The Jeremy Corbyn thread

[Don Quixote]

They will have to fight as independents with no party organisation to finance them whilst the official Labour Party candidate opposed them, they would be wiped out and the official Labour Party would romp home. The public won't tolerate the antics of these Blairite idiots lightly

They are the official labour party. I assume you were complaining when Corbyn was a rebel in a labour government, something he has no chance of achieving himself. You seem quick to judge losers on here, but you support Corbyn without a reason. He has to go, and staying is damaging the party.

 

[jonny.rainbow]

They're not all Blairites. It doesn't mean this is a centrist action either. If the left like yourself could just stop for a moment, you'd ask yourself whether someone with exactly the same views as Corbyn is better placed to lead the party? Corbyn doesn't hold exclusive rights to honest, left wing policies. This is about someone who doesn't appear to reach out to people, doesn't send out a convincing message, isn't inspiring new people to follow the Labour Party. It seemed like he could at first, but he has failed. Doesn't necessarily need a move to the right for a leader, just someone who can inspire a bit of confidence, a bit of conviction.

I await your list inspirations candidates.

By the way, Corbyn got the Remain message across to his constituents. The same can't be said for Benn, Hodge and many of these other Francis Urquharts.

 

[ROSM]

I await your list inspirations candidates.

By the way, Corbyn got the Remain message across to his constituents. The same can't be said for Benn, Hodge and many of these other Francis Urquharts.

There was a strategy which was to be clear that labour took seriously people's concerns on immigration. Corbyn blew that wide open with his constant 'i think we should have unlimited immigration'

Now, he may believe that but it did nothing to get labour voters in the north east Wales or Yorkshire to support the campaign in the numbers needed to overcome the clear leave votes in Kent or the tory shires

That's where he let the party and campaign down. Hell it's likely even conceivable he voted leave himself. He holed the labour in campaign below the waterline. He has no strategy, no policies and treats everything as a principled protest. He's not pragmatic enough to be a leader and is only concerned with the views of the trade unions and socialist workers party

 

[portslade seagull]

He is becoming more entrenched. It will just be another stitch up with a leadership vote anyway. He is there to stay so it looks like they will always be at war

 

[drew]

I await your list inspirations candidates.

By the way, Corbyn got the Remain message across to his constituents. The same can't be said for Benn, Hodge and many of these other Francis Urquharts.

Did he? Seeing as the only London boroughs not to vote Remain were Barking and Dagenham, Bexley, Sutton, Havering and Hillingdon are you quite sure it was Corbyn's efforts that brought about a Remain vote in North Islington??

 

[CheeseRolls]

There was a strategy which was to be clear that labour took seriously people's concerns on immigration. Corbyn blew that wide open with his constant 'i think we should have unlimited immigration'

Now, he may believe that but it did nothing to get labour voters in the north east Wales or Yorkshire to support the campaign in the numbers needed to overcome the clear leave votes in Kent or the tory shires

That's where he let the party and campaign down. Hell it's likely even conceivable he voted leave himself. He holed the labour in campaign below the waterline. He has no strategy, no policies and treats everything as a principled protest. He's not pragmatic enough to be a leader and is only concerned with the views of the trade unions and socialist workers party

What about that key "remain" speech he gave in Hastings in support of the European Fisheries policy ? Did that swing many voters ?

 

[yxee]

They're not all Blairites. It doesn't mean this is a centrist action either. If the left like yourself could just stop for a moment, you'd ask yourself whether someone with exactly the same views as Corbyn is better placed to lead the party? Corbyn doesn't hold exclusive rights to honest, left wing policies. This is about someone who doesn't appear to reach out to people, doesn't send out a convincing message, isn't inspiring new people to follow the Labour Party. It seemed like he could at first, but he has failed. Doesn't necessarily need a move to the right for a leader, just someone who can inspire a bit of confidence, a bit of conviction.

I don't understand how he failed. The cabinet were annoyed he didn't campaign THEIR way, so they all quit. What is his crime exactly, failing to lead the party on something he doesn't actually believe in?

 

[Ernest]

Angela Eagles been told by her constituency party to back Comrade Corbyn, so if she stands for leader it will be bye, bye as a member of the Labour Party. We only have a week to hang on and once the Chillcot report is published the likes of Blair, Campbell, Straw etc will have bigger things to worry about.

 

[daveinprague]

Martyn Ziegler ‏@martynziegler 5m5 minutes ago
The good news: Jeremy Corbyn has been backed into a corner. The bad news: Harry Kane is going to take it.

