**** Official Train Commuters Discussion Thread ****

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Signal still not ****ing fixed. Delays AGAIN.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

And the prize for Britain’s worst train goes to …


So, how late was your train? The 07.29 Brighton to London Victoria service has made headlines as the worst in Britain, after failing to roll in at its scheduled time of 8.35am on a single occasion in the last year. It may be little consolation to those trundling slowly through Sussex to know their train may not be the absolute worst: neither Network Rail, the Department for Transport or the rail regulator have those figures to hand. It was left to angry commuters to ask train operator Southern to research and confirm the suspicion that this service never ran to schedule.
According to the official standard, though, the 07.29 slowcoach was only late 73% of the time. That is because punctuality, for commuter services, is officially defined as up to 4 minutes and 59 seconds behind time. Compensation is normally only paid for delays six times the lateness threshold.
Rebecca Francis, 37, aboard the 07:29, said she failed to reach work in Marylebone on time for the past three months: “It’s at least 10 minutes late on a daily basis. Between October and December, I had to apply for delay compensation at least five times for this train.” Southern’s stats show the train gets in less than 10 minutes late most of the time – 71% of trains last year – so only a small part of the annual season ticket cost (more than £4,000 since the January fare rise) can be clawed back.
Southern thinks, but can’t confirm, that the 07.29 is the only one of its services never to arrive to the minute. The following and preceding Brighton-Victoria trains actually did meet their schedule on occasion, albeit on only 1% and 2% of their attempts – although the poor 07.44 presumably stood little chance of overtaking its predecessor. Southern admits the stats are “not brilliant” but says the line is one of the most congested routes in the country and the knock-on effects of delays can be enormous.
Two years ago, then transport minister Norman Baker infuriated some train operators by trying to make the so-called “right-time” – punctuality as it appears on commuters’ watches, expectations and real-life plans – the default measure of lateness, rather than the five- or 10-minute relaxed “public performance measure”, the yardstick on which reputation and commercial franchises are judged. At time of writing, a mere 44% of Southern trains between Victoria and Brighton had run late on Tuesday by the official count. The truth can only make us angrier.

really are cuntbags.

And I guarantee the London Bridge services BEFORE any works are just as bad.

 

[Ernest]

really are cuntbags.

And I guarantee the London Bridge services BEFORE any works are just as bad.

Ever since they tried to amalgamate the Gatwick Express and the normal Brighton main line peak services it has been chaos, it was pointed out at the time that having crew changeovers at Gatwick smack bang in the middle of rush hours was a recipe for disaster but the profit merchants won thus now you have reaped what was sown.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Ever since they tried to amalgamate the Gatwick Express and the normal Brighton main line peak services it has been chaos, it was pointed out at the time that having crew changeovers at Gatwick smack bang in the middle of rush hours was a recipe for disaster but the profit merchants won thus now you have reaped what was sown.

I remember at the time Prescott announcing thatmore trains to london fgrom brighton were needed so they made the "extension" to the Gatwick express. The knock on effect at the time was the loss of a london bridge train (now 6.37 and 7.32) to cater for yet another victoria train.

BTW Ernest I fully agree with you.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Hassocks serves Hurstpierpoint, Ditchling, Sayers Common, Albourne, Woodmancote, Henfield, and for those people who need a car park (i.e. Preston Park won't do), northern Brighton. Southern Rail have admitted as such, having just spent a huge amount of money updating the station facilities, and now the services have been slashed.

