Public Sector Cuts and Job Losses.

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

So all the major Parties agree that there are going to have to be huge cuts in Public Spending.

They just seem to disagree on how much and when.

I'm sure no one wants to see Firefighters, Teachers, Doctors and other essential Public Sector Workers lose their jobs, but whoever wins the election - and we HAVE to have one within the next 9 months, will have some big decisions to make.

So, should front line workers lose their jobs because greedy bankers lent money to people who had no way to repay it........OR on the other hand...

Are there far too many Public Sector workers who make nothing, create nothing, do very little of actual service, have 'jobs for life and gold plated pensions.'

Cancel Trident says Vince Cable - but then about 10,00 workers at Rolls Royce and at Farslane would lose their jobs.

ID Cards to go? Good IMO.

As I say, all Parties seem to agree that there will be cuts - personally I wonder why the unelected Mandleson is the one to be telling the UK what is right and wrong for the Country - but then I suppose we have a PM who we didn't actually vote for either.

 

[dougdeep]

Every government I can remember promises to cut civil service jobs. But it never happened and never will.

 

[Beach Hut]

It is not just about greedy bankers there is another issue regarding the high maintenance of public workers like pension provision.

 

[Gully]

There was an item on our local news (BBC Midlands) mentioning that Warwickshire County Council are going to sack 100 retained firefighters and close 6 fire stations...mostly in rural parts of the county...yet they say the service they provide will improve.

I can only compare this to the area I grew up in, rural West Sussex, where the majority of fire cover outside the main towns is provided by retained staff. If the fire stations in places like Storrington, Findon and Steyning were closed it would presumably mean cover being provided by the likes of Horsham and Worthing...how that would improve the service and help save lives is a mystery. If it can happen in Warwickshire it can certainly happen in West and East Sussex, if the thought of this concerns you (it bloody well should) then start pestering your MP's now...before cuts become a reality and it is too late.

 

[Mellor 3 Ward 4]

Every government I can remember promises to cut civil service jobs. But it never happened and never will.

Turkeys and Christmas isn't it.

What government is going to undertake the totally needed reform of Public Sector Pensions when they and the rest of the Civil Service will be the ones to lose out.

Interesing that now 20% of all our Council Tax goes to pay Public Sector Pensions.

So those in the Private Sector have not only lost out with their own Pensions, but are now increasingly paying for Public Sector worker Pensions too!!

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Where have the reserves gone? We have been in ascendency since '97 or thereabouts. Where has all the cash gone?

Time to admit that we are not a superpower and live within our means?

 

[dougdeep]

Where have the reserves gone?

They're playing at Lancing.

 

[seagullsovergrimsby]

Every government I can remember promises to cut civil service jobs. But it never happened and never will.

Didn't Labour say back in 1997 they would cut out the deadwood from the civil service ? Instead of eliminating 500,000 posts all they've done is the complete opposite.

 

[The Cardinal]

It is not just about greedy bankers there is another issue regarding the high maintenance of public workers like pension provision.

Remind me, Mr Hut. Do you sell private pensions or does consigning public servants to poverty in their old age provide you with some other advantage?

 

[beorhthelm]

So those in the Private Sector have not only lost out with their own Pensions, but are now increasingly paying for Public Sector worker Pensions too!!

its all about pensions. the civil service pensions are ludicrous and will bankrupt us if not reformed. problem is you can change existing deals and unions strike everytime a change is made to new pensions (ie only for new employees). dont get taken in by the hype, the recent banking sector bailout has merely brought the problem forward.

Where have the reserves gone? We have been in ascendency since '97 or thereabouts. Where has all the cash gone?

surely you jest? there has never been any reserves, Brown done exactly the same as homeowners the past 10 years, binged on cheap credit to pay for all sorts of improvments (some worthwhile, some not) expecting the good times to continue forever. and back to pensions... he f***ed alot of them by removing tax reliefs on diviends, so private pension funds have been denied a substantial source of funding (was £5 Billion in 1997) and that equates to job losses eventually when large corporations have pension black holes in millions or billions (yep, they sack employees to be able to afford to pay those left a pension...)

Didn't Labour say back in 1997 they would cut out the deadwood from the civil service ? Instead of eliminating 500,000 posts all they've done is the complete opposite.

i dont recall hearing that from Labour, the Tories have played the card a couple of times. Labour have certainly done the opposite, with a great deal of inititives and schemes basically another way of generating jobs through admin and managment. nice idea, people off unemployment, people with purpose, unfortunatly not actually really doing anything and, ironically, only really possible because the massive tax haul siphoned off the Oil and Banking sectors we all like to vilify. remember next time the mirror is banging on about how many £ profit a minute nasty multinational company makes, that 28% of that goes to the tax man (after considering the tesn of thousands they employ.

(and breath...)

 

[Freddie Goodwin.]

There have been cuts in the CS but it's fromntline staff who get cut whilst mega-earning managers increse.

It is those high earners who get the gold plated pensions. The low paid will only get a pension based on their low pay. It is higher management who have gathered in all the bonuses too. If their brief is to cut staff & close offices and they suceed then they get the bonus.

HMRC, for example, is now a mess. Sussex work is now done in Scotland. Try to ring a local office and you won't get through, even if you are trying to pay a debt or contact them because of the threat of further action.

