[Drinking] Question Time Official SHAMBLES Thead

[clapham_gull]

The referendum was not legally binding, that is a fact. Irrelevant what politicians claim was going to happen, doesn't change the fact it was legally an advisory referendum. If it had been a binding referendum then the overspending by the leave campaign, as found by the High Court, would have meant the Electoral Commission would have declared the result null and void.

Which is another chapter is the bizarre cluster-**** that Cameron started to keep the party together.

I'm always been deeply suspicious of the EU since the 80s. However I find myself arguing (even today) with people who never thought about it 4 years ago who are under the impression that "they make all our laws."

It reminds me of all those people who suddenly become interested in football during the World Cup or go into work on Monday simple repeating what the pundits said on MOTD.

The whole debacle is down to a Neo-Liberal take over of the Tory Party. Their have ignited fears of immigration and myths about the EU to cynically accomplish their desire for a Singapore type economy that relies on cheap imported Labour.

No surprise Johnson asked for an amnesty on illegal immigration in his first Commons speech and the Government are now throwing away immigration quotas, starting with student visas.

It's remarkable Johnson is attacking Corbyn on freedom of movement, when he has been privately been lobbying for exactly the same thing as Foreign Minister.

Brexiteers really need to swallow the hard, hard truth, particular those on low paid jobs, You've been played.. "Brexit" was their opportunity and they went for it.

Hilariously (and I won't be voting for him) the only one watching your back is Corbyn.

 

[London Irish]

So Brexit Party’s Mark Reckless outlines a terrible vision of a Labour government taking generic drugs from Big Pharma to give to the NHS, to whip up outrage in the audience - and everyone cheers and applauds lol

The Brexit Party are not about Brexit but enriching the 1%

 

[rigton70]

Which is another chapter is the bizarre cluster-**** that Cameron started to keep the party together.

I'm always been deeply suspicious of the EU since the 80s. However I find myself arguing (even today) with people who never thought about it 4 years ago who are under the impression that "they make all our laws."

It reminds me of all those people who suddenly become interested in football during the World Cup or go into work on Monday simple repeating what the pundits said on MOTD.

The whole debacle is down to a Neo-Liberal take over of the Tory Party. Their have ignited fears of immigration and myths about the EU to cynically accomplish their desire for a Singapore type economy that relies on cheap imported Labour.

No surprise Johnson asked for an amnesty on illegal immigration in his first Commons speech and the Government are now throwing away immigration quotas, starting with student visas.

It's remarkable Johnson is attacking Corbyn on freedom of movement, when he has been privately been lobbying for exactly the same thing as Foreign Minister.

Brexiteers really need to swallow the hard, hard truth, particular those on low paid jobs, You've been played.. "Brexit" was their opportunity and they went for it.

Hilariously (and I won't be voting for him) the only one watching your back is Corbyn.

Couple of points they do make our laws not all admitingly but workers rights etc and many more which I agree with.

Not sure how you can say what Boris wants regarding freedom of movement as you said it’s private so speculation on your part.

Hilariously Corbyn does not have our backs he will be the most dangerous PM if elected we have had.

 

[clapham_gull]

So Brexit Party’s Mark Reckless outlines a terrible vision of a Labour government taking generic drugs from Big Pharma to give to the NHS, to whip up outrage in the audience - and everyone cheers and applauds lol

The Brexit Party are not about Brexit but enriching the 1%

I'm not sure the Brexit Party are about anything beyond immigration and leaving the EU, beyond that I suspect it gets a bit weird. I remember reading out the BNP manifesto (minus the racist stuff) to a sympathiser who was appalled to find he would have to pay taxes to pay women to stay at home.

I'm sure that most Brexit party supporters would be appalled to know that Farage wants proportional representation.

 

[rigton70]

I'm not sure the Brexit Party are about anything beyond immigration and leaving the EU, beyond that I suspect it gets a bit weird. I remember reading out the BNP manifesto (minus the racist stuff) to a sympathiser who was appalled to find he would have to pay taxes to pay women to stay at home.

I'm sure that most Brexit party supporters would be appalled to know that Farage wants proportional representation.

Im not sure you know what your talking about regarding the brexit party and there policies again another one that speculates.

 

[clapham_gull]

Not sure how you can say what Boris wants regarding freedom of movement as you said it’s private so speculation on your part.

Politely is it bollocks. You need to read beyond your usual sources.

Whilst spouting his usual populist EU myths, he publicly said so many many times as London Mayor.

