Palace Away And Our Rights

[Gullflyinghigh]

Honestly, what's the big deal? I'm sure there'll be at least one frothy mouthed response regarding erosion of rights, corrupt police and lizard men but honestly, this is nothing new and (like it or not) there is a high chance that a few morons from each side will want a rumble/overcompensating session.

 

[somerset]

I wonder if these rules would be applied if two rugby union teams who were rivals drew each other in an important game?

Nope, and further, the fans sit amongst each other, and drink more beer than the average spotty 'ultra' from Norwood or Whitehawk or wherever, and have nothing more than banter, singing and applause to contribute to proceedings.

....and don't tell me the Bristol v Bath err rivalry wasn't fierce, or even Gloucester and those two teams,.... fierce and certainly where Bristol and Gloucester is concerned, very working class.

 

[StillHateBellotti]

Been questioned under s60 twice.

Once was at Orient away (3 or 4 seasons back). Needless to say, I was 16, with a friend and was carrying nothing but a bottle of lucozade. We were both stopped under s60, I didn't have a clue what was going on, went to get my phone to tell my old man i'd be 5 minutes late meeting him with my ticket, and next thing i've got both hands up against a shop window in the middle of the high street and the coppers drawn his baton.

Second time was Villa away. Both times your made to stand out in busy places, it's extremely embarrassing. Especially at 16 when you haven't a clue whats going on.

As you say though, S60 CJPOA allows it, and can allow mass searches on occassions under authority. Since studying Law, it turns out the only reason I was (likely) stopped is the simple fact that the ethnicity records of those stopped were so one sided in favour of ethnic minorities, that the police have since started stopping people to even up the books.

Jesus with that one sided unbiased view you are set for a career as a defence lawyer....

 

[megcat]

Ooh you are a forlock tugger are you not.

So it becomes legal for a Police officer to stop you in the street and demand to see if you have a ticket to the footy and other ID?

Really? And you think this is acceptable?

In reality their is a section ?? Order that appears to allow this kind of behaviour but can be sidestepped if you have the correct answer.

Well here is another forelock tugged I will wear my ID seloptaped to my head if it helps eliminate the few that spoil it for the many

 

[KJP]

That's all to get in, and once you're in. They do not have the right to search you etc when you're not in the ground/going in etc.

But if you fail to produce a ticket because you don't have a ticket, then you haven't agreed to the terms and conditions on a ticket you haven't bought.

If you didn't have a ticket then you wouldn't be walking around with thousands of Brighton fans or walking up towards the stadium would you. If your walking around near the ground with your football shirt on and a scarf shouting abuse about palace and pissed out of your brains, and you don't have a ticket then you're an idiot for going, that's the whole point of this, to stop people without tickets going and trying to cause trouble, if you act accordingly you will probably only be asked for ID once you get a police cordon outside the stadium or at the turnstiles.

I remember going to England v Northern Ireland at Old Trafford, police searched everyone getting off at Manchester Piccadilly that day.

And I went to an Oakland raiders game last year and everyone had to walk through a metal detector to get within 100 yards of the stadium. What you are being asked to do for this game is just simply show some ID along with your ticket, hardly being strip searched is it.

 

[Triggaaar]

Authorities often won't let you get near a sporting venue without a ticket in hand. Is this really so different?

I can't think of another example where you have to show your ticket to someone until you're going in, and that includes the Olympics. Once in the ground, I have no problem with being asked to show my ticket, but what about (for example) when the game is in Brighton, and Palace fans are in a local being asked to show their ID and ticket?

If you didn't have a ticket then you wouldn't be walking around with thousands of Brighton fans or walking up towards the stadium would you. If your walking around near the ground with your football shirt on and a scarf shouting abuse about palace and pissed out of your brains, and you don't have a ticket then you're an idiot for going, that's the whole point of this, to stop people without tickets going and trying to cause trouble, if you act accordingly you will probably only be asked for ID once you get a police cordon outside the stadium or at the turnstiles. I remember going to England v Northern Ireland at Old Trafford, police searched everyone getting off at Manchester Piccadilly that day.

You seem to be completely missing the point. If you're near the near the ground, wearing colours, drunk and being abusive, then you're already committing an offence. You've just negated your own argument - you say that if you behave accordingly you'll only be asked for ID once in the the cordon outside the stadium, but when England played Ireland the police searched everyone getting off at Manchester Piccadilly (ie, including people who were behaving and not going to the game).

