[Albion] Kieran McKenna

[Guinness Boy]

Anything can be spun though. You don't like Potter and see this as a reason not to employ Potter. Whereas I see it as a reason to employ, he's already built a great midfield out of raw pieces and can do so again, none of Bissouma, Caicedo, Mac Allister had any decent experience prior to being thrust into our central midfield and Potter made it work. He changed our style and blooded future stars all whilst keeping us away from the relegation zone, thats proven. I worry that someone like McKenna with little experience may not find it as straightforward

He most certainly didn't keep us away from the relegation zone. In his first season we finished 15th, winning just 9 games out of 38, the same as 17th placed Aston Villa. The season after was even worse with the same number of wins and 16th place. Burnley in 17th won a game more than we did.

The above - and the fact that most of the non-wins were at home - is exactly why I don't like him. Looking at the bloke's record objectively he's had one good season in the UK. Finished mid table with Swansea in the Championship. 15th and 16th with us, 9th (admittedly decent) and then sacked by Chelsea mid-season for, erm, not winning games.

 

[Johnny RoastBeef]

may be a coincidence, but Potter is house-hunting in the area.

 

[Biscuit]

He most certainly didn't keep us away from the relegation zone. In his first season we finished 15th, winning just 9 games out of 38, the same as 17th placed Aston Villa. The season after was even worse with the same number of wins and 16th place. Burnley in 17th won a game more than we did.

The above - and the fact that most of the non-wins were at home - is exactly why I don't like him. Looking at the bloke's record objectively he's had one good season in the UK. Finished mid table with Swansea in the Championship. 15th and 16th with us, 9th (admittedly decent) and then sacked by Chelsea mid-season for, erm, not winning games.

Completely agree with this. We were so patient during the ridiculously long barren spells and the predictable "horse shoe of death" football we played in the final third. In return we got smart-arse comments about "history lessons" before he left us completely in the lurch when it suited him.

 

[Guinness Boy]

may be a coincidence, but Potter is house-hunting in the area.

He never left the area as far as I know.

 

[Johnny RoastBeef]

He never left the area as far as I know.

probably nothing in it then

 

[Munkfish]

may be a coincidence, but Potter is house-hunting in the area.

He never left, his Mrs still holds a class at a local seafront establishment.

 

[tstanbur]

He most certainly didn't keep us away from the relegation zone. In his first season we finished 15th, winning just 9 games out of 38, the same as 17th placed Aston Villa. The season after was even worse with the same number of wins and 16th place. Burnley in 17th won a game more than we did.

The above - and the fact that most of the non-wins were at home - is exactly why I don't like him. Looking at the bloke's record objectively he's had one good season in the UK. Finished mid table with Swansea in the Championship. 15th and 16th with us, 9th (admittedly decent) and then sacked by Chelsea mid-season for, erm, not winning games.

But surely what Potter did in those first 2 seasons was "par" for us considering our budget/wages compared to the rest of the division.

Was the expectation really for him to do any better than he did? TB would have sacked him otherwise.

Surely the aim was still initially to survive but with an improved style of play (apparent immediately) and a plan to move up the table over a few seasons -and he/we did.

Finishing 9th in his 3rd season and then leaving us in 4th was exceeding most people's expectations (the wages/budget still one of the lowest).

 

[sparkie]

may be a coincidence, but Potter is house-hunting in the area.

I thought he already lived in the area.

 

[Berty23]

I’m a riot at parties.

This is football, our club and I give a shit. Ultimately we’re managing decline… I’m not sure I’d want the job right now.

That said, we’re a better option than utd - that’s for sure.

Why are we managing decline? Why are you happy to say some players are declining but not acknowledge others improving? You appear to have sold a few players this summer and assumed we have not brought any in. It is the most pessimistic take possible!

We did not want to seek caicedo last summer but you can’t reject 110 million for him. It is crazy money. Yes our squad has a couple of holes but the injuries have been a joke.

 

[Dibdab]

I disagree.