He also got majorly caught out post referendum during a meeting with EU Ambassadors which was leaked to the press. His advisors did a good job in twisting the reality, but the truth came out in the end.

Unfortunately in these bonkers times truth and lies become "opinion". Point me to an anti-immigration Boris story, you won't find one that is true.

Boris Johnson is a huge believer in 1) Freedom of movement from the EU and 2) Immigration generally for the benefit of the economy. He sees those in stark economic terms whilst retaining his old school xenophobia and Eurosceptism. You can be both.. In the Boris world of lies and opportunism it's the one thing he is politically consistent on.

I explained this to anti-immigration Brexiteer the other day. They genuinely thought that what Farage wanted would happen, but he has no power and is the sworn enemy of those backing Boris.

Sorry to drop the reality on you, those campaigning for Brexit have very different agendas.

His first immigration policy ?

https://www.politicshome.com/news/u...nson-rips-theresa-mays-student-visa-curbs-bid

You've been played.

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Couple of points they do make our laws not all admitingly but workers rights etc and many more which I agree with.

Not sure how you can say what Boris wants regarding freedom of movement as you said it’s private so speculation on your part.

Hilariously Corbyn does not have our backs he will be the most dangerous PM if elected we have had.

Ambassadors have confirmed Johnson's views on FOM so it's not speculation. The two year extension to student visas is also public knowledge.

 

[clapham_gull]

Ambassadors have confirmed Johnson's views on FOM so it's not speculation. The two year extension to student visas is also public knowledge.

It's bizarre anyone could argue against it. It's simply the truth.

It's the major difference of opinion in the leave campaign. I've just finishing reading Cameron's autobiography which simply confirmed what I'd witnessed.

The new economic liberalism of Raab, Truss, Gove etc.. relies on cheap foreign labour, but they needed to leave to EU with their pesky laws on workers rights.

Their cynicism was to let Farage freak out everyone about immigration (and if not keep quiet) make some vague statements about taking back control of our borders.

Added to that, they needed a proven electable "leader" who whilst being pro-immigration and freedom of movement will go along with anything to be PM.

To somehow glue this together, they get in a weird disaster spin doctor who ends up making Boris break the law.

It's a fascinating cluster**** to observe. The only analogy I can think of is the Chuckle Brothers do the Russian Revolution.

Meanwhile their "supporters" (really ?) blame Gina Miller and the Supreme Court.

Completely played.

 

[whosthedaddy]

I think you'll find the only cluster f*** that's on the cards is a certain Jeremy Corbyn (The Manhole cover collector)

Some of his party's announcements at conference.
No 1. We'll nick your Private school from under your privileged noses and sell all the assets off.
No 2. If you own a 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc. home and it stays empty too long we'll nick it from under your noses and sell it off.
No 3. If you make drugs we'll nick those from under your noses and sell them cheaply to the NHS.
No 4. If you work you'll have your job nicked. Labour would keep free movement after Brexit (that's not Brexit then...Doh!) and let an unchecked mass of immigrants into the country who'll take many jobs away from Brits because they'll be willing to work for much less.

Oh, and by the way he'll nick your fence, mainly because Jeremy needs it to sit on.

Going to hell in a handcart comes to mind

Well and truly played.

 

[Stat Brother]

I think you'll find the only cluster f*** that's on the cards is a certain Jeremy Corbyn (The Manhole cover collector)

Some of his party's announcements at conference.
No 1. We'll nick your Private school from under your privileged noses and sell all the assets off.
No 2. If you own a 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc. home and it stays empty too long we'll nick it from under your noses and sell it off.
No 3. If you make drugs we'll nick those from under your noses and sell them cheaply to the NHS.
No 4. If you work you'll have your job nicked. Labour would keep free movement after Brexit (that's not Brexit then...Doh!) and let an unchecked mass of immigrants into the country who'll take many jobs away from Brits because they'll be willing to work for much less.

Oh, and by the way he'll nick your fence, mainly because Jeremy needs it to sit on.

Going to hell in a handcart comes to mind

Well and truly played.

What aspects of a Boris lead government fill you with confidence?

 

[rigton70]

Politely is it bollocks. You need to read beyond your usual sources.

Whilst spouting his usual populist EU myths, he publicly said so many many times as London Mayor.

He also got majorly caught out post referendum during a meeting with EU Ambassadors which was leaked to the press. His advisors did a good job in twisting the reality, but the truth came out in the end.

Unfortunately in these bonkers times truth and lies become "opinion". Point me to an anti-immigration Boris story, you won't find one that is true.