 

[cunning fergus]

They're not all Blairites. It doesn't mean this is a centrist action either. If the left like yourself could just stop for a moment, you'd ask yourself whether someone with exactly the same views as Corbyn is better placed to lead the party? Corbyn doesn't hold exclusive rights to honest, left wing policies. This is about someone who doesn't appear to reach out to people, doesn't send out a convincing message, isn't inspiring new people to follow the Labour Party. It seemed like he could at first, but he has failed. Doesn't necessarily need a move to the right for a leader, just someone who can inspire a bit of confidence, a bit of conviction.

Listen to yourself......

Corbyn was elected legitimately and fairly in accordance with Party Rules less than 12 months ago.

The behaviour of the PLP following the referendum is appalling, as oppose to standing behind the decision of the membership and trying to understand the reasons why they have lost huge parts of their traditional core support, they have rejected the decision of their membership and stabbed their leader in the back.

This group of MPs and Labour supporters includes the likes of Lord Falconer a man now agitating for Parliament to reject the referendum result on the basis the Parliament is sovereign not the people........I mean, really..........why even bother with elections at all?

These shits would no doubt, pre-referendum, have extolled British values of tolerance, democracy and the rule of law.

We can see quite clearly just how these MPs treasure these values...........evidently it is only when it suits them.

It's like they think Thursday's referendum never happened.

 

[cunning fergus]

There was a strategy which was to be clear that labour took seriously people's concerns on immigration. Corbyn blew that wide open with his constant 'i think we should have unlimited immigration'

Now, he may believe that but it did nothing to get labour voters in the north east Wales or Yorkshire to support the campaign in the numbers needed to overcome the clear leave votes in Kent or the tory shires

That's where he let the party and campaign down. Hell it's likely even conceivable he voted leave himself. He holed the labour in campaign below the waterline. He has no strategy, no policies and treats everything as a principled protest. He's not pragmatic enough to be a leader and is only concerned with the views of the trade unions and socialist workers party

The problem is ideological.

You cannot reconcile voters who want to control the UK labour market (a socialist policy advocated by huge swathes of the working class), with voters who want completely free labour market courtesy of the EU.

There are plenty of other political dichotomies that Labour has ignored since Blair, a charismatic leader will not resolve these differences, Blair did that and that is why we have got to this point.

Until this reality is confronted and accepted Labour is dead as a political force.

It ignored this lesson in Scotland, and now it is ignoring it in England and Wales.

 

[drew]

Listen to yourself......

Corbyn was elected legitimately and fairly in accordance with Party Rules less than 12 months ago.

The behaviour of the PLP following the referendum is appalling, as oppose to standing behind the decision of the membership and trying to understand the reasons why they have lost huge parts of their traditional core support, they have rejected the decision of their membership and stabbed their leader in the back.

This group of MPs and Labour supporters includes the likes of Lord Falconer a man now agitating for Parliament to reject the referendum result on the basis the Parliament is sovereign not the people........I mean, really..........why even bother with elections at all?

These shits would no doubt, pre-referendum, have extolled British values of tolerance, democracy and the rule of law.

We can see quite clearly just how these MPs treasure these values...........evidently it is only when it suits them.

It's like they think Thursday's referendum never happened.

He was elected democratically by the labour party but maybe those that voted for him then might now not be impressed with his leadership qualities, especially if there are those that voted for him and also for Remain. There is a process and if there is a leadership challenge it will obviously be in accordance with rules. Corbyn's aides can't complain he is being stabbed in the back when that is precisely what they did with the Remain campaign. Corbyn hasn't grasped the concept that you have to be a PM for the whole country, not just the 250,000 that originally voted for you.

 

[cunning fergus]

He was elected democratically by the labour party but maybe those that voted for him then might now not be impressed with his leadership qualities, especially if there are those that voted for him and also for Remain. There is a process and if there is a leadership challenge it will obviously be in accordance with rules. Corbyn's aides can't complain he is being stabbed in the back when that is precisely what they did with the Remain campaign. Corbyn hasn't grasped the concept that you have to be a PM for the whole country, not just the 250,000 that originally voted for you.

You are not making any sense here at all.

There was a leadership process, he was legitimately and fairly elected.

The reason that remain lost was not because of Corbyn, if you or anyone else believes that then you are deluded. Labour and Corbyn backed the wrong horse and their pro EU policy is not what the people want.

Labour are persisting with an neo liberal ideology that has alienated their Scottish support base and now the same is happening in England and Wales.

