Murray to Palace

[grummitts gloves]

Why has this blatant non story fishing reached 13 pages geez

Because this football forum, like all other football forums thrive on bullshit, rumours, speculation and damned lies!

 

[gripper stebson]

I don't usually post on other forums due to the pointlessness of the act, but felt that there were a few misconceptions that needed clearing up somewhat.

Firstly, not one Palace fan I know of is proud of the frivolous nature of our fiscal policy over the last 15 years or so. We as a set of fans were so enraged that we owed St. John's Ambulance well over £12,000 during administration that the fans collectively produced the funds to pay them off. Had we been able to do that for all creditors (especially the small businesses) we would have given it a go.

Despite the myths, our financial black hole only stemmed from transfers and wages we could not afford in the final 18 months to a year before we were placed in administration. Our inital downfall came from Goldberg who bought the club on potential wealth - not real wealth. In the process, his funds never materialised and as such never completed the purchase of the gorund. Our old chairman, Noades, held onto the ground and that became the albatross around our necks until last July. The sad fact is that nearly all our money has been spanked on exorbitant rent of Selhurst for the past 12 years - and in actual fact player salaries etc played a smaller part than is usually the case. Having said that, we did live beyond our means - and quite rightly we were punished. For the record, the trauma of last season was more punishment than it looked from outside the club. I wouldn't wish that on anyone - yourselves included.

Also note that Jordan, whilst idiotic, did actually lose his entire welath in the club, and he was 80% of the creditors (in terms of amounts owed). A little known fact which shouldn't be forgotten. He gambled and lost - but it hurt him more than anyone else.

However, it is important to note Agilo's hostility. They'd have got their funds back within 2 weeks of plunging us into administration with the sale of Victor Moses and the FA cup run. At which point all revenues would have been earmarked for the next creditors (HMRC) in order of debts owed. We'd certainly be in a precarious situation now - but I feel, we would have still been with SJ at the helm had they not prematurely pulled the trigger. As it turned out they (and all the other creditors) lost out far more than they needed to. We didn't opt for an easy way out. Once our new owners picked up the club, ground and offered the creditors 1p in the £ (as mercenary as it is) they passed the FA's exit admin rules and as such have acted perfectly legally. Thier abbhoration at the previous owners financial policy mean that transfer fees, wages etc etc are to be paid for by the club. No more loans or chairman 'gifts'. If the club doesn't make money, then we won't spend it. As such we are relying on youth and have a nice buffer within our wage structure. Should we stay up this season, then the championship agreement with SKY will land us more in revenue next season and so the budget increases slightly again.

Back on topic - in terms of loyalty and paying back the club who gave him his chance - I think it'd be great if Murray stayed with you guys next term. We have our eyes on the permanent signing of James Vaughan - and that would do me nicely. If Murray did come over from the Dark Side ;-) then I'd welcome him with open arms.

One fianl note - whilst I see the optimism around your club, and hope that we have two memorable matches next season, please recognise that despite our recent failings, we are very much a club with excitement and optimism flowing through. Young, enthusiastic chairmen, with a young, hungry club legend for a manager. This season of rebuilding could be followed by solid progress next. If Murray has met with Dougie and our chairmen over a move - it is possible his head may have been turned as their enthusiasm is infectious. Particularly if reports are to be believed that he has effectively been offered double his salary!

Whilst I do uphold the Palace / Brighton rivalry, I also see there is much more to life than just hating....well done on promotion. Looking forward to battle with you guys next year (hopefully).

...and you can piss off with your sensible reasoning!! Seriously thanks for that post - good to hear from an intelligent / coherent Palace fan. Still think you cheated though!

 

[Pavilionaire]

The key point is this is not about Murray, it's about the Albion's wages ceiling. In particular, it's about whether the ceiling is at the correct level or not.

Bloom knows what money the club will have at it's disposal. It would be irresponsible of Bloom to break the wage structure to accommodate one or two players and could set us up for a fall. I like the approach of setting a cap on wages and communicating that to the players now. Anyone who wants away can go with our blessing - Murray included. He's got a family to feed and if he can get a shedload more money at Palace then so be it.

In Gus We Trust. But up to a point. Losing, say, all 4 of Murray, Bennett, Calderon and Bridcutt over the summer would have a disastrous effect on the side. Even Sir Alex failed to adequately replace the likes of Ronaldo and Tevez, with Chelsea winning the double last season.

 

[Brovion]

I agree, it is very low, but you would do the same if given the opportunity, no doubt?

Yes, we probably would. I'd like to think that we'd have a bit more grace than to come on other clubs' forums and boast about how 'successful' Administration was and how we're now a stable club that has learnt its lesson - but to be honest we'd probably do that as well!

But that doesn't detract from the fact it was 'wrong'. Clubs like yourself and Portsmouth (and before that Leeds and before that Leicester) manage to transmit your financial problems to other clubs like a virus. Clubs pay inflated wages they can't afford, so in order to compete other clubs have to do the same. Plymouth (one of your relegation rivals last season) are now paying the penalty for trying to compete with you.

If clubs want to live like that then fair enough. But what SHOULD happen when the shit hits the fan and the financial house of cards comes crashing down is that clubs like yours should go bust and start again. That's what the little ones have to do, so why should the bigger ones be different? Then we wouldn't be having this conversation as you'd be discussing how your first season in the Dogfood Division Three South had gone and whether groundsharing with Sutton Utd was going to be better than groundsharing with Carshalton Athletic. And how you'd never visit the retail park that was being built on the site of Selhurst Park.

 

[murraymint]

Jake Robinson seems to be adding fuel to flames on twitter now too...

Responding to a post about Murray...


@wearebrighton I've heard this from a few different football people the last couple of weeks.

 

[MattBackHome]

I don't usually post on other forums...

