2nd Test: Australia v England at Adelaide

[spring hall convert]

Too many of our batsman have built careers and reputations against moderate bowling attacks on chief exec pitches. Every time they come up against 'mystery' spin or genuine pace 90MPH+ they are found badly wanting.

Nail on head. Add reverse swing to your list as well.

 

[spring hall convert]

Cook, you absolute ****. No way should he be captain.

Who should be then?

Carberry - No
Root - Too early
Pietersen - Been there
Bell - Little experience, don't really see him as a leader of men.
Prior - Place in doubt
Broad - Maybe. Too hotheaded for Test captaincy I would say
Swann - I think he's retiring after this series
Anderson - Maybe

 

[spring hall convert]

The selectors won't have the guts but Cook has to go now. His teammates know that he's gone mentally and is just a liability. How the hell do you carry a captain through five Test matches?
This Test has gone, the series has gone and now its just a question of whether we can prevent 5-0 ( unlikely )
Post Ashes...serious team surgery necessary. Its goodbye Cook, KP, Trott and Prior and then re-building can start with different players prepared to fight for the cause and not coast on their own ego's and belief in the misguided publicity that they are all conquering.

I'll ask you the question as well. There's no use knee jerking - who are you replacing Cook, as captain with? It was only a year ago, he was leading these players to our first series victory in India in generations AFTER we gifted the first test to them.

Are you seriously advocating dropping Cook as a player as well? He's 28, he could conceivably have another 10 years at the top level in him. He's going to be England's highest agrregate run scorer and century maker of all time. It's just a plain dumb thing to say.

 

[Trevor]

Who should be then?

Root - Too early
Pietersen - Been there
Bell - Little experience, don't really see him as a leader of men.
Prior - Place in doubt
Broad - Maybe. Too hotheaded for Test captaincy I would say
Swann - I think he's retiring after this series
Anderson - Maybe

Agreed. Our problem has been irresponsible batting (and to a lesser degree weak spin bowling). I never like the idea of fast bowlers captaining in Tests - essentially they can't function as captain for the duration of their spell. Cook is shrewd enough and I find it hard to imagine that his place would be in doubt - if Swann wasn't knackered I'm sure he would want to.

 

[spring hall convert]

Broad is capable of scoring 100's.

He's not scored one in an untarnished test match though has he?

 

[JamesAndTheGiantHead]

Just woke up, did we win?

 

[spring hall convert]

The events of these 2 test matches are almost unbelievable. A bowler who has been more or less rubbish for the last 3 years has become virtually unplayable, on by all accounts one of the flattest pitches ever. As far as I know there are no drugs that can transform players so the only explanation can be that our batsmen have been bewitched, an exorcism should do the trick.

Look at Johnson prior to those 3 years though. He was the number 1 ranked bowler in the world, he broke Graham Smith's hand, he's just rediscovered his mojo.

 

[spring hall convert]

Broad is just an idiot, that was pathetic.

Good fighting knock from Matty Prior though. He seems to have mojo back like Spanish Dave yesterday!

On a slowish flat track, in a lost cause against attacking fields. Rest assured Johnson will have him hopping around again in Perth.

 

[spring hall convert]

Telling statistic - not one of the deliveries that dismissed English batsmen in their 2nd innings would have hit the stumps. None.

This isn't kids cricket, you don't really bowl at the stumps that much in Test Cricket because if you do, you get picked off on the leg side.

 

[spring hall convert]

I am now £400 down betting on England so have wagered on Siddle being top Aussie bowler at 12-1 to recoup or add to my losses. The price for us to win the Series is a miserable 33-1 so that's not for me and it's only 11/4 for us to win at the WACA for the first time, excepting the Packer Ashes.

So win at Perth and it's all on again. It's not OVER yet. We have to have the BALLS to do it.

Team Cook, Carberry, Root, Pietersen, Bell, Prior, Broad, Anderson. The other 3 places Bresnan, Stokes and Monty? This is assuming Tremlett and Finn have not impressed in the nets as they have not been at their best on the tour so far and that Boycott's mum is not available.

As an aside the youtube footage of Michael Holding scattering Boycott's wicket is a must. That is rhythmical beauty and quality fast bowling. Non of that Mitch slinging nonsense.

