[News] Leaving Neverland- Michael Jackson documentary

[LlcoolJ]

Before any Beatles fans bite: - Yes you're right. I am a music snob. Feel free to treat my opinions with distain. It's enough for me to know that I'm right without having to convince anyone else.

It's ok. I think they're shit.

 

[Icy Gull]

I'm sure most are ashamed of not realising what happened.
No, they weren't being paid off, they were being naive, and their kids were telling them nothing was happening.

Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely.

 

[LlcoolJ]

Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely.

I'll reserve judgement until I've seen it but I thought the point was that they weren't all paid off. Some of the kids denied anything wrong was happening at the time?

 

[Goldstone1976]

Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely.

You haven't seen Abducted in plain sight yet, have you? Have a watch and get back to me...

Doesn't involve cash, but does involve repeated stupidity of just the absolute dumbest type. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

 

[Triggaaar]

Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely.

Exactly what money are you saying they were given? Jacko's place was a party paradise for kids, and he was generous (which was insignificant in relation to his wealth). It was the best time of the kids' lives and they were with their families too. The kids were groomed and didn't feel that they were being abused, and didn't want their parents to know.

 

[Pavilionaire]

I will certainly be watching. Like many, I have never believed that Jackson was innocent, and have found it disturbing that his reputation has been in no way tarnished whilst others have been outed for their despicable behaviour.

This should change that.

According to K*nt And The Gang's song on YouTube:

Michael Jackson
Here’s the basic facts, son
He was born black
He died white
And in the middle he fiddled with kids

Wacko Jacko
Died of a heart attack-o
He won some awards
For his records
****ed up his face, spunked ten million quid

He was born black
He died white
And in the middle he fiddled with kids

 

[Icy Gull]

Exactly what money are you saying they were given? Jacko's place was a party paradise for kids, and he was generous (which was insignificant in relation to his wealth). It was the best time of the kids' lives and they were with their families too. The kids were groomed and didn't feel that they were being abused, and didn't want their parents to know.

I haven’t seen the programme but I was thinking of this:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_child_sexual_abuse_accusations_against_Michael_Jackson

 

[Triggaaar]

I haven’t seen the programme but I was thinking of this:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_child_sexual_abuse_accusations_against_Michael_Jackson

But that's completely different to what you were saying.

You said that the parents were taking money, which was more important than their kids' well-being.
I said
"I'm sure most are ashamed of not realising what happened.
No, they weren't being paid off, they were being naive, and their kids were telling them nothing was happening."
and you replied
"Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely."

but the case you've linked to is when the family were being paid off after the abuse. The abuse had already happened, they weren't allowing it to happen in order to get money.

 

[ManOfSussex]

Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely.

According to the documentary maker I saw interviewed on Newsnight last night, the money and his ways in dealing with the parents was grooming too.

 

[Nixonator]

Undoubtedly something untoward going on which money solved in life. I figured this would be brought up again in death.

Whichever way it goes, his music should not be suppressed. Censoring art is a worrying premise indeed.

 

[beorhthelm]

Seriously?

He paid one of the abused children $23m to keep quiet.

im commenting on the TV production and presentation, not the story.

 

[Icy Gull]

But that's completely different to what you were saying.

You said that the parents were taking money, which was more important than their kids' well-being.
I said
"I'm sure most are ashamed of not realising what happened.
No, they weren't being paid off, they were being naive, and their kids were telling them nothing was happening."
and you replied
"Yeah ‘cos people give you a shitload of money for no reason. No grown up is that naive surely."

but the case you've linked to is when the family were being paid off after the abuse. The abuse had already happened, they weren't allowing it to happen in order to get money.

Hmm we’ll have to agree to differ on this as I do not believe that any normal parent wouldn’t have spotted what was likely to be going down, regardless of what the children said. In the case I linked it appears they let it happen, even encourged it, and then demanded hush money. Far too easy to say they were naive and then they end up pocketing 23 million. So clever enough to get a lawyer on the case but not bright enough to see that their child was very likely being abused, with their encouragement..

Call me a cynic but I just don’t believe it.

