[Albion] Losing Macalister & Caicedo

[SUIYHP]

I dont think any doubt both will go after RDZs comments. Alexis is more of a fond farewell though I think- did his time here and conquered the world in the process.

 

[Horses Arse]

Ben White has.

Massively better? Playing out of position in a team a few places above - not massively better right now. Trossard doing OK but mainly benchwarming and the others have properly bombed so far.

Should be heeded by those keen to depart. As Potter found, it wasn't all about him.

 

[Horses Arse]

The danger of all this is Sothampton. They were receiving the same media plaudits of how to be successful in the transfer market.
It only takes a couple of windows where the manager or players doesn't work out as well, and your back fighting relegation.

They weren't as good though, nor did they plan so much in advance from what I recal. It felt like one out - one in, but I wasn't paying that much attention.

What was very funny is that we thought getting Burke from them would enable transfer success to be replicated here - how wrong we were. I do recall BarbObe singing his prasies not that long before he was sacked though. Probably sounds familiar to Chelsea

 

[Rdodge30]

Lot of talk about players wanting Europe or players wanting Champions League football… to me the teams that look most like to go far in those tournaments are City Utd and Liverpool. Are Arsenal getting out of their group ? If they do how much further will they get? How far will Newcastle go I wonder. I don’t think either of those would go further in the Champions League than BHA would go in Europa League with Mac and Moises still in the team

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Massively better? Playing out of position in a team a few places above - not massively better right now. Trossard doing OK but mainly benchwarming and the others have properly bombed so far.

Should be heeded by those keen to depart. As Potter found, it wasn't all about him.

Since he left us he has been playing regularly for a genuine title contender, will play CL football next season and was selected for a major tournament. The higher you get, the greater the competition. He’s holding his own.

Whether we like it or not, he has established himself at an internationally known club. I’d say this is a big step up.

 

[Farehamseagull]

I think both will go (for massive money) and I'll wish them both well. Feel privileged to have watched them in the stripes. Whoever Caicedo goes to, he will excel and go on to be seen as the best midfielder in the world IMO.

Mac Allister is an interesting one though. If he goes to Liverpool or another elite/Champions league side and the team/fans expect him to be a goalscoring/attacking midfield star, I could see it not working out for him and fans getting on his back. He needs to accept he's a deep lying midfielder and if he does that, he will be a star wherever he goes.

 

[Horses Arse]

Since he left us he has been playing regularly for a genuine title contender, will play CL football next season and was selected for a major tournament. The higher you get, the greater the competition. He’s holding his own.

Whether we like it or not, he has established himself at an internationally known club. I’d say this is a big step up.

Not denying White's at a bigger club with greater potential. He's certainly not bombed or looked like a waste of money (although it was a massive fee for a right back) but has he developed? Has he stepped up a notch? Has that move to a big club got International recognition and admiring glances from elsewhere? No, absolutely not and that's not just about Southgate being a twat. He's not played in his favoured/best role and that's not helped him much from what I've seen.

Top 4 the target again for Arsenal I'd say unless they spend big and often. They've been fortunate with Liverpool, Man Utd, Chelsea and Man City's season this year. They beat us once early in De Zerbi's reign with our two crucial midfielders missing.

In terms of recent departures Trossard is next best I guess but is certainly not first choice at Arsenal. Decent back up but is that what the move was really all about? Bissouma's move has been disasterous - again surely not all about Conte being a dick. Cucurella? No point delating that, he's bombed out there and while execuses can be made about the state of the club the player should still be able to perform at reasonable levels - he's been shocking.

If you step back and think beyond immediate salary then with all the plyers that have gone they'd have been better off staying put. Whilst I think Caceido and Mac Callister are world class I thought similar about White and to a lesser extent Bissouma. It will be interesting to see how they fair when they move on but those recent moves must surely make players think twice.

Or more liklely I'm just being naieve and its all about money. Actually yes, pretty sure that's right!

 

[A1X]

Personally I'm gutted MacAllister will go to Liverpool, hate that club with a burning passion, would genuinely rather he want to anyone else

 

[Javeaseagull]

Not denying White's at a bigger club with greater potential. He's certainly not bombed or looked like a waste of money (although it was a massive fee for a right back) but has he developed? Has he stepped up a notch? Has that move to a big club got International recognition and admiring glances from elsewhere? No, absolutely not and that's not just about Southgate being a twat. He's not played in his favoured/best role and that's not helped him much from what I've seen.

Top 4 the target again for Arsenal I'd say unless they spend big and often. They've been fortunate with Liverpool, Man Utd, Chelsea and Man City's season this year. They beat us once early in De Zerbi's reign with our two crucial midfielders missing.

In terms of recent departures Trossard is next best I guess but is certainly not first choice at Arsenal. Decent back up but is that what the move was really all about? Bissouma's move has been disasterous - again surely not all about Conte being a dick. Cucurella? No point delating that, he's bombed out there and while execuses can be made about the state of the club the player should still be able to perform at reasonable levels - he's been shocking.

If you step back and think beyond immediate salary then with all the plyers that have gone they'd have been better off staying put. Whilst I think Caceido and Mac Callister are world class I thought similar about White and to a lesser extent Bissouma. It will be interesting to see how they fair when they move on but those recent moves must surely make players think twice.

