A massive summer clear out and I hope Tony Bloom delivers on his promise......

[Man of Harveys]

All goes back to the day Barber turned up, the juggernaut did a reverse that day and it's been backwards ever since

It's impossible to argue with this. Wrong man, wrong club. Still.

 

[Wozza]

You need to be scoring goals regularly and attacking to progress to the prem as that's clear to see of late.

Goals help, of course, but Boro were top at the weekend and they've scored 60 times - just 17 more than us.

Their success is built on defence - well, and a shit-hot loanee from Chelsea.

 

[chaileyjem]

Interesting. So the transfer fees have gone on meeting this period's FFP. That would suggest to me that Mr Barber is some way off where he needs to be with financial control. Also seems odd that we managed last period without such huge 'investment' via transfer fees but need the Ulloa/Buckley/Bridcutt fees for this period.

Bloom said "some" of the money not all of it. We'll have to wait until the 2014/15 accounts to find out. Ulloa,Buckley fees weren't included in this years accounts where losses were reduced primarily through better sponsorship, job cuts and continued large attendances/tv money income, although they would be a lot smaller if we didn't spend £21m+ on our playing budget.. (ie: the wages of the first team squad)
And remember re: Paul Barber that he negotiates the fees for players if the club agrees they can leave. Some would say he's quite good at that. Would Sunderland still agree with the millions they spent on Buckley and Bridcutt ?
Has Ulloa been worth the £8m that Leicester paid for him ?

 

[Rookie]

It's impossible to argue with this. Wrong man, wrong club. Still.

Maybe if it were true, but 2 play off appearances would seem to suggest it's not

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

One of their humble customers here feels a need to ask of the club's representatives on earth/NSC: why did they choose to flog off players that we already knew were good enough for a promotion challenge, only to replace them with expensive journeymen and ropey loanees who didn't turn out to be good enough for a promotion challenge? It seems like a bad investment: spending more in order to cut investment in the future AND taking a big risk doing so. It's not paid off. And yet we're being promised the same again this summer.

If any of you could let us know what the unquestioning and relentlessly grateful Albion public should think about that, it would be much appreciated as we are clearly in need of yet more unremitting and just ever-so-slightly patronizing guidance on what to think and say (apart from "keep spending the money", obviously - we'll take that as a given). Cheers.

The moneyball spreadsheet had a problem in the formula. It showed on paper it could work.

As the saying goes the game isnt played on paper.

 

[Tony Meolas Loan Spell]

But Bloom has been ok funding large fees for CMS, Baldock, Ulloa, (and Grabban) in the past . Why do you think he's any less reluctant to spend to fund a squad/strikers in terms of transfer fees/wages when the evidence is there is that he's done it in the past and has already publicly confirmed he wants to "strengthen" the squad in the summer.

Nope im talking BIG. Like 5million + big

Not 2million for L1 top scorers.

 

[chaileyjem]

Nope im talking BIG. Like 5million + big

Not 2million for L1 top scorers.

Gotcha...Not someone like Britt Assombalonga then. A Top L1 scorer last season but £5m+ for Forest . 15 goals before he was injured.
Or £2m+ 17 goal Callum Wilson, (22 goals for L1 Coventry last season), which inevitably he will add to on Friday.

PS Only £8m Rhodes & £5m Assombalonga out of the current top 20 Champ scorers cost anywhere near £5m+
£6m + add ons McCormack is #22.

 

[Deadly Danson]

It's impossible to argue with this. Wrong man, wrong club. Still.

It's not impossible. The post above you has done it perfectly.

 

[Ernest]

For a start buy a striker to compliment Baldock and we might get something back for the money spunked on him

 

[Simster]

Gotcha...Not someone like Britt Assombalonga then. A Top L1 scorer last season but £5m+ for Forest . 15 goals before he was injured.
Or £2m+ 17 goal Callum Wilson, (22 goals for L1 Coventry last season), which inevitably he will add to on Friday.

PS Only £8m Rhodes & £5m Assombalonga out of the current top 20 Champ scorers cost anywhere near £5m+
£6m + add ons McCormack is #22.

As far as I'm concerned, the whole "cost of a decent striker" thing is a massive red herring. We'd all like a proven £10m striker for £5m but it simply isn't going to happen as a general rule. It rarely does. Bournemouth and Brentford are small clubs who have not gone large on striker costs. Wolves are a bigger club, but their modus operandi has resembled Bournemouth and Brentford's. All three have built up a decent squad, kept the nucleus together, and scored the goals that breeds confidence and powered them all into the top six.

