Any HR bods here?

[hans kraay fan club]

i made that company a fortune, and was within my own budgets to take days off here and there....which i did....i just also wanted all my sick days too.
.

Justify it to yourself all you like, but you know full well that you had no entitlement to those spurious sick days. You stole that pay from your employer. You're a thief, as plain and simple as if you'd taken a few hundred quid out of their tills.

 

[South Stand Bonfire]

Maybe he is an MP and needed the time off to do his expenses?

Justify it to yourself all you like, but you know full well that you had no entitlement to those spurious sick days. You stole that pay from your employer. You're a thief, as plain and simple as if you'd taken a few hundred quid out of their tills.

 

[Springal]

So following on from this, the same friend now has the following dilemma, and I am convinced their HR team are in the wrong.

The company currently outsource their sales operation to a 3rd party, but directly employ some telephone account managers. It has now been announced they are looking to outsource these roles to a 3rd party. A decision will be made on 4th November at the earliest. No-one is being made redundant, and depending on the decision of who to outsource to, personal terms will be agreed off the back of this. (Background, sense would suggest that they will use the 3rd party that does all other sales activity to them, so it is within 1 house. If so, this company is based in Glasgow. A cool 460 miles away.)

This affects 3 people. In the mean time, they have advised there is a single job available in a separate team, that all of the 3 possibly affected are suitable for, with applications in for the 1st November. This role will be the same basic, but no opportunity to earn any commission. The concern is, they are being 'made' to apply for a job, that closes before any announcement has been made regarding their role, so they are being forced into a move that may not be beneficial, and will waive rights to any compensation, redundancy etc.

Also, they have waived all responsibility of TUPE etc, and said it will be up to employees to discuss terms with the outsourced company.

Contract states regular place of employment is <current office> but "reserves the right to transfer employees, temporarily or permanently to any other department, operation or location according to the needs of the business, but every consideration will be given to the personal circumstances of the individual(s) concerned and transfers would not occur without prior consultation."

So any advice here, none of this feels right to me, and given the way they acted over the sick pay issues, I feel incorrect advice is given. Will be looking for professional advice, but others may have had the same thing.

 

[Gazwag]

In that case he should definitely at least be entitled to SSP, seems like there is some dirty work being done by the company as a doctors certificate should be enough to qualify.

Time at a company is irrevelent for SSP and if the only entitlement is SSP nothing is due for the first 3 days of sickness

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Also, they have waived all responsibility of TUPE etc, and said it will be up to employees to discuss terms with the outsourced company.

The employer can't do that - TUPE is an agreement that transfers employees current conditions to the new employer. They can't just waive them ! Given how complicated this now is I'd suggest your mate goes and sees an employment lawyer. It will cost about £150 for an hour but seriously, what is £150 when it could save you your job ?

 

[Springal]

The employer can't do that - TUPE is an agreement that transfers employees current conditions to the new employer. They can't just waive them ! Given how complicated this now is I'd suggest your mate goes and sees an employment lawyer. It will cost about £150 for an hour but seriously, what is £150 when it could save you your job ?

Thanks , that sounds sane. By moving a job, 460 miles, can no way just be a TUPE and get on with it surely. Has to be redundancy if they don't accept that?

Any thoughts on the timing of this new job, and closing the application date before any outcome is decided around what is happening? Isn't this just forcing their hands to avoid paying redundancy?

 

[Springal]

Just clarified a point:

'HR advised if you refused the TUPE, this will be handled as a resignation, and therefore would not get any redundancy, they may however depending on circumstances negotiate a private settlement.'

None of this bit was bit in writing, so was verbally and recalled from memory

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Just clarified a point:

'HR advised if you refused the TUPE, this will be handled as a resignation, and therefore would not get any redundancy, they may however depending on circumstances negotiate a private settlement.'

None of this bit was bit in writing, so was verbally and recalled from memory

I'd suggest it is requested in writing so it can be taken to a solicitor. It might be worth your mate pointing out to HR he / she is taking legal advice.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Just clarified a point:

'HR advised if you refused the TUPE, this will be handled as a resignation, and therefore would not get any redundancy, they may however depending on circumstances negotiate a private settlement.'

None of this bit was bit in writing, so was verbally and recalled from memory

Time to get in touch with an employment lawyer , it smells a bit fishy to me.