And I went to an Oakland raiders game last year and everyone had to walk through a metal detector to get within 100 yards of the stadium.

That's probably private land that's part of the stadium. If you're going through those detectors, the only thing on the other side is the stadium, so you're clearly going to the game.

What you are being asked to do for this game is just simply show some ID along with your ticket, hardly being strip searched is it.

I don't mind showing some ID with my ticket when going in (and I think that's the prerogative of the venue owners), I don't like that we have to show things when traveling. For example, if you're a Palace fan and live in Brighton, you might choose to watch the game in a pub, and before the game you go to the pub where all the Palace fans are. According to these rules the police can ask for ID and a ticket, but you won't have it as you're not going.

 

[Wozza]

I can't think of another example where you have to show your ticket to someone until you're going in, and that includes the Olympics.

You couldn't get into the Olympic Park without a ticket. You had to show it again to get into a stadium.

On some days (eg final Saturday) you could even go to the Westfield Shopping Centre without showing your Olympic ticket.

 

[Triggaaar]

You couldn't get into the Olympic Park without a ticket.

Yes, that's the Olympic Park, not the highstreet or the local train station. You could buy tickets just to go to the Olympic Park for the day (would've been a bit pointless if they let anyone in) it was part of the Olympics.

On some days (eg final Saturday) you could even go to the Westfield Shopping Centre without showing your Olympic ticket.

I don't understand that. So you weren't allowed to go to the shops there that day, unless you had an Olympic ticket? If so that's just as stupid as what we're talking about here.

 

[wiltshire seagull]

HA HA! Great post, PS...

 

[HawkTheSeagull]

Christ, you MAY be asked for ID and its against your human rights ?

God knows how those moaning react if they get asked for ID buying booze or fags. Everyone has ID, it takes 10 seconds, police see it - everyone's happy. It stops the trouble makers getting hold of tickets too, so surely that's a good thing ?

Should be happy they aren't forcing fans onto coaches only or not having fans at either ground at all - these plans were suggested !!

 

[RupertsFlan]

I'm not going simply because I don't want to. For a number of reasons. However we are in a rather sad situation when we are criticising the police for taking certain actions.

Surely the desperate issue here is the fact that the police and the clubs are having to come up with certain 'draconian' rules because there are a number of completely retarded mongs who cannot go to a game of football, have a beer, watch the football and then go home.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

Yes, that's the Olympic Park, not the highstreet or the local train station. You could buy tickets just to go to the Olympic Park for the day (would've been a bit pointless if they let anyone in) it was part of the Olympics.

I don't understand that. So you weren't allowed to go to the shops there that day, unless you had an Olympic ticket? If so that's just as stupid as what we're talking about here.

You would have had to have been ding-dong crazy to go anywhere near the centre that day. But thats not the point i know.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

I wonder if these rules would be applied if two rugby union teams who were rivals drew each other in an important game?

well ,you know where to go then
regards
DR

 

[Wozza]

I don't understand that. So you weren't allowed to go to the shops there that day, unless you had an Olympic ticket?

That's right. To stop overcrowding rather than trouble, mind.

And I've definitely been to sports events where I've been asked to show a ticket to get anywhere near the stadium. Typically, to avoid people without tickets milling around.

When buying tickets for a World Cup match, the purchaser has to be with the party when you enter a stadium, and so you need ID. (They don't actually enforce this on the day, but they threaten it.)

Meanwhile, Kasabian recently had a fan-only gig at Brixton Academy, which required the ticket purchaser to attend in person with the credit card used for purchase.

And if you want to buy Golden tickets for the forthcoming Chime for Change gig at Twickenham, the ticket purchasher needs photo ID to get in.

Tsk, eh?

 

[KJP]

FSF getting involved now


The decision by the Metropolitan Police, Sussex Police and the two clubs involved to impose restrictions above and beyond normal ticketing procedures, should they meet in the play-offs, appears to have been done without any consultation with fans’ groups.

That alone is enough to cause concern for the Football Supporters' Federation, but it is far from the only issue. Forcing away fans to carry identification under threat of refusal of entry to a match is unnecessary and unwanted.

Would these restrictions be imposed on people going to any other type of event?

The FSF is firmly opposed to football violence, but experience has shown that the best policing measures are those that target individual perpetrators. These measures will only serve to inconvenience the vast majority of ordinary, match-going fans.

This is an issue the FSF will return to should the clubs meet in the play-offs.