GOD: How much do you believe in him?

[Tyrone Biggums]

As a converted atheist, I look at the evidence that overwhelmingly suggests that life evolved on this planet. I believe that this is inconsistent with the existence of a deity, and therefore, in the abscence of any evidence to the contrary, God as defined by the major religions of this planet does not exist.

The evidence you look at isn't evidence to disprove a god. It's merely evidence to dispute a biblical god.

Disproving the bilical god doesn't really touch on the subject of the existence or non-existance of a god like entity.

 

[Triggaaar]

You don't even have to be religious to take knowledge from it.

There are real people contained within it so it does offer some interesting reading in regards to some documented historical figures.

I don't disagree.

Are you dismissing the ancient oral traditons of most cultures used to pass on information of ancestors through songs and stories, drawings etc?

Yes, very much so. We have trouble passing messages down a few hundred years, let alone tens of thousands of years. If there were any sense in your point (sorry that sounds offencive) then we wouldn't have different religions. We'd have had adam and eve, and the story would have been passed on, and everyone would know it. You mention Australia - native Australians would have also been children of adam and eve, but for some reason no one told them. They had their songs, stories and drawings passed down, but they weren't the same as ours (and neither are their gods), because it wasn't possible to pass on a story over that length of time. The Chinese were sure they did not decend from the same ancestors as the rest of us, and dna has now let them research it - oops, they were wrong. Did the songs and paintings past down through generations forget to tell them adam and eve were black? Not that it's easy to pass on a painting left in a cave a few thousand miles away.

It's widely reported that Captain James Cook discovered Australia, yet there's cave paintings that suggest other white men walked the land long before he arrived on Australian shores.

If white men walked the land long before, they didn't make it home to tell of their discovery.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

Yes, very much so. We have trouble passing messages down a few hundred years, let alone tens of thousands of years. If there were any sense in your point (sorry that sounds offencive) then we wouldn't have different religions. We'd have had adam and eve, and the story would have been passed on, and everyone would know it. You mention Australia - native Australians would have also been children of adam and eve, but for some reason no one told them. They had their songs, stories and drawings passed down, but they weren't the same as ours (and neither are their gods), because it wasn't possible to pass on a story over that length of time. The Chinese were sure they did not decend from the same ancestors as the rest of us, and dna has now let them research it - oops, they were wrong. Did the songs and paintings past down through generations forget to tell them adam and eve were black? Not that it's easy to pass on a painting left in a cave a few thousand miles away.

You can't say that Aboriginals spirituality doesnt mirror our own ancestors. The Pagans of the UK would have shared similar beliefs, stories etc that parrallel the aboriginals own local versions.

The fact that more modern incarnations of religion contain pagan elements suggests that there are common elements to most human deity based faiths that have filtered through and been present in most cultures regardless of their contact or non contact with other civilisations.

Certain aspects of faith based belief have always been present, long before the bible existed.

If white men walked the land long before, they didn't make it home to tell of their discovery.

Some actually did.

The maps they drew of the coast they came upon though was credited/mistook for a different land mass(PNG).

 

[shellsuit]

There's still the agnostics.




If people are trying to use science as some mighty weapon to discredit the whole bible they must be a bit thick and missing the point of what a lot of the bible is about
What i will say is though, just as a religious person using the bible as absolute truth is flawed, so is the atheist who tries to use the bible as proof there's no god and religion is all wrong is jsut as flawed in their thinking.

but an atheist is fully entitled to use the bible as proof a christian or hebrew god does not exist,no it cant be used as proof there is not another god out there.........its quite possible Thor or The Flying Spaghetti Monster(ramen) are doing their god stuff out there on a daily basis......but wouldnt that be funny if people believed in an invisible deity

 

[shellsuit]

I don't understand why they need to prove to you a god exists?


really? religious people dont need to prove their god exists?

Gordon Smith scored 5 goals at the Fa Cup final replay to win the cup for the albion. it is the truth and even though you may say the evidence exists against it being true i believe it to be so and i dont see any need to prove it to you that Smithys 5 goals won the cup

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

but an atheist is fully entitled to use the bible as proof a christian or hebrew god does not exist,no it cant be used as proof there is not another god out there.........its quite possible Thor or The Flying Spaghetti Monster(ramen) are doing their god stuff out there on a daily basis......but wouldnt that be funny if people believed in an invisible deity

The bible still isn't any kind of actual proof that their god does or does not exist. Sure it might discredit a few of their ideas, but it still doesn't offer any conclusive proof their god isn't out there.