For me, the lesson to be learned is not "get a £5m striker in", it is that there is a good deal of merit in getting your squad sorted WELL before the start of the season even if that means paying a little bit more to get a handful of key contracts in place by the beginning of July.

Get them settled and playing well as early as possible. Albion's summer dealings were nothing short of an absolute disgrace - they badly let down 23,000 season ticket holders by letting Ulloa go and failing to replace him (after letting Barnes go and failing to replace him just six months beforehand). And let's not forget we got the patronising Chemical Ali "don't panic everyone" sound bites in the form of "we're sure you'll like the squad by September 1st" which kind of ignored the fact the season was 3 weeks old by this point, shortly after we had buggered about penny pinching over Stephen Ward's wages leaving us with a huge hole at the back by the time Sheff Weds became the first of many teams to win here fairly comfortably.

All in all, it was a shambles and it had better be a different story if we are to believe that the right bloke (Burke) was sacked.

 

[Man of Harveys]

It's not impossible. The post above you has done it perfectly.

Tsk. Silly me.

I keep forgetting that, for the more, shall we say erm, gullible NSCer, anything good that's happened on the pitch in recent has happened because of Barber and not because of heinous, awful, universally vilified former managers like Poyet or Hyypia. But then when things subsequently go badly on the pitch, it has nothing to do with Barber and everything to do with heinous, awful, universally vilified former managers like Poyet or Hyypia.

Got it.

 

[Phat Baz 68]

You don't deserve to support this club.

Shut up, its fools like you who are so up your own backsides you refuse to look at what is staring you right in the face.
Then well have the "oh but remember where we were in 97 etc etc "
I've been there from 1975 onwards through everything like many others have.
Stop lying to yourself that Bloom is the be all and end all of everything that is Albion because he isn't !!!
We now need a Chairman who is prepared to spend some money on QUALITY not ****ing crap, sub standard loan signings, pitiful Managers like Hyypia, and bell ends like Burke.
If we went down this season who else's fault is

 

[Phat Baz 68]

Pissed?

No I just live in the real world sometimes !!!

 

[Horses Arse]

Bloom said "some" of the money not all of it. We'll have to wait until the 2014/15 accounts to find out. Ulloa,Buckley fees weren't included in this years accounts where losses were reduced primarily through better sponsorship, job cuts and continued large attendances/tv money income, although they would be a lot smaller if we didn't spend £21m+ on our playing budget.. (ie: the wages of the first team squad)
And remember re: Paul Barber that he negotiates the fees for players if the club agrees they can leave. Some would say he's quite good at that. Would Sunderland still agree with the millions they spent on Buckley and Bridcutt ?
Has Ulloa been worth the £8m that Leicester paid for him ?

I have no issue with Barber's negotiation of fees for players sold. If he is actively involved in this (which he must be) he's done this very well. In the opposite direction there's been a monumental screw up (£21m FFS) , but I'm sure it will be argued that this is not in anyway his responsibility.

As I say it will be interesting to see how the results pan out for this period of FFP and how much of the player sold cash is required to fall within it

 

[B.W.]

As far as I'm concerned, the whole "cost of a decent striker" thing is a massive red herring. We'd all like a proven £10m striker for £5m but it simply isn't going to happen as a general rule. It rarely does. Bournemouth and Brentford are small clubs who have not gone large on striker costs. Wolves are a bigger club, but their modus operandi has resembled Bournemouth and Brentford's. All three have built up a decent squad, kept the nucleus together, and scored the goals that breeds confidence and powered them all into the top six.

For me, the lesson to be learned is not "get a £5m striker in", it is that there is a good deal of merit in getting your squad sorted WELL before the start of the season even if that means paying a little bit more to get a handful of key contracts in place by the beginning of July.

Get them settled and playing well as early as possible. Albion's summer dealings were nothing short of an absolute disgrace - they badly let down 23,000 season ticket holders by letting Ulloa go and failing to replace him (after letting Barnes go and failing to replace him just six months beforehand). And let's not forget we got the patronising Chemical Ali "don't panic everyone" sound bites in the form of "we're sure you'll like the squad by September 1st" which kind of ignored the fact the season was 3 weeks old by this point, shortly after we had buggered about penny pinching over Stephen Ward's wages leaving us with a huge hole at the back by the time Sheff Weds became the first of many teams to win here fairly comfortably.

