Hillsborough the search for the truth

[Hillian1]

Now I've already admitted on here that I was wrong and that overall Liverpool fans were not to blame, I stand by that. But there were ticket-less fans there, there would have to be, but not in enough numbers to have any impact on the events. It is well known that Fans of all clubs would have a certain few who would try to get into all ticket games including the Cup Final, in fact I know of at least 4 who got into Wembley in 83.

 

[The Large One]

Now I've already admitted on here that I was wrong and that overall Liverpool fans were not to blame, I stand by that. But there were ticket-less fans there, there would have to be, but not in enough numbers to have any impact on the events. It is well known that Fans of all clubs would have a certain few who would try to get into all ticket games including the Cup Final, in fact I know of at least 4 who got into Wembley in 83.

One can mention ticketless fans, but as you point out, they're an irrelevant part of the story.

 

[Falkor]

Surely the FA have a question to answer with the game going ahead with no safety certificates issued for the game

 

[wellquickwoody]

Has Bwian finished yet?

 

[The Large One]

Has Bwian finished yet?

More pertinently - have you?

 

[Simster]

Has Bwian finished yet?

To be honest, you should have finished about half way between your first and last posts. There is no shame in admitting you were completely wrong, especially as it has now been proven.

 

[shoreham moonraker]

If the sun had a shred of decency this should be tomorrows front page

 

[The Grockle]

You don't seem to have much to say on this matter anymore.

I’ve not had a chance to read through the full findings and have only read a very brief summary but it would appear I have to hold my hands up and say that my opinions of the events that day were wrong.

Whilst my opinions of the tragedy were misguided they were never born of prejudice towards Liverpool fans.

My thoughts go out to the friends and families of the victims, I hope they have finally have some closure after all this time.

 

[Bwian]

Has Bwian finished yet?

Keep spewing out your garbage and I'll respond.

 

[perseus]

Surely the FA have a question to answer with the game going ahead with no safety certificates issued for the game

Lots of questions:

Hillsborough disaster: questions the victims' families want answered | Football | guardian.co.uk

However, it would be the Council that issued safety certificates. It is arguable that back then they would be worth the paper they were printed on (arguable)?

I have been consulted on these sort of things in the past. It is also arguable that the Council safety suggestions contributed towards the disaster, allegedly.

If you ever in a car accident with a Police Officer, be very careful over smears. It seems to come naturally to some of them.

 

[wellquickwoody]

Keep spewing out your garbage and I'll respond.

Sadly, you probably will.

 

[ROSM]

Now I've already admitted on here that I was wrong and that overall Liverpool fans were not to blame, I stand by that. But there were ticket-less fans there, there would have to be, but not in enough numbers to have any impact on the events. It is well known that Fans of all clubs would have a certain few who would try to get into all ticket games including the Cup Final, in fact I know of at least 4 who got into Wembley in 83.

the fundamental fact here is that the numbers of people assessed to have gone through the turnstiles or had passed through gate c were not greater than the number of tickets that had been sold for the match. In fact at 3.00 the estimate was that the terrace which could have held c6k was less than 5.5k full. The two pens in the centre were ovefull (c400 more than the capacity which in turn was c900 more than the capcity should have been had an assessment of the crush barriers been undertaken).

so whether there were ticketless fans there is, as TLO said, irrelevant to the causes or effects of the tragedy.

 

[glasfryn]

I worked with a guy who apparently was there that awful day(I have no reason to disbelieve him as he was a rampant Pool fan and a good mate at the time) he never said anything about that day other than eventually the truth would come out. he never spoke about it because every time it came up in conversation he cried uncontrollably and did'nt talk about footy for days.
I cannot say anything about what happened or would ever try to guess what happened either, but today is a good day for those searching for some closure.
RIP those who died there that day.


just a little footnote here I have always thought that thatchers icy fingers were all over everything at this time, and I hope those who are still alive and maybe had something to do with a cover-up hang their heads

 

[perseus]

One can mention ticketless fans, but as you point out, they're an irrelevant part of the story.

Yep, TRUE.

But they were relevant to the Taylor Report. The Taylor Report realised the problems of ticketless fans which is why when capacity crowds are expected (all Albion games) all ticket is the recommendation.

It is The Sun that are to blame for making up the story.

By 1989, all fans would know this for semi-finals. Back in 71 when Albion had their second (in my time) all-ticket affair with Aston Villa the Villa fans did not know this and got in somehow. Some of them got thrown out though.

 

[ROSM]

Sadly, you probably will.

You like to keep picking at the scab here. You made a judgement which has been proven to be wrong. You have cast aspersions on other people who by and large have taken time and extended the courtesy to answer you in a constructive manner. And just when any sensible person would have either apologised or kept quiet you pop your head above the parapet and have a go at Bwian who has spent many hours on here trying to ensure that the truth is delivered and understood.

Keep doing what you are doing - it reflects more on you than on any of your intended targets.

 

[wellquickwoody]

You like to keep picking at the scab here. You made a judgement which has been proven to be wrong. You have cast aspersions on other people who by and large have taken time and extended the courtesy to answer you in a constructive manner. And just when any sensible person would have either apologised or kept quiet you pop your head above the parapet and have a go at Bwian who has spent many hours on here trying to ensure that the truth is delivered and understood.

Keep doing what you are doing - it reflects more on you than on any of your intended targets.

Right, now you are talking shit. Mostly I have avoided being abusive, unlike yourself and Bwian who have constantly derided anyone whose opinion is not a mirror image of yours. Please list my aspersions, show me your courtesy. You really are a prize prick!

 

[TWOCHOICEStom]

Mostly I have avoided being abusive,

You really are a prize prick!

 

[wellquickwoody]

Mostly..........

 

[The Large One]

Right, now you are talking shit. Mostly I have avoided being abusive, unlike yourself and Bwian who have constantly derided anyone whose opinion is not a mirror image of yours. Please list my aspersions, show me your courtesy. You really are a prize prick!

Your opinions are derided principally because - and you have been told this many times, but it has failed to sink in yet - you based them on lies, innuendo and hearsay.

So... who has been talking shit?

 

[Dover]

I don't think the whole truth will come out. I for one would love to see Bernard Ingham's personal diary, but I'm more likely to wing walk on a jet fighter.