Or more liklely I'm just being naieve and its all about money. Actually yes, pretty sure that's right!

That is the point isn’t it. We just don’t pay those kind of wages and I doubt if we ever will. It’s not sustainable and if players really only want to chase the money that’s just the way it is. I think they are very well paid by anyones standard and sometimes there is more to life than money. Being happy with your workplace and teammates is pretty important imo. At their age there is plenty of time to make their fortunes, if they haven’t already.

 

[Hamilton]

I'll love it if this is all mind games.

Anyhow, chances are that Tony has agreed sales with conditions already, or he hasn't and he'll only sell if he wants to sell. Right now, the two players look so happy.

If they leave in the window then they'll be leaving the right way.

 

[West Upper Seagull]

I think if we qualify for CL, then a better chance at keeping both.
If Europa then I think that helps as they will only go to a CL team (one would think) so eliminates Spurs/Chelsea etc., might be able to keep 1.
If we don't make the above then I suspect both will be gone.
However not all bad as that means we won't have those European games so "strength and depth" (tm) aren't as crucial so full on to next season.

You make a good point in that why would Mac or Caceido even consider going to Chelsea when they won’t have European football next season. And if we qualify for the Europa League then surely that eliminates Liverpool from the equation too if they fail to make the top 4 as well as Spurs.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Not denying White's at a bigger club with greater potential. He's certainly not bombed or looked like a waste of money (although it was a massive fee for a right back) but has he developed? Has he stepped up a notch? Has that move to a big club got International recognition and admiring glances from elsewhere? No, absolutely not and that's not just about Southgate being a twat. He's not played in his favoured/best role and that's not helped him much from what I've seen.

Top 4 the target again for Arsenal I'd say unless they spend big and often. They've been fortunate with Liverpool, Man Utd, Chelsea and Man City's season this year. They beat us once early in De Zerbi's reign with our two crucial midfielders missing.

In terms of recent departures Trossard is next best I guess but is certainly not first choice at Arsenal. Decent back up but is that what the move was really all about? Bissouma's move has been disasterous - again surely not all about Conte being a dick. Cucurella? No point delating that, he's bombed out there and while execuses can be made about the state of the club the player should still be able to perform at reasonable levels - he's been shocking.

If you step back and think beyond immediate salary then with all the plyers that have gone they'd have been better off staying put. Whilst I think Caceido and Mac Callister are world class I thought similar about White and to a lesser extent Bissouma. It will be interesting to see how they fair when they move on but those recent moves must surely make players think twice.

Or more liklely I'm just being naieve and its all about money. Actually yes, pretty sure that's right!

I feel he has. As I said, he has held his own in a team which was a genuine title contender until two days ago. He was selected for a major international tournament. That is certainly development in my mind. We will have to agree to disagree.

 

[spence]

Personally I'm gutted MacAllister will go to Liverpool, hate that club with a burning passion, would genuinely rather he want to anyone else

Absolutely this. Anyone but those scousers. My most hated big 6 team.

 

[Nobby Cybergoat]

I mentioned on a similar thread that I think there is a great chance we keep one or both.

Only about 6 clubs in the world have the sort of finance needed to buy Moises or Alexis. But if they are looking at midfielders, they will also be keeping an eye on ........ Bellingham, Mount, Phillips, Rice, Rabiot, Neves, Palhinha, De Jong, Maddison, Ward Prowse. And probably at least 10 I haven't thought of.

I don't doubt that big clubs will be interested in our stars. I don't doubt that our stars will be interested in what they have to say. I do doubt that they will be looking at our likely selling stance and concluding that going all in on Moises or Mac will represent the best value for money.

 

[Robinjakarta]

Apologising on Twitter for the tackle on Martinelli, looks like Caicedo is still twerking for Arsenal.

Looks to me the voice of an honourable guy.

 

[Machiavelli]

I feel he has. As I said, he has held his own in a team which was a genuine title contender until two days ago. He was selected for a major international tournament. That is certainly development in my mind. We will have to agree to disagree.

While I agree with your broader point, it's worth adding that White got selected for a major international tournament while a Brighton player -- by, get this, 'the clueless waistcoat'.

 

[Blues Guitarist]

Looks to me the voice of an honourable guy.

Has Martinelli apologised for his assualt on Mitoma?

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

While I agree with your broader point, it's worth adding that White got selected for a major international tournament while a Brighton player -- by, get this, 'the clueless waistcoat'.

Fair enough. I was thinking of the world cup but you're right he was also selected for the Euros. I'd forgotten this.

 

[Garry Nelson's Left Foot]

Who's paying 100m for Caicedo this summer?

 

[Garry Nelson's Left Foot]

I think both will go (for massive money) and I'll wish them both well. Feel privileged to have watched them in the stripes. Whoever Caicedo goes to, he will excel and go on to be seen as the best midfielder in the world IMO.

Mac Allister is an interesting one though. If he goes to Liverpool or another elite/Champions league side and the team/fans expect him to be a goalscoring/attacking midfield star, I could see it not working out for him and fans getting on his back. He needs to accept he's a deep lying midfielder and if he does that, he will be a star wherever he goes.

Yeah, there should be no way Ally Mac plays as a ten for Liverpool. Put him as part of a midfield two or three and he'll be excellent. I suspect Klopp won't be as accommodating as RDZ on that point.