Boris Johnson is a huge believer in 1) Freedom of movement from the EU and 2) Immigration generally for the benefit of the economy. He sees those in stark economic terms whilst retaining his old school xenophobia and Eurosceptism. You can be both.. In the Boris world of lies and opportunism it's the one thing he is politically consistent on.

I explained this to anti-immigration Brexiteer the other day. They genuinely thought that what Farage wanted would happen, but he has no power and is the sworn enemy of those backing Boris.

Sorry to drop the reality on you, those campaigning for Brexit have very different agendas.

His first immigration policy ?

https://www.politicshome.com/news/u...nson-rips-theresa-mays-student-visa-curbs-bid

You've been played.

Where I have I been played?

I have already stated I’m not pro leave or remain.

I do understand immigration is part of the UK where have I said differently.

I will say this one more time both sides are bullshitters and that my friend is the truth.

 

[Wrong-Direction]

It's been a shambles for years, complete morons shout at each other whilst moron members of the public watch on. Nothing ever gets done. It should be called Hot air time.

Sent from my SM-A600FN using Tapatalk

 

[Jim D]

Corbyn ..... will be the most dangerous PM .....

After Mr Weak, Mrs Devious and Mr Unlawful I can almost warm to Mr Dangerous. Perhaps we should also write some new Mr Men/Miss books - I can see them becoming new classics.

 

[Lower West Stander]

It's bizarre anyone could argue against it. It's simply the truth.

It's the major difference of opinion in the leave campaign. I've just finishing reading Cameron's autobiography which simply confirmed what I'd witnessed.

The new economic liberalism of Raab, Truss, Gove etc.. relies on cheap foreign labour, but they needed to leave to EU with their pesky laws on workers rights.

Their cynicism was to let Farage freak out everyone about immigration (and if not keep quiet) make some vague statements about taking back control of our borders.

Added to that, they needed a proven electable "leader" who whilst being pro-immigration and freedom of movement will go along with anything to be PM.

To somehow glue this together, they get in a weird disaster spin doctor who ends up making Boris break the law.

It's a fascinating cluster**** to observe. The only analogy I can think of is the Chuckle Brothers do the Russian Revolution.

Meanwhile their "supporters" (really ?) blame Gina Miller and the Supreme Court.

Completely played.

Totally agree with you.

Whilst I can see some valid economic reasons for Brexit, this was not why the majority voted for it. With the risk of over generalising, leave constituencies in the north especially were massively influenced by the emotions of immigration and pesky foreigners running our country.

As you say, a policy massively exploited by cynical politicians out for themselves.

I lasted 10 minutes on QT last night.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[maltaseagull]

Couple of points they do make our laws not all admitingly but workers rights etc and many more which I agree with.

Not sure how you can say what Boris wants regarding freedom of movement as you said it’s private so speculation on your part.

Hilariously Corbyn does not have our backs he will be the most dangerous PM if elected we have had.

IF he did get elected, would they replace the government front benches with a fence?

 

[Garry Nelson's teacher]

What aspects of a Boris lead government fill you with confidence?

Just the one: that it won't last very long.

 

[zefarelly]

As soon as I saw that brexit **** and James tory-c**t Cleverly I nearly turned off, but stuck around because I didn't want to miss Gina Miller own the pair of them with facts.

it didn't take long.

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

Couple of points they do make our laws not all admitingly but workers rights etc and many more which I agree with.

They make some of them, many of which have massively benefited us as a nation and all of which we've had a say in, or at least our elected representatives have.

Furthermore, and this is the real key point, the numbers that have been spouted as to the quantity of law they make on our behalf has been massively over inflated by the Leave side. They've essentially totalled all of the EU's primary, secondary and tertiary legislation and compared that number to the UKs total of primary legislation. It's utter bollocks that many have lapped up to suit their argument.

 

[zefarelly]

Whilst I can see some valid economic reasons for Brexit,

Would you care to share one ?

 

[sussex_guy2k2]

Would you care to share one ?

To be fair, I'm pro-remain and I can see at least a couple of potential benefits in theory. 1) the current state of the EU economic system doesn't really work with a few bigger nations with lots of regulation essentially looking after the rest who have much smaller economies. Eventually the bigger nations aren't going to be able to keep bailing these nations out or propping them up. 2) in theory there's access to a wider array of countries to make trade deals with on our own terms, none of which we have to negotiate with other countries to get.

Obviously there are major flaws in these arguments that don't take a ton of effort to make, but they are still decent economic reasons on the face of it. And they're just two of them.