But I’m happy to let you have the moral high ground.

Let’s see how things pan out.

1 GK Mathew Ryan 2 DF Bruno (club captain)[15] 3 DF Gaëtan Bong 4 DF Shane Duffy 5 DF Lewis Dunk (vice-captain)[16] 6 MF Dale Stephens 7 MF Beram Kayal 8 MF Yves Bissouma 9 FW Jürgen Locadia 10 FW Florin Andone 11 MF Anthony Knockaert 13 MF Pascal Groß

No. Pos. Player 14 DF Leon Balogun 16 FW Alireza Jahanbakhsh 17 FW Glenn Murray 19 FW José Izquierdo 20 MF Solly March 22 DF Martín Montoya 23 GK Jason Steele 24 MF Davy Pröpper 27 GK David Button 30 DF Bernardo 33 DF Dan Burn

This is the squad Potter inherited. Other than Bissouma can you let me know how many of this squad get in our current first 11 that aren't already in it? And Glen Murray was too old at this point even for Potter to play so dont say him.

 

[sparkie]

Completely agree with this. We were so patient during the ridiculously long barren spells and the predictable "horse shoe of death" football we played in the final third. In return we got smart-arse comments about "history lessons" before he left us completely in the lurch when it suited him.

Potter's history text books are way out of date now.

There is a new one about Europa League qualification and participation so I hope he has a bigger bookcase.

 

[Hotchilidog]

But surely what Potter did in those first 2 seasons was "par" for us considering our budget/wages compared to the rest of the division.

Was the expectation really for him to do any better than he did? TB would have sacked him otherwise.

Surely the aim was still initially to survive but with an improved style of play (apparent immediately) and a plan to move up the table over a few seasons -and we/we did.

Finishing 9th in his 3rd season and then leaving us in 4th was exceeding most people's expectations (the wages/budget still one of the lowest).

This is spot on. I completely understand the anger at Potter, I am a big fan of keeping a grudge going as some of my friends know, but this rewriting of history of Potter as a terrible coach is just garbage.

Potter took over a broken side that had to rely on Palace beating Cardiff to stay up. We had been playing in a solidly defensive style for two seasons and Potter had to change that. You cannot do that overnight, it takes time for the players to adjust and for the squad to evolve. It was a slow burner but it was all starting to click when Potter walked out.

I know we had some winless runs but the football was good. We were creating shedloads of good chances but the finishing was woeful and on occasion we came up against inspired keepers.

I respect the opinion of those who do not want him back, it's a valid opinion and I get it. Me I'm more ambivalent as he think he is good coach. That said I'd much rather we looked elsewhere, Potter would be extremely low on any list I'd compile and in all honesty I think that is the same for Bloom.

Anyway I thought this was the McKenna thread? Any updates this morning?

 

[Kalimantan Gull]

For Potter to return there we’re need to be a number of unlikely occurrences in my view…

1. GP to want/need to do it
2. TB eat humble pie and re employ a m@n who walked out on him
3. TB to give said man a pay rise
4. BHAFC to re employ GPs back room team
5. Senior pros to be accepting of GP
6. Fans to be accepting of GP
Amd possibly TB to have planned this in advance

Not happening in my book.

I think 1-5 are easy and 6 is ultimately irrelevant.

In the end he went with TB's blessing. You can't listen to the club's comments about not changing our policy on recruitment and spending, the comments about allowing players and managers to further their careers elsewhere, without concluding that they have no personal issue with GP leaving. Disappointed sure, but it would be completely incongruous for us to let RDZ leave in the manner he did if we were upset with Potter for walking out.

As for the Senior Pros, they all understand the football industry and they are all ambitious. Each of them ultimately wants to play for Real Madrid or Manchester United or Barcelona or Liverpool or Milan or Arsenal or wherever. Many of Potter's former players are already doing that, from Cucurella to White to Caicedo to Bissouma to Mac Allister to Trossard., and - yeah - every single one of those six pushed for their move in some way. Would be terribly hypocritical for these players to be angry at Potter for also taking an opportunity with a 'big' club.

