GOD: How much do you believe in him?

[DerbyGull]

So there is at least one line in the bible that is as relavent today (could be relavent or totally irrelevant) as it was when it was written. So what?

Which side of the arguement are you again? People do not believe in god when they are born, they are preached to and told to believe. You could argue that those people who believe are therefore sheep. And in the past, most people believed in god (matching your point about this forum), so were they sheep?

Just because people chose to believe what Stephen Fry argued, which was against the church, then they must be the sheep who can't think for themselves? Do you not see how twisted your arguement is? Preachers try to do people's thinking for them, but someone stands against it, people listen, and suddenly they're the sheep. While I respect your right to your opinion, I find your arguements to be totally without logic or fact.

I spoke to a priest the other day and told him i was reading the bible from cover to cover. Rather than impinge his interpretation of the bible and its rules etc on me, he basically said, 'how do YOU interpret' and 'what does it mean to YOU', 'what sense can YOU make out of it'. THAT is not preaching but giving power to the individual to engage their OWN brains. And NOT be a sheep. Maybe in the past people were sheep with regards to religion, in fact that's almost a dead cert, cos we had nothing else. BUT my argument is that in 2011 we can listen to both sides of the argument. We have never been better resourced and equipped than we are now. BUT people still wants things read for them, interpreted for them, put on a plate for them. People have NO excuse now to be sheep.

 

[DerbyGull]

So there is at least one line in the bible that is as relavent today (could be relavent or totally irrelevant) as it was when it was written. So what?

Which side of the arguement are you again? People do not believe in god when they are born, they are preached to and told to believe. You could argue that those people who believe are therefore sheep. And in the past, most people believed in god (matching your point about this forum), so were they sheep?

Just because people chose to believe what Stephen Fry argued, which was against the church, then they must be the sheep who can't think for themselves? Do you not see how twisted your arguement is? Preachers try to do people's thinking for them, but someone stands against it, people listen, and suddenly they're the sheep. While I respect your right to your opinion, I find your arguements to be totally without logic or fact.

Can you honestly say YOU have genuinely (and not picked out bits), looked at both sides of the argument, and i mean read lots on both side? Or you on the science side and not willing to look beyond that?

 

[DerbyGull]

People are sheep. They often do or believe what is fashionable or what simply keeps them alive.

Agreed. And religion and/or god is totally out of fashion right now.

The pompous Fry is so full of the self-importance of his own intellect, that he has become unbearable to listen to these days.

Agreed

But he has charisma, and charisma is in the nature of the leaders and preachers who have the gift of persuading the sheep what to think.

Agreed

 

[Mr Burns]

Agreed. And religion and/or god is totally out of fashion right now.



Agreed



Agreed

Funny thing about these regilous freaks.

The spu their vile, but when someone asks something they don't like, they tend to ignore it. The disappear for a while, then came back, still ignoring something they dont like.

I'm sure he'll give an answer soon though. Probably couldn't find an answer by googleing it, so Derbygulls probably waiting for some other freak to give him the answer.

Sad, very sad.

May as well ask again as its funny being ignored

Originally Posted by DerbyGull After both of us getting banned you still want to keep bringing this up?

Do you know when to let something drop?

Obviously not.

I'm no playing your games Burns.


Originally Posted by DerbyGull
And he did create man so great that they could learn skills that would FIX that baby's problem.


EARLIER IN THE THREAD around page 30

Originally Posted by Mr Burns
So what about the millions of babies that die each year? How does that work with them getting into heaven..... let me guess, they are taken by default. So what about a child that dies before reaching double figures? Default again.... where does it stop? Or do you have to have lived on the earth for X amount of years to quailify for a place in heaven?
[missing a couple of 'filler posts'] Then...,.


Originally Posted by DerbyGull
You could say they are the lucky ones, though that sounds cruel as they never had a chance at some of the joys of life, they also never had a chance to do good or bad. When some one dies we're (christians) supposed to believe it's because god 'took them'. And because they never had a chance to commit sin (the thing that keeps us from being in gods presence (being in heaven) when we die) then they will go strainght to heaven possibly to be 'sent back' by god to have another chance.

Mr Burns

So any doctor that FIXES a baby is surely doing the devils work, as God has called the baby, the "lucky baby" into his kingdom, so anyone preventing that from happening is working against god, which you have said numerous times, anyone working against god is doing the devils work.

So by that logic, all doctors must be evil?

Derbygull

Trying to google an answer, or waiting for another freak to help him out

 

[magoo]

I live by my own morals, beliefs and judgement.
You live by the Bible's.
Who is the sheep?

 

[DerbyGull]

I live by my own morals, beliefs and judgement.
You live by the Bible's.
Who is the sheep?

Do you think morals appeared out of thin air?

 

[Mr Burns]

I live by my own morals, beliefs and judgement.
You live by the Bible's.
Who is the sheep?

Funny aint he!! He keeps mentioning the sheep thing, yet is telling everyone how he is still reading the bible, yet follows everything it tells him. And just because a TV presenter done a speech on the evils of the catholic church, all athetists are sheep!!! But then thats the bibles logic for you

 

[magoo]

Do you think morals appeared out of thin air?

Course not, they didn't come from the bible either. On the whole people are good by nature, not through the teachings of a piece of fiction.

 

[Mr Burns]

Do you think morals appeared out of thin air?

