militarily, but be ready to provide whatever consular and humanitarian assistance needed

We will be required to provide some kind of logistics or information, otherwise we would not have got a trade deal, and Trump showed his contempt for it anyway by dropping it all over the floor and making Starmer scurry around picking it up like the fool he is becoming.

Pure power show by Trump "look at my little lapdog"

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

We will be required to provide some kind of logistics or information,

Don't agree

We don't have anything we can usefully give to America for a mission like this. In the past they may want us to provide some visible presence to help provide a veneer of legitimacy, but here it's just going to be US heavy bombers, taking off from US ships taking out the targets supplied by US intelligence.

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

We will be required to provide some kind of logistics or information, otherwise we would not have got a trade deal, and Trump showed his contempt for it anyway by dropping it all over the floor and making Starmer scurry around picking it up like the fool he is becoming.

Pure power show by Trump "look at my little lapdog"

Trump: "While you're down there..."

 

[rippleman]

It feels like it's coming doesn't it? The US attacking Iran's nuclear sites?

I'll be disgusted with America as i'm disgusted with Israel, but I don't think Starmer can really do much about it. He can't impose sanctions on America.

The best we can do is to be as far from this as possible militarily, but be ready to provide whatever consular and humanitarian assistance needed

Starmer has already done his bit by sending more fighter jets. He did that on the very same day that he called for de-escalation in the region. That's probably the price of the "half deal" (if that) with Trump.

UK sends more RAF jets to Middle East as PM urges de-escalation

Sir Keir Starmer said aircraft are being deployed amid intense fighting between Israel and Iran.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

Starmer has already done his bit by sending more fighter jets. He did that on the very same day that he called for de-escalation in the region. That's probably the price of the "half deal" (if that) with Trump.

UK sends more RAF jets to Middle East as PM urges de-escalation

Sir Keir Starmer said aircraft are being deployed amid intense fighting between Israel and Iran.

www.bbc.co.uk

The messaging was that's to provide cover for UK bases, for example Cyprus. Whether there is some backfilling role we might be playing in addition, I suppose isn't impossible, but greater military minds than mind will have a better idea.

But that's a different thing to getting ourselves involved in directly attacking Iranian nuclear facilities, which there is clearly no public consent to

 

[rippleman]

I was watching a programme on BBC4 about the psychology of the main players and events on WW2 last night. Two things hit me. The first was a psychology professor from a German University who had studied Hitler "who had to be surround3ed by people who would tell him that he was a genius and a great leader." The second was another expert who said "Hitler made a habit of appointing people to positions they were totally unqualified to do (eg Speer, an architect, as armaments minister and General Paulus, with no battlefied experience, to command the 6th Army - Stalingrad).

I'll leave you to "spot the difference".

 

[rippleman]

The messaging was that's to provide cover for UK bases, for example Cyprus. Whether there is some backfilling role we might be playing in addition, I suppose isn't impossible, but greater military minds than mind will have a better idea.

But that's a different thing to getting ourselves involved in directly attacking Iranian nuclear facilities, which there is clearly no public consent to

But there was no "public consent" to invide Iraq. That didn't stop Blair and IMO he was a far stronger and astute leader than Starmer.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

But there was no "public consent" to invide Iraq. That didn't stop Blair and IMO he was a far stronger and astute leader than Starmer.

Someone else said that to me yesterday I think.

My response is that times have changed and I think, lessons from ignoring that weight of public opinion learned. There is precious little support in this country for Netanyahu and the way he's manufactured this crisis. A massive majority wants us nowhere near this at all.

I guess it's possible that Trump strong arms Starmer into some sort of support under the pretence that this is an international coalition. But in reality, does Trump care what it looks like? Do we have any assets that would make a material difference? I don't doubt that Starmer wants to curry favour with Trump, but go to war? With Iran? Nahhhh

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

Someone else said that to me yesterday I think.

My response is that times have changed and I think, lessons from ignoring that weight of public opinion learned. There is precious little support in this country for Netanyahu and the way he's manufactured this crisis. A massive majority wants us nowhere near this at all.

I guess it's possible that Trump strong arms Starmer into some sort of support under the pretence that this is an international coalition. But in reality, does Trump care what it looks like? Do we have any assets that would make a material difference? I don't doubt that Starmer wants to curry favour with Trump, but go to war? With Iran? Nahhhh

The whole world's bowing and scraping to that orange imbecile. This is what appeasement looks like. It was vile then and it's vile now

#nokings

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

The whole world's bowing and scraping to that orange imbecile. This is what appeasement looks like. It was vile then and it's vile now

#nokings

Well yes, If Starmer turned around and publicly said "F*** off, you repulsive orange whoremonger" on live TV in one of his White House meetings I would love it. He would have my vote 100%.

But I guess Starmer is reasoning, that it's not as easy to do that as it is in Love Actually. There would be consequences for our economy. Red wall voters are less forgiving than I am