I don’t disagree with that. But my point is that if it suited China to throw Russia under the bus they would do it without a second’s hesitation, IMO.
There is historically no love lost between the two nations at all.
[Politics] Russia invades Ukraine (24/02/2022)
- Thread starter vegster
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There is historically no love lost between the two nations at all.
Yes they would, I agree. China would like to take back some of their old territory. But that doesn't mean Ukraine should let them in as part of a peacekeeping team, that would be madness.
- Aug 24, 2020
- 8,576
Don't forget that Russia has an eastern seaboard, and Russian vessels can still catch fire at this end of the country.
- Aug 24, 2020
- 8,576
When I first looked at this video, I thought WTF is this? Poker vs chess? Oh please....
But as the video progressed, it began to make more and more sense. I found I was recalling events which actually did support the theory.
The world class distributed (= secure from attack) drone industry of Ukraine, making pinpoint hits deep inside Russia. .
The Kursk incursion, to draw Russia's troops from where Russia wanted to be - on the front line.
The picking off, by drone, of Russian assault troops (1000-2000 a day), and all Russian supply vehicles in a 15 km kill zone ahead of the front line.
Mark the economist's view is my view. Ukraine will win.
And a few days ago Erdogan charged and detained his main rival (mayor of Istanbul) with trumped up bs...an example of your point 1).
According to The Rest is Politics, Erdogan is heading toward autocracy fast right now because he'll get zero push back from Trump, and very little from Europe...who want to be onside with Turkey because of Ukraine.
I'm not even sure Erdogan wants to be in the EU now. He prefers autocracy, but has decent relations with many countries including the EU generally, and is adept at playing 'both' sides as needed.
Yep, I also had to hang in there on the first few minutes...as I have with other of his releases. He's different,as you know
.But it was a worthwhile watch, yes.
- Nov 11, 2009
- 13,053
Really inciteful article about stolen Ukrainian children in Russian "re-education camps"
It's totally sick and shocking, and yet heartwarming too, to read of such open defiance of Ukrainian kids in the camps.
www.politico.eu
It's totally sick and shocking, and yet heartwarming too, to read of such open defiance of Ukrainian kids in the camps.
The Ukrainian teens who took on Putin’s gulag archipelago — and won
When Vlad and his friends realized the Kremlin would not return them home, they staged an open revolt.
www.politico.eu
crookie
Well-known member
Artillery Is Still King, And Ukraine Has Mastered Producing Howitzers
Ukraine can now produce 40 Bohdana howitzers per month, matching Russia's capacity. Ukraine is integrating their artillery with drone and infantry tactics.
www.forbes.com
Incredible stats here. Matching Russian howitzer production and vastly outperforming European production.
Needs must and all that, but it's greatArtillery Is Still King, And Ukraine Has Mastered Producing Howitzers
Ukraine can now produce 40 Bohdana howitzers per month, matching Russia's capacity. Ukraine is integrating their artillery with drone and infantry tactics.
Incredible stats here. Matching Russian howitzer production and vastly outperforming European production.
fly high
Well-known member
MOD procurement really does need to find out how they do this along with drone technology instead of their usual snails pace expensive ways. We need to be building weapons at speed to increase our stock and to have excess for Ukraine.Needs must and all that, but it's great
Interesting analysis from Denys on why Ukraine has not attacked the Kerch bridge again. Summary:
- support pillars are very strong and will require precise and high explosive hits
- booms protect from sea drones for now
- no ATACMS at the moment.
- Storm Shadow probably insufficient quantity available, also difficult delivery to the bridge
- Taurus not yet available
- glide bombs are powerful but aircraft can't get close enough to deliver
- probably bad timing to try during "peace" discussions
Maybe a submarine drone to get under the protective booms?...later (me, not Denys)
- support pillars are very strong and will require precise and high explosive hits
- booms protect from sea drones for now
- no ATACMS at the moment.
- Storm Shadow probably insufficient quantity available, also difficult delivery to the bridge
- Taurus not yet available
- glide bombs are powerful but aircraft can't get close enough to deliver
- probably bad timing to try during "peace" discussions
Maybe a submarine drone to get under the protective booms?...later (me, not Denys)
- Aug 24, 2020
- 8,576
All this talk of warmongering annoys me. Ukraine should be channeling its inner Russian, and seeking to end the war by diplomacy.
For instance, as a condition of any future ceasefire, they should demand that Russia weaken the support pillars and remove the protective booms.
Indeed. I'd like to read some Ukrainian red lines too.
Yep, like having Putin in a Ukrainian prison
- Aug 24, 2020
- 8,576
That needs to be considered carefully.
Wouldn't Russia try to break any red lines that Ukraine sets, precisely because Ukraine has them as red lines?
It follows that Ukraine could do worse than setting red lines which don't actually matter to them. That way, they could occupy Russian forces on pointless exercises and use up Russian munitions etc.
I was thinking more like... to the Trump administration: We'll accept the ceasefire/minerals deal/ insert fave here... when we have ten more Patriot/or equivalent plus unlimited Patriot missiles to defend our cities and energy infrastructure.
I know, just a whim.
Ukrainian red lines wouldn't affect the battlefield, it would just delay any ceasefire agreement. That in itself is a good thing, but the danger is that Ukraine get blamed for the lack of ceasefire sooner than they might have otherwise, and US help ends sooner than it would have.
There's a fair amount of opinion that Russia will agree to some sort of ceasefire before the victory parade on 9th May. If this is simply to stop the threat of Ukrainian drones overhead, then it would have to be a full ceasefire, so nothing to do with the Black Sea ceasefire currently being proposed.
I'm not sure of the value of the victory parade to Russia, and therefore the value to Ukraine in stopping/interrupting it.
My thinking is that Europe should let Trump know that we appreciate all the help the US has given, and that we're ready to step up (on our own if necessary) to make sure Russia loses this war, and that we'll go to war with Russia if that's what it takes.
My thinking being that with the right message, it will become clear to Trump that if he wants to be on the winning side, that's not Russia.
Now while actually going to war with Russia is not required at the moment, the will to do so if necessary is. Russia will keep expanding until it is stopped, so fronting up to them is an inevitability. We can do it in 10 years' time when they've invaded several other countries, or we can do it now.