A new leader will not change that dynamic.........they need listen to what the people want, not tell the people they know better. Usually it is the country, now this time it's their own membership.

People who understand this very simple position will be aghast at their treachery and lack of commitment to their own rules. A shiny new leader is not going to make it "alright"......to quote Neil Kinnock.

 

[ROSM]

You are not making any sense here at all.

There was a leadership process, he was legitimately and fairly elected.

The reason that remain lost was not because of Corbyn, if you or anyone else believes that then you are deluded. Labour and Corbyn backed the wrong horse and their pro EU policy is not what the people want.

Labour are persisting with an neo liberal ideology that has alienated their Scottish support base and now the same is happening in England and Wales.

A new leader will not change that dynamic.........they need listen to what the people want, not tell the people they know better. Usually it is the country, now this time it's their own membership.

People who understand this very simple position will be aghast at their treachery and lack of commitment to their own rules. A shiny new leader is not going to make it "alright"......to quote Neil Kinnock.

Labour didn't lose the last election because it wasn't left wing enough. It was perceived as not having a coherent policy on immigration, not being pro business and still lacking economic credibility (yeah I know that the tories are probably screwed now on those too)

Nobody wins elections by appealing only to its core vote. As you've said yourself, many in the core labour areas went for ukip due to the immigration issue.

There is a positive coherent option and one which Caroline Lucas had suggested, that being that the rebate from Europe should be targetted at the public services in areas struggling due to increased populations ( not just EU migration) Ironically Wales and Cornwall would likely have got less but the east coast of the UK plus Yorkshire and Lancashire as well as the Midlands would have benefited

 

[Titanic]

and despite the vote Jezza is clinging on. So a few more went yesterday afternoon...

• 18:48 Liz McInnes resigns as Shadow Communities and Local Government Minister.
• 17:06 Kevin Brennan stands down as Shadow Business Minister.
• 17:27 Clive Efford quits as Shadow Culture, Media and Sport Minister.
• 17:13 Christina Rees resigns as Shadow Justice Minister.
• 16:46 Lynn Brown quits as Shadow Home Office Minister.

 

[Titanic]

A new leader will not change that dynamic.........they need listen to what the people want, not tell the people they know better. Usually it is the country, now this time it's their own membership.

Whatever happened to VISION, INSPIRATION, MOTIVATION and LEADERSHIP?

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

You are not making any sense here at all.

There was a leadership process, he was legitimately and fairly elected.

The reason that remain lost was not because of Corbyn, if you or anyone else believes that then you are deluded. Labour and Corbyn backed the wrong horse and their pro EU policy is not what the people want.

Labour are persisting with an neo liberal ideology that has alienated their Scottish support base and now the same is happening in England and Wales.

A new leader will not change that dynamic.........they need listen to what the people want, not tell the people they know better. Usually it is the country, now this time it's their own membership.

People who understand this very simple position will be aghast at their treachery and lack of commitment to their own rules. A shiny new leader is not going to make it "alright"......to quote Neil Kinnock.

If Corbyn had campaigned as hard as he's now clinging desperately onto his job Remain might well have won. But in anycase, the point is Labour should be a pro-European party and millions of us were furious with his utterly lack lustre role.

If you man hangs on it will lead to electoral disaster at the next election. It'll be interesting to see how his totally out of touch views on immigration chime with working class communities who have made it clear that immigration is their number one issue. Is he listening " to what the people want"? in this respect? Of course not.

Corbyn stands no chance at a general election and if you can't see that, then it's you who are deluded. He needs to go.

I hope the unions will tell him that today.

 

[Brovion]

I await your list inspirations candidates.

By the way, Corbyn got the Remain message across to his constituents. The same can't be said for Benn, Hodge and many of these other Francis Urquharts.

He got the message across to HIS constituents. Because his constituency is Islington.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Interesting discussion. It strikes me that both sides are correct. JC is out of touch with the working class on immigration and the parliamentary party are out of touch with the working class on Europe. It is quite possible that the Labour Party is finished whoever is leader because of a reluctance to represent its core supporters and reach out to the majority.

 

[Bozza]

#awkward

The Scottish National Party will today ask to be declared the official Oppositon at Westminster.

They say their leader Angus Robertson enjoys more support than Jeremy Corbyn.

There are 56 SNP MPs - but only 40 Labour MPs have expressed support for Mr Corbyn.

They also say they are able to fill all the relevant shadow posts to the government, unlike Mr Corbyn.

They point to Parliamentary rules which say the official Opposition must be "prepared to assume power."