Which leaves number 6. Fan power can be, well, powerful. But we can see on here its definitely not universal, quite a few of us would not only accept him returning but actively want that to happen. But there are clearly loud voices against. Many Chairmen would bow to that, but can you honestly see TB being one of them? He doesn't sway to outside forces, he does what he thinks his best for the future of the club. He didn't give in to RDZ's demands, he didn't keep Hughton employed, he hasn't given in to a lot of player pressure, he doesn't seem to listen to the fans advisory board and he won't let fan angst stop him employing the manager that he wants. If thats Potter, he'll do it - and he knows we'll fall in line because supporting TB is the one sacrosanct thing about us.

 

[Kosh]

1 GK Mathew Ryan 2 DF Bruno (club captain)[15] 3 DF Gaëtan Bong 4 DF Shane Duffy 5 DF Lewis Dunk (vice-captain)[16] 6 MF Dale Stephens 7 MF Beram Kayal 8 MF Yves Bissouma 9 FW Jürgen Locadia 10 FW Florin Andone 11 MF Anthony Knockaert 13 MF Pascal Groß

No. Pos. Player 14 DF Leon Balogun 16 FW Alireza Jahanbakhsh 17 FW Glenn Murray 19 FW José Izquierdo 20 MF Solly March 22 DF Martín Montoya 23 GK Jason Steele 24 MF Davy Pröpper 27 GK David Button 30 DF Bernardo 33 DF Dan Burn

This is the squad Potter inherited. Other than Bissouma can you let me know how many of this squad get in our current first 11 that aren't already in it? And Glen Murray was too old at this point even for Potter to play so dont say him.

Well, I’d say Montoya, even Bruno and possibly an up for it Propper… Burn too. Izquierdo was awesome when fit… I also loved the mad Romanian… could have used his spice during our limp run in.

When you add in Steele, Gross, Dunk… now much older …

Like I say, take the high ground - I still think our squad has gaping holes in it, and is weakened as such in spite of the improvements in certain positions… age, it’s catching up with a few…

We’re hardly world beaters, marginally better yes, but the glaring problems in the squad have left us very, very meh.

I’m happy to wait and see how things improve

 

[um bongo molongo]

As usual, NSC has descended into polarised positions when the truth is somewhere in the middle.

- it’s true to say the squad now is better than Potter inherited
- but it’s also true to say that it’s worse than 12-18 months ago and at a critical point, with mainstays like Dunk, Veltman, and Gross starting to enter the twilight, some well into the twilight (Welbeck, and I’d argue Milner is fully into the dark!), and a number of youngsters who may or may not turn out to be brilliant but who will definitely be inconsistent and require careful development.

So this next appointment really is crucial. The squad is unbalanced (especially in midfield and at FB), and lacks pace and athleticism. A strong transfer window, and a good coach developing our youngsters alongside some good acquisitions and we can be a top 10 side looking upwards at Europe. But a poor window and a bum appointment and it’s easy to see us bottom half looking downwards.

 

[Mellotron]

1 GK Mathew Ryan 2 DF Bruno (club captain)[15] 3 DF Gaëtan Bong 4 DF Shane Duffy 5 DF Lewis Dunk (vice-captain)[16] 6 MF Dale Stephens 7 MF Beram Kayal 8 MF Yves Bissouma 9 FW Jürgen Locadia 10 FW Florin Andone 11 MF Anthony Knockaert 13 MF Pascal Groß

No. Pos. Player 14 DF Leon Balogun 16 FW Alireza Jahanbakhsh 17 FW Glenn Murray 19 FW José Izquierdo 20 MF Solly March 22 DF Martín Montoya 23 GK Jason Steele 24 MF Davy Pröpper 27 GK David Button 30 DF Bernardo 33 DF Dan Burn

This is the squad Potter inherited. Other than Bissouma can you let me know how many of this squad get in our current first 11 that aren't already in it? And Glen Murray was too old at this point even for Potter to play so dont say him.