I had a bit of a rant about this on Twitter yesterday and a driver of the London/Brighton route replied to me. I included it for balance (note, language NSFW) : https://storify.com/stephencgrant/london-to-brighton-train-rant

I like he terms shag*******. I may even use it on one of my facebook rants.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

And the prize for Britain’s worst train goes to …


So, how late was your train? The 07.29 Brighton to London Victoria service has made headlines as the worst in Britain, after failing to roll in at its scheduled time of 8.35am on a single occasion in the last year. It may be little consolation to those trundling slowly through Sussex to know their train may not be the absolute worst: neither Network Rail, the Department for Transport or the rail regulator have those figures to hand. It was left to angry commuters to ask train operator Southern to research and confirm the suspicion that this service never ran to schedule.
According to the official standard, though, the 07.29 slowcoach was only late 73% of the time. That is because punctuality, for commuter services, is officially defined as up to 4 minutes and 59 seconds behind time. Compensation is normally only paid for delays six times the lateness threshold.
Rebecca Francis, 37, aboard the 07:29, said she failed to reach work in Marylebone on time for the past three months: “It’s at least 10 minutes late on a daily basis. Between October and December, I had to apply for delay compensation at least five times for this train.” Southern’s stats show the train gets in less than 10 minutes late most of the time – 71% of trains last year – so only a small part of the annual season ticket cost (more than £4,000 since the January fare rise) can be clawed back.
Southern thinks, but can’t confirm, that the 07.29 is the only one of its services never to arrive to the minute. The following and preceding Brighton-Victoria trains actually did meet their schedule on occasion, albeit on only 1% and 2% of their attempts – although the poor 07.44 presumably stood little chance of overtaking its predecessor. Southern admits the stats are “not brilliant” but says the line is one of the most congested routes in the country and the knock-on effects of delays can be enormous.
Two years ago, then transport minister Norman Baker infuriated some train operators by trying to make the so-called “right-time” – punctuality as it appears on commuters’ watches, expectations and real-life plans – the default measure of lateness, rather than the five- or 10-minute relaxed “public performance measure”, the yardstick on which reputation and commercial franchises are judged. At time of writing, a mere 44% of Southern trains between Victoria and Brighton had run late on Tuesday by the official count. The truth can only make us angrier.

Jebus don't I know it, that is the train the wife gets everyday of the week & dont I know about it.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

Another uckfield one cancelled this morning.

 

[Hotchilidog]

Overrunning engineering works at Croydon causing this morning's delay. Thankfully FGW returned to form and I benefited from my connecting train being 10 minutes late which meant I could still catch it. Result!

 

[Arthur]

Another uckfield one cancelled this morning.

One? ONE??

Try all!

Tree on the line apparently. 9:45 is apparently running but with two coaches instead of 6. Now given they haven't run a service all poxy morning how the **** can there be a shortage of rolling stock??

Can't wait until tomorrow to hear what the excuse generator will come out with. I'm going for "The dog ate my train keys" or perhaps "Driver was abducted by aliens".

 

[In The Rough]

Cant blame Southern for a tree on the line. And I really wish I could.

But I can blame them for sending a bus to go from Uckfield to Haywards Heath that takes an hour and a half. FFS

 

[Arthur]

Well this bodes well...

[tweet]555650390273048576[/tweet]

 

[In The Rough]

Well this bodes well...

[tweet]555650390273048576[/tweet]

Oh good. Still at least there is plenty of spare trains lying about...

 

[Deadly Danson]

Why on earth can't they just invest in a robust signalling system as a priority rather than tarting up stations? OK, it's nice to have station facilities fit for the 21st century, but signal failure cause stupid amounts of delays and subsequent compensation claims. Seems like a no-brainer.

They are. New signals have gone in recently on the Seaford and Arun Valley routes and the new Lewes to Hastings signalling goes live next month (keep well clear!). Many of the London to Brighton signals have now been replaced. The problem at the moment is the London Bridge shambles is affecting everything else plus all the usual issues. I have, however, not known it as consistently bad as it is now for a long time. Ultimately though there are too many people wanting to use a railway that is too congested and until someone can come up with a viable second mainline (which is unlikely) everything else (loads of new trains, major timetable changes next December, the full Thameslink opening in a few years, new signals etc) is going to be nothing more than a sticking plaster.

