David has only gone and done it!

[melias shoes]

So the Deal has been done. Well we have well and truly have been. Some of it being temporary. I'm I right in thinking it's not even ratified yet and it won't be until after the referendum. I can sense a proper shafting .

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Yes, it will be ratified if the UK votes to stay in in my opinion.

It needs to be the other way round though - the EU members ratify the deal and then, and only then, the UK votes on staying.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So the Deal has been done. Well we have well and truly have been. Some of it being temporary. I'm I right in thinking it's not even ratified yet and it won't be until after the referendum. I can sense a proper shagging.

Please keep up at the back.

 

[Hampster Gull]

So the Deal has been done. Well we have well and truly have been. Some of it being temporary. I'm I right in thinking it's not even ratified yet and it won't be until after the referendum. I can sense a proper shagging.

Whats the problem! If you want put then vote out and convince your compatriots to do so. Its up to the people now

 

[Soulman]

So the Deal has been done. Well we have well and truly have been. Some of it being temporary. I'm I right in thinking it's not even ratified yet and it won't be until after the referendum. I can sense a proper shagging.

Yes.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

So you'll be voting to stay in now, will you?

My 'Churchillian' post was tongue in cheek. I was continuing the theme set by previous posters. Saying that I think he is more Chamberlain than Churchill but both comparisons are OTT if meant seriously.

Having had time to read through the deal and read some analysis I think on balance I'm still voting out. My reasons ..

1.) Cameron claims securing an opt out from ever closer Union is significant in reality as far as I can tell it is meaningless. We were on a single track heading for a Federal superstate now we are on a parallel track heading in exactly the same direction but the signpost is different.

2.) The seven year emergency brake on some benefits for new EU migrants will make little if any difference to net migration. If we leave we have the power to stop or amend all benefits for existing and new migrants and reclaim full control of our borders. The benefits issue is just a diversion anyway most EU migrants work he bigged this issue up to cover his failure to get real immigration controls.

3.) The safeguards secured for the City of London and businesses would appear to be beneficial if we stayed in but it seems any other EU country has the right to amend the text before it is incorporated into a treaty.

4.) Finally as far as I can tell there is still the possibility of this deal being amended or blocked by the European parliament after we vote.

Cameron promised a significant and fundamental change to a new relationship with Europe all of the above is not what I would call fundamental change. There have been no significant repatriation of powers and no protection to stop the further continuing drain of sovereignty.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

It needs to be the other way round though - the EU members ratify the deal and then, and only then, the UK votes on staying.

Which would be a daft, not to mention inefficient way, of working.

 

[Soulman]

Wether the UK is in or out will not affect where I choose to live. I think the UK and the EU are better off together. So, the latter.

So a win win situation for you personally. Meanwhile you think that those that have a vested interest and who it will affect, who want out are, in your words "bleating".
Right ho.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

Which would be a daft, not to mention inefficient way, of working.

Why's it daft ? Something that could change the UK forever should be considered against REAL facts. The promise that 27 other parliaments ( remember some of the leaders at the summit won't be in power when the votes take place and some are in coalition governments ) will absolutely pass the deal is pie in the sky thinking. I no more trust them to do so than I would with asking a convicted burglar to look after my TV for me.

 

[dingodan]

Fantastic theatrical performance.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So a win win situation for you personally. Meanwhile you think that those that have a vested interest and who it will affect, who want out are, in your words "bleating".
Right ho.

I don't view it from my personal situation though.

An no, you can't pin the bleating term on me. I was mocking the comment I quoted; I added to smiley to demonstrate this.

 

[melias shoes]

We can relax, great negotiation, all will be good

Shouldn't your headline be...David has only gone and Blown it!!

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Why's it daft ? Something that could change the UK forever should be considered against REAL facts. The promise that 27 other parliaments ( remember some of the leaders at the summit won't be in power when the votes take place and some are in coalition governments ) will absolutely pass the deal is pie in the sky thinking. I no more trust them to do so than I would with asking a convicted burglar to look after my TV for me.

I know you're in IT, would you first implement a significant change and then ask your peers to decide if they need the change? No.

This summit has all been about keeping the union together, and there has been clear will to not only achieve this but to do it in a timely fashion. I cant see any reason why France or Germany will rock the boat, none at all. And I can't see any reason why the smaller nations will jeopardise something they know is, overall, good for them.

 

[melias shoes]

Please keep up at the back.

My point is it's Not a done deal and NEVER will be.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

My point is it's Not a done deal and NEVER will be.

My point is this discussion has been had. Either bring something new to the discussion or don't post

 

[Westdene Seagull]

I know you're in IT, would you first implement a significant change and then ask your peers to decide if they need the change? No.

This summit has all been about keeping the union together, and there has been clear will to not only achieve this but to do it in a timely fashion. I cant see any reason why France or Germany will rock the boat, none at all. And I can't see any reason why the smaller nations will jeopardise something they know is, overall, good for them.

Bad analogy on your behalf. In IT, someone suggests a change ( i.e. a cap on benefits ) and then it is approved by a change control board ( i.e. a parliament ) - the change isn't implemented without full approval.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Bad analogy on your behalf. In IT, someone suggests a change ( i.e. a cap on benefits ) and then it is approved by a change control board ( i.e. a parliament ) - the change isn't implemented without full approval.

Exactly, so the change will not be implemented until full approval....ie the referendum.

 

[Hampster Gull]

My point is it's Not a done deal and NEVER will be.

Out of curiosity, if it was ratified first would you be happy to stay in the EU?

 

[melias shoes]

My point is this discussion has been had. Either bring something new to the discussion or don't post

Sorry never realised you're the post administrator. Should that be don't post things I don't agree with.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Sorry never realised you're the post administrator. Should that be don't post things I don't agree with.

Those Germanic tendencies can be hard to suppress ..