I'm an England optimist and I wouldn't even think about picking us for Perth even if we are in good form. It's probably worse than the Gabba for us.

The last 2 tests are at much better venues for us, you'll also have the advantage that if we get thumped again the odds on an England test victory would likely get even longer.

 

[Bold Seagull]

This isn't kids cricket, you don't really bowl at the stumps that much in Test Cricket because if you do, you get picked off on the leg side.

I think the point being that in a test match you are defending, you shouldn't be getting out to a fair few balls that are no where near hitting the stumps. In test cricket, if you are batting for your lives, leave as much as you can, make them bowl at the stumps, then as you say pick them off on the leg side. This is exactly what Cook did from late 2009 to 2012 before his brain turned to mush and he decided to play at what he previously left, and leave what he previously played.

 

[vegster]

I'll ask you the question as well. There's no use knee jerking - who are you replacing Cook, as captain with? It was only a year ago, he was leading these players to our first series victory in India in generations AFTER we gifted the first test to them.

Are you seriously advocating dropping Cook as a player as well? He's 28, he could conceivably have another 10 years at the top level in him. He's going to be England's highest agrregate run scorer and century maker of all time. It's just a plain dumb thing to say.

I think Cook should go after this series, he has been bumbling and muddling through at best. Subsequently his batting is shot too. It's always a bit of an issue if a captain stands down but stays on as a player. In Cooks case I think he should be " Rested " and allowed to get some runs under his belt and come back for the winter tour if all goes well. There is no obvious captain in the team at the moment. Mind you, we will probably need a new England team manager too....oh, and if Goochie can't sort out his boy's batting problems maybe he should walk too. it's endless.

 

[spring hall convert]

I think the point being that in a test match you are defending, you shouldn't be getting out to a fair few balls that are no where near hitting the stumps. In test cricket, if you are batting for your lives, leave as much as you can, make them bowl at the stumps, then as you say pick them off on the leg side. This is exactly what Cook did from late 2009 to 2012 before his brain turned to mush and he decided to play at what he previously left, and leave what he previously played.

Fair point, think I got the wrong end of the stick - my suspicion is they really don't like the short stuff and they think that their way out of it is to dominate. I think that's counter productive as it gives the bowler hope. As you say, leave them alone, it takes a lot of effort to bowl bouncers, bowlers soon stop when they realise it isn't having the desired effect.

 

[vegster]

I think the point being that in a test match you are defending, you shouldn't be getting out to a fair few balls that are no where near hitting the stumps. In test cricket, if you are batting for your lives, leave as much as you can, make them bowl at the stumps, then as you say pick them off on the leg side. This is exactly what Cook did from late 2009 to 2012 before his brain turned to mush and he decided to play at what he previously left, and leave what he previously played.

Add Trott to that

 

[spring hall convert]

I think Cook should go after this series, he has been bumbling and muddling through at best. Subsequently his batting is shot too. It's always a bit of an issue if a captain stands down but stays on as a player. In Cooks case I think he should be " Rested " and allowed to get some runs under his belt and come back for the winter tour if all goes well. There is no obvious captain in the team at the moment. Mind you, we will probably need a new England team manager too....oh, and if Goochie can't sort out his boy's batting problems maybe he should walk too. it's endless.

Who are you replacing him as captain with?

 

[Bold Seagull]

I'll ask you the question as well. There's no use knee jerking - who are you replacing Cook, as captain with? It was only a year ago, he was leading these players to our first series victory in India in generations AFTER we gifted the first test to them.

Are you seriously advocating dropping Cook as a player as well? He's 28, he could conceivably have another 10 years at the top level in him. He's going to be England's highest agrregate run scorer and century maker of all time. It's just a plain dumb thing to say.

I don't think you can drop Cook either as a player or as a captain right at this moment. But there is no doubt being captained has dramatically altered his mindset as batting.

I won't go over my previous post, but when Cook had problems outside off stump in 2008/09, to the point of being dropped, this was resolved not through any real technical adjustments, but through a mental change to what he left, and he started to leave a lot. It is exactly as your other post in which Cook made the bowlers bowl more at his stumps and he accumulated many runs off his pads.