All in all, it was a shambles and it had better be a different story if we are to believe that the right bloke (Burke) was sacked.

Spot on.

 

[Hotchilidog]

I have no issue with Barber's negotiation of fees for players sold. If he is actively involved in this (which he must be) he's done this very well. In the opposite direction there's been a monumental screw up (£21m FFS) , but I'm sure it will be argued that this is not in anyway his responsibility.

As I say it will be interesting to see how the results pan out for this period of FFP and how much of the player sold cash is required to fall within it

Barber is not the football guy, he's the money and business guy. The football people FAILED in their task to identify decent footballers to bring into this club. It's not money that has been the real issue (other teams have picked up good players for little, and our best players tend to have been relatively cheap also), it's been the identification of talent that has been the problem. I believe we have resolved the manager issue for now. This summer is the real test for all concerned. Hughton and the recruitment team need to identify their main targets, and do that early. Bloom then has to be prepared to back their judgement if he wants us to challenge for a top six spot.

As simster said, getting these players settled in early is key. It will help with building the TEAM and giving us an early bit of momentum. If what I understand about the FFP situation is correct, the Ulloa and Buckley cash will on it's own sort out the current debt, which in turn frees up that money for us to strengthen the squad in the summer.

Our wage bill is testament to the fact that Bloom is prepared to stump up the cash when needed, we just have to hope it is spent more wisely this summer than it was last.

 

[Alex Alex Dawson oo! oo!]

Bloom said "some" of the money not all of it. We'll have to wait until the 2014/15 accounts to find out. Ulloa,Buckley fees weren't included in this years accounts where losses were reduced primarily through better sponsorship, job cuts and continued large attendances/tv money income, although they would be a lot smaller if we didn't spend £21m+ on our playing budget.. (ie: the wages of the first team squad) And remember re: Paul Barber that he negotiates the fees for players if the club agrees they can leave. Some would say he's quite good at that. Would Sunderland still agree with the millions they spent on Buckley and Bridcutt ?
Has Ulloa been worth the £8m that Leicester paid for him ?

A slight correction is needed I think. The total wage bill for the entire business (incl NIC and pension costs) was £20.3M in 2013/14, down from £21.1M the previous season. Player trading (ie reflecting the sale of Bridcutt and Barnes) resulted in a net surplus in the accounts of £1.7M, compared to a deficit of £1.1M in 2012/13; the £2.8M difference going towards reducing the overall group loss for the year as will (some of) the income from the sale of Ulloa and Buckley this season.

 

[Juror#13]

Club has gone backwards since Paul Barber joined and just like Vancover whitecaps before. He resigned before he was sacked. Barber is to blame for our downfall. Look at the youtube clip when he and Bloom appointed Hyypia, says it all about how the club is run.

****ing shambles.

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

I don't actually think we've got that bad an overall squad. I see it as follows (excl. Carayol as don't feel it's fair to judge just yet and incl. other loans):

Starter Quality:

Stockdale, Walton, Dunk, Halford, Ince, Kayal, Stephens, Teixeira, Lua Lua

Back Up Quality:

Greer, Bruno, Calderon, Forster-Caskey, Holla, Crofts, Baldock, March, Colunga, Chicksen

Let Go:

Hughes, Agustien, O'Grady, Mackail-Smith, Ankergren, Best, Bennett, McCourt, Fenelon, Monakana

That's 9 good enough to be starters, 10 good enough to fill in and 10 of which to get rid. That's a core squad of 19. Add 2/3 strikers, a left back, a right back, a winger and perhaps another couple of squad players and we'll be fine.

Key is two things: an undisrupted pre-season and a striker that knows where the goal is.

Your starter quality: Halford not ours but also only a back up imo. Teixeira, again not ours and in all honesty has had about 4 decent games. Lua Lua has done cock all this season a one trick pony.

Your back ups. Greer, Bruno, Calderon all passed it and not good enough. Holla very questionable, Crofts I doubt will ever play again, March hardly sets the World alight, Colunga just no, Chicksen a similar no.

Let go I agree with along with the ones I indicated

So 7 starters, 2 maybe 3 back up 19 to go.

This squad needs major surgery.

 

[CliveWalkerWingWizard]

Just reading through this and there is a lot of pessimism, lots saying that almost the entire squad is not up to it. In reality we probably do need 5/6 players but that is the turn over most seasons. We need 2 striker CB and LB, if we get some quality that could be enough for a promotion push. We will probably need a few loans as well.