I once had an atheist friend who said after a relationship they had a broken heart. Funny thing is the heart only pumps blood, it's not capable of feelings.

There is an irony in many things in life, a lot of which passes by those who are most critical of others.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

I don't understand why they need to prove to you a god exists?


really? religious people dont need to prove their god exists?

Gordon Smith scored 5 goals at the Fa Cup final replay to win the cup for the albion. it is the truth and even though you may say the evidence exists against it being true i believe it to be so and i dont see any need to prove it to you that Smithys 5 goals won the cup

Show me the thing people call "love". Prove to me it actually exists.

I don't want to see the effects of it(that proves nothing), I want to see actual physical proof it exists.

 

[shellsuit]

The bible still isn't any kind of actual proof that their god does or does not exist.


well with that insight at least we know your not a christian,you must be a fence sitting agnostic

 

[shellsuit]

Show me the thing people call "love". Prove to me it actually exists.

I don't want to see the effects of it(that proves nothing), I want to see actual physical proof it exists.

actually love is a feeling rather like disappointment or optimism,they are all the results of emotions......but i didnt expect you to know that

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

The bible still isn't any kind of actual proof that their god does or does not exist.


well with that insight at least we know your not a christian,you must be a fence sitting agnostic

I think you'll find many people who believe in a god share such views.

Within even the oldest and most established religious organisations the opinions between members differ quite a lot.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

actually love is a feeling rather like disappointment or optimism,they are all the results of emotions......but i didnt expect you to know that

You've just described what believing in a God is.

It's a feeling, a sense of something there that you can't touch but can feel its presence.

 

[The Merry Prankster]

So, you're saying God exists, and anyone who doesn't believe just haven't looked hard enough. There's a very small man on your hand. He's there, you're just not looking hard enough, or at the right part of your hand.

Tell me, where should I be looking for God?

No. God may not exist for you but if you want to know should at least have look.

I can't tell you where to look. I can only tell you what I did. I don't believe in religion and so have no handbook to guide me or you.

 

[OzMike]

Man made just like global warming

 

[The Wookiee]

Actually, I think it is a better thing to bring up children knowing a faith, because it gives them a starting point from which to learn good and bad and it also gives them a sense of belonging. It is easier for people to abandon a faith when they are older, than to adopt one. That's partly the problem with society today, that no one gives a shit.

You can be taught good from bad without having god thrust upon you as a kid, especially as nobody can prove either way if he exists or not, why would you want to brainwash your children in this way ?

 

[BadFish]

I find it astounding that people still believe that everything happened just like it says in the bible.

I also find it astounding that people will blindly follow an organised religion and not question the particular slant they put on it.

That said I think it is very much up to the individual what they think, but I Believe that people should give it some serious thought before the proclaim to following any particular strand of belief.

While we are talking about it though i would be interested to know how religious education is dealt with in the UK. In Australia we have a Christian religious group coming into schools to teach CRE (Christian Religious Education). I think this is really missing a trick in that we could be providing students with an understanding of different religions and pointing out their similarities and differences. In today's climate it would surely be beneficial to have a generation growing up with a wider understanding of different religious beliefs.

 

[Seagull on the wing]

The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.

Er!....................... Yes.

 

[BadFish]

=Originally Posted by Mr Burns
The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Originally Posted by Mr Burns
The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.

Just like many a Catholic Priest!!!

 

[Seagull on the wing]

Lets be honest,I'm not a believer of God,but I do not have any issues with people who do believe,my children were bought up to make their own minds up and one of my daughters is a church goer...her choice.As I'm now a widower of 10 years standing I obey the law,but lead a sinful life of wine,women song,(football) and when I get to the pearly gates I just repent...easy,have fun and still get in...there is none so pure as the purified....seemples! Had the Jehovah witnesses s knock on my door,They said they were spreading the word of God...Told them to B***ger off! I don't knock on their doors trying to tell them of the Gospel of the Albion. Did have a day when I thought of no evil against Palace....Forgive me father...for I have sinned!

 

[piersa]

I have not read the bible because i don't like fiction.

 

[bhaexpress]

The problem for me is that despite the fact that there are several different deities available to the consumer there's no evidence (apart from a lot of mumbo jumbo and stigma) of the existence of any of them. Like I say, if I was to declare that I believed in Little Green Men from Mars based on the same level of proof as any other higher authority I think people would consider me unbalanced, this despite the fact that unlike Heaven we know that Mars exists.