For some reason, mentally over the last year he has regressed into the player in 2008 that is just indecisive on what to leave. I think that is all that's wrong with Cook right now. Perhaps as captain and with a new opener beside him he feels he needs to lead from the front and attack the bowling, but he needs to accept he is very much a one dimensional test player. He needs to get in, leave as much as he can and score off the bad ball. None of this hooking in the 2nd over nonsense.

If he is to remain as captain, he needs to get over whatever mental strain the captaincy is putting on him, and get back to batting absolutely simply, and boringly.

 

[vegster]

Who are you replacing him as captain with?

Line 4, "There is no obvious captain in this team " so we need to look to someone who is a shrewd captain who could make the step up to Test Cricket. Maybe Gale at Yorkshire or even going back to Chris Read at Notts. but, I'm sure there are several good candidates who can come with fresh ideas.

 

[Bold Seagull]

Who are you replacing him as captain with?

I wouldn't right now, because that could destroy him more than this actual series will.

But as a completely left field creative thinking, I'd chuck it to KP.

Yes, the man that text the opposition taking the piss out of his own team mates.

Yes, the man that often bats for himself and not the team or situation.

It would be a ridiculous gamble, but it may just release Cook to concentrate on his batting, and may just give KP the kick up the backside he needs. Batting at no.4 he is ideally placed for the role, and deep down is a very keen thinker about the game.

It would be mad to do it, but it is the only alternative option I can see. It would be the kind of thing Sir Alex Ferguson would do if he were running this England set up.

 

[vegster]

I don't think you can drop Cook either as a player or as a captain right at this moment. But there is no doubt being captained has dramatically altered his mindset as batting.

I won't go over my previous post, but when Cook had problems outside off stump in 2008/09, to the point of being dropped, this was resolved not through any real technical adjustments, but through a mental change to what he left, and he started to leave a lot. It is exactly as your other post in which Cook made the bowlers bowl more at his stumps and he accumulated many runs off his pads.

For some reason, mentally over the last year he has regressed into the player in 2008 that is just indecisive on what to leave. I think that is all that's wrong with Cook right now. Perhaps as captain and with a new opener beside him he feels he needs to lead from the front and attack the bowling, but he needs to accept he is very much a one dimensional test player. He needs to get in, leave as much as he can and score off the bad ball. None of this hooking in the 2nd over nonsense.

If he is to remain as captain, he needs to get over whatever mental strain the captaincy is putting on him, and get back to batting absolutely simply, and boringly.

Maybe a return for Compton then ? we may not post huge scores but they would certainly take time out of the game and wear down the quicks.

 

[spring hall convert]

I don't think you can drop Cook either as a player or as a captain right at this moment. But there is no doubt being captained has dramatically altered his mindset as batting.

I won't go over my previous post, but when Cook had problems outside off stump in 2008/09, to the point of being dropped, this was resolved not through any real technical adjustments, but through a mental change to what he left, and he started to leave a lot. It is exactly as your other post in which Cook made the bowlers bowl more at his stumps and he accumulated many runs off his pads.

For some reason, mentally over the last year he has regressed into the player in 2008 that is just indecisive on what to leave. I think that is all that's wrong with Cook right now. Perhaps as captain and with a new opener beside him he feels he needs to lead from the front and attack the bowling, but he needs to accept he is very much a one dimensional test player. He needs to get in, leave as much as he can and score off the bad ball. None of this hooking in the 2nd over nonsense.

If he is to remain as captain, he needs to get over whatever mental strain the captaincy is putting on him, and get back to batting absolutely simply, and boringly.

Sensible posting. The Aussie's have bowled well to Cook all summer and so far this winter. They've forced him to face his weakness, which is as you say knowing what to leave in the "corridor of uncertainty." With the bat he'll work it out I'm sure. Beyond any shadow of a doubt, he's the best opening batsman we possess. Anyone saying otherwise, I'm guessing, only watches cricket during the Ashes and therefore their opinion can be fairly casually dismissed.

As for him as captain, again, he's the best we've got. Long term I'd like to see someone else but there isn't really another serious option outside of Anderson, Broad and Root.

The thing that really worries me is that I went into this series thinking that we should be focusing on what we need to do as a team to compete with South Africa in terms of the number 1 ranking. Laughable now.