 

[The Clamp]

Hmm we’ll have to agree to differ on this as I do not believe that any normal parent wouldn’t have spotted what was likely to be going down, regardless of what the children said. In the case I linked it appears they let it happen, even encourged it, and then demanded hush money. Far too easy to say they were naive and then they end up pocketing 23 million. So clever enough to get a lawyer on the case but not bright enough to see that their child was very likely being abused, with their encouragement..

Call me a cynic but I just don’t beleive it.

Quite. If people don't believe that parents do such things to their own kids come and spend a few nights in the safe houses and women's refuges I do safeguarding work for. And that's for a few pounds. Imagine what some could do for $23m.
Look at the likes of Macauly Culkin's parents. Allegedly stole all his money, allegedly handed him over to Jackson whenever he wanted him. Grim.

 

[Triggaaar]

Hmm we’ll have to agree to differ on this as I do not believe that any normal parent wouldn’t have spotted what was likely to be going down, regardless of what the children said.

That's one thing, but that's not what you were saying. You were saying the parents turned a blind eye because of the money they were getting, and they put that money ahead of their children's well-being. That's not the case, they weren't getting loads of money.

In the case I linked it appears they let it happen, even encourged it, and then demanded hush money.

I don't see any evidence that they let it happen. The boy's parents weren't together and the father didn't want his son spending so much time with Jackson.

Far too easy to say they were naive and then they end up pocketing 23 million. So clever enough to get a lawyer on the case but not bright enough to see that their child was very likely being abused, with their encouragement..

Once they thought he was abusing their child, of course they'd get a lawyer. That doesn't require them to be bright. And obviously at some point the father did think his son was being abused, and then he acted. It's not surprising they didn't realise at the start.

 

[SAC]

Undoubtedly something untoward going on which money solved in life. I figured this would be brought up again in death.

Whichever way it goes, his music should not be suppressed. Censoring art is a worrying premise indeed.

Isn't this natural? You don't hear Gary Glitter and Rolf Harris on the radio any more.

 

[Icy Gull]

That's one thing, but that's not what you were saying. You were saying the parents turned a blind eye because of the money they were getting, and they put that money ahead of their children's well-being. That's not the case, they weren't getting loads of money.

I don't see any evidence that they let it happen. The boy's parents weren't together and the father didn't want his son spending so much time with Jackson.

Once they thought he was abusing their child, of course they'd get a lawyer. That doesn't require them to be bright. And obviously at some point the father did think his son was being abused, and then he acted. It's not surprising they didn't realise at the start.

OK let’s assume that you are right and the parents didn’t expect to get a big wedge of money when the sleepovers started.

I am intrigued as to how you come to the conclusion that they wouldn’t have realised at the start what was likely to be happening? No idea if you have kids but I certainly wouldn’t have let any of my kids have a sleepover in a man’s bed when they were young. The fact that he was a star would have rung just as many alarm bells to me as it would if 40 year old Joe down the street suggested it. It is not normal, in fact it shouts grooming and should have done right from the start imo.

 

[beorhthelm]

Isn't this natural? You don't hear Gary Glitter and Rolf Harris on the radio any more.

to be fair you didnt hear them much anyway. there wont be anything official from stations but expect later MJ work to be dropped from play lists.

 

[symyjym]

On the Chanel 5 program last night I think it was the father of one of the kids called Jordan, who pulled out of the original case; after questioning the child about something happening and the child denying, his dad took him to the dentists to put him under anaesthetic and coerced a story out of him under the influence. In this instance I think it says more about the father than Jackson.

 

[GT49er]

On the Chanel 5 program last night I think it was the father of one of the kids called Jordan, who pulled out of the original case; after questioning the child about something happening and the child denying, his dad took him to the dentists to put him under anaesthetic and coerced a story out of him under the influence. In this instance I think it says more about the father than Jackson.

Frankly that says quite a lot about the dentist...........................

 

[GT49er]

I can’t be the only one that thinks his music is meh?

No, you're certainly not alone. Couldn't stand any of it. Horrid voice too.