Our current squad is LIGHTYEARS ahead of this.

So many disregard the injuries far too easily this season. Our current best choice 11 is a Top 10 side easily, probably Top 8 IMO.

We finished 11th despite not having a huge number of players available for most of the season.

 

[tstanbur]

This is spot on. I completely understand the anger at Potter, I am a big fan of keeping a grudge going as some of my friends know, but this rewriting of history of Potter as a terrible coach is just garbage.

Potter took over a broken side that had to rely on Palace beating Cardiff to stay up. We had been playing in a solidly defensive style for two seasons and Potter had to change that. You cannot do that overnight, it takes time for the players to adjust and for the squad to evolve. It was a slow burner but it was all starting to click when Potter walked out.

I know we had some winless runs but the football was good. We were creating shedloads of good chances but the finishing was woeful and on occasion we came up against inspired keepers.

I respect the opinion of those who do not want him back, it's a valid opinion and I get it. Me I'm more ambivalent as he think he is good coach. That said I'd much rather we looked elsewhere, Potter would be extremely low on any list I'd compile and in all honesty I think that is the same for Bloom.

Anyway I thought this was the McKenna thread? Any updates this morning?

Completely agree with nearly all of that although he did pretty much change things "overnight".

We went from 90 mins of defending just trying not to lose to bringing on 2 strikers when winning 1-0 away to Watford in his first game (ended up 3-0 and both strikers subbed on scored.)

He seems to have this reputation with some for his football being boring/negative/defensive which is completely untrue. He aimed to win every game and as you say was let down massively by the finishing.

 

[Guinness Boy]

But surely what Potter did in those first 2 seasons was "par" for us considering our budget/wages compared to the rest of the division.

Was the expectation really for him to do any better than he did? TB would have sacked him otherwise.

Surely the aim was still initially to survive but with an improved style of play (apparent immediately) and a plan to move up the table over a few seasons -and he/we did.

Finishing 9th in his 3rd season and then leaving us in 4th was exceeding most people's expectations (the wages/budget still one of the lowest).

The assertion I was challenging was that we weren't ever in a relegation battle, which was clearly bollocks.

Everyone will have their own take on GP of course. But Hughton's first PL season (with a Championship squad) was:

15th
W9 D13 L16 Pts 40 GD -20

Potter's second season when he'd had a year to bed in tactics was

16th
W9 D14 L15 Pts 41 GD -6

They're pretty much exactly the same season, though in 20/21 GP had the below squad available to him after the transfer window in January.

 

[WhingForPresident]

We aren't even mentioned in this piece on SSN:

Kieran McKenna: Manchester United meet with representatives of Ipswich boss amid Chelsea interest

Manchester United and Chelsea could be about to go head-to-head for Ipswich boss Kieran McKenna; McKennas reps have met with Man Utd, Sky Sports News has learned; United have yet to decide whether to stick with Erik ten Hag next season; Chelsea are looking for a new boss

www.skysports.com

 

[Oh_aye]

I said elsewhere that Roberto has damaged our reputation, especially in two key aspects:

- recruitment, consistently bashing our model in public, and then saying his vision (spending plans) could not be aligned with the club - not a good look.

- other coaches think he’s a genius - see pep, Klopp et al … yet he couldn’t get a tune out of us post Christmas, near relegation form - injuries aside, not a good look.

Your comments around Potter are spot on, he’d be inheriting a squad not much better/proven than the one he picked up from Hughton - with Dunk now creaking…

It’s not great… littler wonder prospective coaches will want to ponder… and as you say, we’re no where near as attractive a proposition as we were the day Roberto rocked up.

Decline, asset stripping, average recruitment… a combination of all three…

I live in hope, we can turn it round, but I reckon it’ll take two seasons minimum… sustainability is key and patience

Blimey. I always think we have a great squad until I come on here and hear we're in extreme decline.

We are 1 or 2 good purchases away from. A top 6 side again, injuries permitting.