There's loads of scope for cuts in the CS. They've just got to be made in the right places.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

surely you jest? there has never been any reserves, Brown done exactly the same as homeowners the past 10 years, binged on cheap credit to pay for all sorts of improvments (some worthwhile, some not) expecting the good times to continue forever. and back to pensions... he f***ed alot of them by removing tax reliefs on diviends, so private pension funds have been denied a substantial source of funding (was £5 Billion in 1997) and that equates to job losses eventually when large corporations have pension black holes in millions or billions (yep, they sack employees to be able to afford to pay those left a pension...)

I was being ironic if that is the correct term. I get confused. How he was ever gifted the term 'prudent' is beyond me?

As we don't produce a great deal, as a country, perhaps we should replicate the models of many other countries and look after our old folk ourselves..!

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

If you want to save money you have to look at cuts in Education, Health, Welfare and Pensions (The OAP kind rather than Civil Service). UK Central Government and Local Authority Public Spending 2009 - Pie Charts Tables

By all means cut some civil service jobs but it won't amount to much.

 

[Stoo82]

I fear my generation will have no pension or any NHS but will still pay NI. Just like we used to have dentists on the health.

 

[GT49er]

There have been cuts in the CS but it's fromntline staff who get cut whilst mega-earning managers increse.

It is those high earners who get the gold plated pensions. The low paid will only get a pension based on their low pay. It is higher management who have gathered in all the bonuses too. If their brief is to cut staff & close offices and they suceed then they get the bonus.

HMRC, for example, is now a mess. Sussex work is now done in Scotland. Try to ring a local office and you won't get through, even if you are trying to pay a debt or contact them because of the threat of further action.

There's loads of scope for cuts in the CS. They've just got to be made in the right places.

Spot on! Sack the hundred highest earners in each deprtment, and give their assistants / deputies the job of running things (without increasing their pay) - they are the ones who generally know what's really going on anyway! The PBI (poor bloody infantry) of the Civil Service work damned hard for low pay - don't let the highly paid under-performing top brass make the cuts at their expense.

 

[bigbadbonkingbob]

I do a lot of work with the NHS, I won't say what I do, but the amount of money spent on consultants to justify decisions that could be made and executed in half the time for a third of the cost is astonishing. I can't talk for other areas of the public sector, but the savings made in the NHS would be significant for little or no harm to the delivery of services, and in many cases service delivery would be improved because it would happen more quickly. Unfortunately there's a culture of gaining promotion by avoiding being seen to have made a decision until you're sure it was the right one - the consultant is simply there as someone to blame if it goes wrong.

 

[beorhthelm]

I was being ironic if that is the correct term.

ah... sarcasm was what you're after... usually theres a smily. some people are under the delusion that Brown conducted a great economic miracle.

Spot on! Sack the hundred highest earners in each deprtment, and give their assistants / deputies the job of running things (without increasing their pay)

no, thats not the answer either. many of those "high earners" got there through graft too and know systems inside out, while assistant roles are full of people who dont actually do anything. root and brance change is needed, especially in places where there seems to be nearly as many admin staff as front line (thinking NHS). remove government, let teachers teach, police nick criminals, not spend their time working to politially motivated targets that employ hundreds of back room staff to monitor.

 

[Hatterlovesbrighton]

Spot on! Sack the hundred highest earners in each deprtment, and give their assistants / deputies the job of running things (without increasing their pay) - they are the ones who generally know what's really going on anyway! The PBI (poor bloody infantry) of the Civil Service work damned hard for low pay - don't let the highly paid under-performing top brass make the cuts at their expense.

Do they? In my part of the civil service its the middle managers that work the hardest. The top brass are all about setting a work-life balance example while the people at the bottom don't get paid enough to work an extra day as unpaid overtime.

 

[folkestonesgull]

I work in local government and we are looking at 20% cuts across my department. We generate income which essentially funds our core services. Discretionary services which encourage private sector spending will be cut, as will jobs as the funding to local councils is being significantly reduced over the next 4 years to offset the costs of bailing out the banks and private sector economy.
Whilst I work in the public sector I do not get a bonus, a company car, corporate weekends away etc. My pension is ok, not anything like that given to civil servants however. I have friends who work in all areas of the private sector. They have not had pay cuts or lost their jobs.
I can't see how cutting a large number of public sector jobs and increasing unemployment in a recession will save money in the long term. Further, it is clearly evident that the essentially tax payer owned banks are still paying 7 figure salaries to their directors and a massive bonus culture still exists. How can the banks be paying such salaries and bonuses with the massive IOU stuck to their foreheads? Why is the public sector taking the fiscal flack for private sector mistakes?
It seems to me that the government don't have the balls to take on any kind of private sector organisation and are therefore flogging the public sector instead.
Yes, the NHS does have a crazy budget and needs remodelling to get it out of the mid twentieth century. Yes, there will be a pension crisis and the final salary pension at 60 will need to be changed without a doubt but cutting jobs across the board is not the answer.

 

[strings]

Interesting how the government is going to cut public sector jobs, whilst REDUCING unemployment. A good trick if they can do it. I, for one, don't believe them.