...I also see there is much more to life than just hating....well done on promotion. Looking forward to battle with you guys next year (hopefully).

Good postage.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Despite the myths, our financial black hole only stemmed from transfers and wages we could not afford in the final 18 months to a year before we were placed in administration.

Oooooooooh RIGHT. That's okay then! ''Quick! We're in the shit, quick best buy some players to make sure we don't go down and then wipe off those debts accured through their wages and transfer fees when we go into admin!''

Dirty f***ing cheats. Told you.

 

[Palace4ever]

Without the financial shenanigans you would have been in a lower division kicking around with the clubs who were spending within their means. In some ways the gamble has paid off as you are still in the Championship - but the stench will take a lot longer to clear.

Well you've just gone and proven that you've commented without reading the context. Your post simply isn't true. We've survived the championship without big spending on players (even managed a Prem season) and most of our money went on renting our own ground. Last season our players didn't get paid and we didn't spend a single penny in the transfer market, got docked 10 points and still stayed up. Now that in itslef has sohwn that we didn't 'spend our way to survival'. I am not condoing some of the more reckless financial habbits our club had. What I am saying, however, is that we simply borrowed from the wrong people and never recovered from the first administration (which wasn't caused by spanking money on players). you yourselves had oner £9m of debt a few years back. Thankfully for you guys - your lenders were content to wait for their money via the repayment plan. Ours wasn't. I don't see how one is 'cheating' and one is not. In both instances the club didn't have the funds to complete whatever transaction was required and so the money was borrowed.

Had we no intention of ever paying it back and 'declared bankruptcy' a la Leicester I'd understand the vitriol.

 

[Meade's Ball]

if he does go, then by jingo i'd feel a bit betrayed. But i felt that last year with Calderon's likely farewell. We'll see what happens eh.

 

[Palace4ever]

Oooooooooh RIGHT. That's okay then! ''Quick! We're in the shit, quick best buy some players to make sure we don't go down and then wipe off those debts accured through their wages and transfer fees when we go into admin!''

Dirty f***ing cheats. Told you.

Having re-read my post, the wording was all wrong. What I meant by that, was the wages we paid the players in the final 12 months (half of which they never received) were the only ones that we couldn't afford. We didn't spend on transfer fees, and we were relying on player sales to fund the wages. We certainly were'nt agreeing massive contracts with anyone once SJ's personal finance ran out.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Your wage bill is/was £800k a month, no? Presumably a drop since Warnock and co moved on.

You don't think someone like Ambrose was re-signed on big money?

 

[Palace4ever]

I don't know the exact figures - but that sounds about right for last season. Most of those wages were agreed when SJ was still sitting (relatively) pretty financially. Sadly, our rent went up as the company that owned Selhurst hit the skids - all of a sudden those wages (which SJ was financing) pushed our outgoings over what was affordable. As such (having to honour the contract) SJ borrowed from what turned out to be the wrong people. Abramovich does this on a larger scale - he spends his money how he wants. If things take a turn for the worse later on you get royally stuffed. I agree that as a business model it sucked - but he chose to spend his money how he saw fit. He ran out of it, and the club suffered. This is no different to any other club who relies on a sugar daddy. For some, the party ends, the bubble bursts and it is not just your club that suffers.

Thankfully - FIFA regulations are coming into play which will mean (as it stands) of all the prem teams, only Aresnal would pass the financial fair play.

 

[Dick Knights Mumm]

Well you've just gone and proven that you've commented without reading the context. Your post simply isn't true. We've survived the championship without big spending on players (even managed a Prem season) and most of our money went on renting our own ground. Last season our players didn't get paid and we didn't spend a single penny in the transfer market, got docked 10 points and still stayed up. Now that in itslef has sohwn that we didn't 'spend our way to survival'. I am not condoing some of the more reckless financial habbits our club had. What I am saying, however, is that we simply borrowed from the wrong people and never recovered from the first administration (which wasn't caused by spanking money on players). you yourselves had oner £9m of debt a few years back. Thankfully for you guys - your lenders were content to wait for their money via the repayment plan. Ours wasn't. I don't see how one is 'cheating' and one is not. In both instances the club didn't have the funds to complete whatever transaction was required and so the money was borrowed.

Had we no intention of ever paying it back and 'declared bankruptcy' a la Leicester I'd understand the vitriol.

Transfer fees are not the only part of player costs. In the last 12 months you have paid your creditors 1p in the £1 and yet you are now affording to pay wages sufficient to tempt players from a well run Club. Plus ca change.

 

[supaseagull]

personally I coudn't care less if Murray stayed or went. He's had a great season in a very good team but the jury's out on whether he'd cope in the Championship which is a completely different ball game.

We don't know either but Poyet may have told him to start looking for another club if he's not signed a contract so perhaps that's had an impact.

Whatever happens, I know Gus will get us the replacement striker we need for next year so just chill!

 

[Gritt23]

can anyone really see him pitching up at Selhurst Park ?

Yes, I can. But in a Brighton shirt, and running the Palace defence ragged.

 

[Braders]

Far too sensible and reasoned. Here's how it works, you go "hahahahahahaha gayboys", we go "suprised you have internet in your caravan you pikey."

Please observe these rules in future.

but as for the original post , fair play

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

Murray has been going ever since he first joined us because of one reason or another.

If Gus wanted to keep the fella so bad, im sure we could & maybe just maybe Gus just has bigger and better plans. Somehow I think he will sign a new contract now promotion has been acheived.

Cillax People


Gus has it under control

 

[Bozza]

Why has this blatant non story fishing reached 13 pages geez

Because it is true. Is that why?

 

[Sam Ovett]

But we do not know if it is true

 

[Easy 10]

Yes, I can. But in a Brighton shirt, and running the Palace defence ragged.