 

[Ernest]

They are. New signals have gone in recently on the Seaford and Arun Valley routes and the new Lewes to Hastings signalling goes live next month (keep well clear!). Many of the London to Brighton signals have now been replaced. The problem at the moment is the London Bridge shambles is affecting everything else plus all the usual issues. I have, however, not known it as consistently bad as it is now for a long time. Ultimately though there are too many people wanting to use a railway that is too congested and until someone can come up with a viable second mainline (which is unlikely) everything else (loads of new trains, major timetable changes next December, the full Thameslink opening in a few years, new signals etc) is going to be nothing more than a sticking plaster.

You forget to list incompetent management and staff morale at rock bottom

 

[Lord Bracknell]

... the new Lewes to Hastings signalling goes live next month ...

And how late is that? Railtrack were promising to switch it on months ago. Will they keep the latest promise?

 

[Deadly Danson]

And how late is that? Railtrack were promising to switch it on months ago. Will they keep the latest promise?

Very very late. I was trained on it over a year ago. It's looking promising for opening next month by all accounts but I wouldn't go near that stretch of line the morning it opens!

 

[West Hoathly Seagull]

10 minutes late going home last night (1853 Victoria to East Grinstead), which is more of an inconvenience than anything else as I was going home. 15 minutes late this morning (0807 East Grinstead to Victoria), because of "congestion at Victoria Station"; a rubbish excuse as they have the same number of trains to get in and out each day. A good bit more than an inconvenience this time, as I had chosen to take a train two trains earlier than my normal one (the 0837), as I had a key drop this morning. The delay meant the contractor finished working in the bits he could get to, and then wouldn't do the other bits, as he claimed his meter payment had run out. I will now have to get him back in.

Before the railwaymen get on my back and say I clearly don't know how difficult it is to run a railway, I am not blaming the drivers, signalmen, etc, but the utterly hopeless management. However, operations-wise, it seems to me that Southern have given up trying to run services on time. Before Christmas they had dispatch staff hurrying on anyone who was running for the train, to ensure the doors closed at least 30 seconds before departure. Now it seems they aren't bothering. And they've gone and combined the franchise with Great Northern and Thameslink and handled the whole lot to GoVia and, IIRC, turned down Abellio, who are doing a very good job on a limited timescale with Greater Anglia. Whereas the DfT could strip Southern of its franchise, it must surely be far more difficult to disentangle the whole TSGN operation. And before anyone suggests nationalising the railways again, Network Rail is now a public company, and they're doing a great job, aren't they?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I cycled to work today. No incidents to report.

 

[Frampler]

Before the railwaymen get on my back and say I clearly don't know how difficult it is to run a railway, I am not blaming the drivers, signalmen, etc, but the utterly hopeless management. However, operations-wise, it seems to me that Southern have given up trying to run services on time. Before Christmas they had dispatch staff hurrying on anyone who was running for the train, to ensure the doors closed at least 30 seconds before departure. Now it seems they aren't bothering. And they've gone and combined the franchise with Great Northern and Thameslink and handled the whole lot to GoVia and, IIRC, turned down Abellio, who are doing a very good job on a limited timescale with Greater Anglia. Whereas the DfT could strip Southern of its franchise, it must surely be far more difficult to disentangle the whole TSGN operation. And before anyone suggests nationalising the railways again, Network Rail is now a public company, and they're doing a great job, aren't they?

Greater Anglia is terrible! Appalling trains that are either too hot or too cold, frequently late or cancelled, and just as overcrowded as Southern.

I don't see how changing the franchise holder would make much difference. The management will TUPE over to the new franchise along with all the staff. And most of the problems (Uckfield line's diesel shortage excepted) are with track and signalling, which fall under Network Rail's responsibility.

My solution for the time-being would be to reduce the number of Gatwick Express trains to 2 an hour - it's not really a business airport so doesn't need the same level of service as Heathrow. It seems like most air passengers use Southern's trains in any event, as they are half the price and take 5 minutes longer. I also say this because I commute on this route and consider myself much, much more important than people with suitcases.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

I just want that effing signal fixed is that too much to ask for? It seems it is. AND they have reduced the LB services as well and its STILL not working.