Why don't you just go away because you talk shit. When someone picks you up on something, you refuse to answer, and then disappear for a few days, before coming back into the argument, completely ignoring anything that boxed you into a corner.

Just as I said would happen.

Just as what has happened.

Until you stop ducking questions you don't like, how are you seriosuly expecting anyone to listen to you?

 

[DerbyGull]

Course not, they didn't come from the bible either. On the whole people are good by nature, not through the teachings of a piece of fiction.

Once we were Neanderthals who didn't think twice about killing each other. So how go from that, to beings with morals. The ten commandments are pretty good morals, don't you think?

 

[Triggaaar]

I spoke to a priest the other day and told him i was reading the bible from cover to cover. Rather than impinge his interpretation of the bible and its rules etc on me, he basically said, 'how do YOU interpret' and 'what does it mean to YOU', 'what sense can YOU make out of it'. THAT is not preaching but giving power to the individual to engage their OWN brains. And NOT be a sheep. Maybe in the past people were sheep with regards to religion, in fact that's almost a dead cert, cos we had nothing else. BUT my argument is that in 2011 we can listen to both sides of the argument. We have never been better resourced and equipped than we are now.

I agree with all of that. The fact is, the priest has more chance of you following if he allows you more freedom in your belief. If he tells you that evolution is made up, he's more likely to lose you. And I'm not saying he/she is just a synical trickster, if your priest believes, but is not sure about the bible, then what choice do they have but to suggest you find what it means to you?

Can you honestly say YOU have genuinely (and not picked out bits), looked at both sides of the argument, and i mean read lots on both side? Or you on the science side and not willing to look beyond that?

I am most certainly willing to look beyond science. My daughter started at a C of E school last week, and I tell her that there is a god, because I think it's better for her at her age to believe in god than see the world as I do. I would be delighted if I believed in god, it would be amazing to think it doesn't all end when we die, but I can't make myself believe. My main problem is the lies we're told, that don't stack up.

I've read some from both sides, but not that much (I don't know the bible well), and I don't close my mind to the arguements. As others have argued here, I find that what the church asks us to believe keeps having to change as facts prove each arguement to be false, and that is my main problem with being asked to believe in the bible.

 

[magoo]

Once we were Neanderthals who didn't think twice about killing each other. So how go from that, to beings with morals. The ten commandments are pretty good morals, don't you think?

Wow.

okay... your knowledge of Neanderthal man is obviously superior to mine. But, I would have guessed even back then it was in the best interests of Man to be morally good even on a basic level. Otherwise we wouldn't have evolved.

OH! On that note, by bringing up Neanderthal man are you accepting evolution rather than intelligent design??

 

[sten_super]

Once we were Neanderthals who didn't think twice about killing each other. So how go from that, to beings with morals. The ten commandments are pretty good morals, don't you think?

These morals didn't start with Christianity though, did they?

Ancient Egypt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[magoo]

My daughter started at a C of E school last week, and I tell her that there is a god, because I think it's better for her at her age to believe in god than see the world as I do.

I'm surprised at that to be honest. You obviously know best for your child but I think in that situation i would simply say some people do believe and some don't and leave it up to the child as they get older.

 

[Triggaaar]

Once we were Neanderthals who didn't think twice about killing each other. So how go from that, to beings with morals. The ten commandments are pretty good morals, don't you think?

Firstly, we were never Neanderthals. We did not evolve from Neanderthals, just like we didn't evolve from apes, we just have common ancestors. Secondly, the ten commandments are good morals, but killing ete existed before and after them. Good deeds, morals etc, also existed before the ten commandments were made up. But you know that right?

 

[Mr Burns]

Wow.

okay... your knowledge of Neanderthal man is obviously superior to mine. But, I would have guessed even back then it was in the best interests of Man to be morally good even on a basic level. Otherwise we wouldn't have evolved.

OH! On that note, by bringing up Neanderthal man are you accepting evolution rather than intelligent design??

Oh. Oh. Has he slipped up again. I think he has.

He'll go missing now for a couple of days.

(Im not saying this to bully him. Just so anyone who can't be bothered to read the whole thread, can get an idea of what sort of person they are dealing with, because like me, he's been in this thread from the very beginning)

 

[Triggaaar]

I'm surprised at that to be honest. You obviously know best for your child but I think in that situation i would simply say some people do believe and some don't and leave it up to the child as they get older.

From my point of view, it's not really about believing, it's about explaning death to them. Easier to have them think it'll all be ok, than wake up in the night crying.

 

[HovaGirl]

I am most certainly willing to look beyond science. My daughter started at a C of E school last week, and I tell her that there is a god, because I think it's better for her at her age to believe in god than see the world as I do.

I agree with this and said as much earlier in the thread. Children can make their own minds up later, when they have more information and are capable of rational, independent thinking.

 

[HovaGirl]

Once we were Neanderthals who didn't think twice about killing each other. So how go from that, to beings with morals. The ten commandments are pretty good morals, don't you think?

How do we know Neanderthals "didn't think twice about killing each other"? Men are still don't "think twice about killing each other" today. Everyone is born with a conscience, which is where our morality lies. Not everyone can or does use their conscience for guidance, however.

 

[Commander]

I haven't read this thread and only just had a brief skim of the last couple of pages, but I am astonished to find that 31 people on this board know for a FACT that God exists. Amazing. And 171 know for a FACT that he doesn't exist.

I know for a FACT that 202 people out of the 432 who voted are WRONG.