Poyet to Sunderland

[Sergei's Celebration]

You could well be right - IF this is the case though there would have been another party involved, hard therefore to say it was necessarily GP's 'fault' that he was not single-minded about the second playoff game.

Are you suggesting that someone else should take some of the blame for the 2nd leg? The manager should always take responsibility for setting the team up, ensuring a sense of occasion in the players, identifying and planning how to neutralise the biggest threats and exploiting weaknesses, getting the team in the right mindset and much more. If Gus wasn't single minded about the game...thats Gus' fault, no one else's. of course it was GPs fault, who else would it be? Barber, Bloom, Oatway, Tanno, us fans, the media?

 

[Creaky]

Are you suggesting that someone else should take some of the blame for the 2nd leg? The manager should always take responsibility for setting the team up, ensuring a sense of occasion in the players, identifying and planning how to neutralise the biggest threats and exploiting weaknesses, getting the team in the right mindset and much more. If Gus wasn't single minded about the game...thats Gus' fault, no one else's. of course it was GPs fault, who else would it be? Barber, Bloom, Oatway, Tanno, us fans, the media?

IF one of GP's superiors acted in a way that distracted him from his job then YES they must shoulder part of the blame.

Analogous to a company director who demotivates the sales manager then is surprised if the performance of the sales team drops - the run up to the playoffs was not the time for either side to get into hissy fits with each other.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

IF one of GP's superiors acted in a way that distracted him from his job then YES they must shoulder part of the blame.

Analogous to a company director who demotivates the sales manager then is surprised if the performance of the sales team drops - the run up to the playoffs was not the time for either side to get into hissy fits with each other.

It is still the responsibility of middle management to ensure what happens behind the scenes does not affect the 'shop floor'.

Anyway what if that sales manager had told everyone he is leaving the company then got called into the bosses office and told to do the job he is hired to do?

 

[The Merry Prankster]

IF one of GP's superiors acted in a way that distracted him from his job then YES they must shoulder part of the blame.

Analogous to a company director who demotivates the sales manager then is surprised if the performance of the sales team drops - the run up to the playoffs was not the time for either side to get into hissy fits with each other.

The fact that he wanted out from March onwards would suggest that his heart wasn't entirely in it and that his head in might not have been in the right place.

 

[Bwian]

Are you suggesting that someone else should take some of the blame for the 2nd leg? The manager should always take responsibility for setting the team up, ensuring a sense of occasion in the players, identifying and planning how to neutralise the biggest threats and exploiting weaknesses, getting the team in the right mindset and much more. If Gus wasn't single minded about the game...thats Gus' fault, no one else's. of course it was GPs fault, who else would it be? Barber, Bloom, Oatway, Tanno, us fans, the media?

The problem(s) for me is Gus Poyet. He messed up big time with the second leg of the playoffs. He, if rumours are true, turned up for the second leg against Palace 30 minutes before kick off. Not exactly professional if true and not surprising that the players appeared to be ill-prepared and not up for it.

Poyet blaming everybody but himself is what has angered so many. We should have beaten Palace over two legs, without a shadow of a doubt. Forget the goal that nearly was at Selhurst, fact is Gus blew it. With the squad he had available we should have gone up in second place. Instead, we lost in the playoffs.

Forgetting everything else, Poyet's post Palace defeat interview turned me from wanting him to stay and finish the job to wanting him gone straight away. He didn't give a damn about the club at that point and that is unforgivable. He may well be the reason we nearly got promoted. He is also the reason we didn't too. I hope he gets the Sunderland job so we can close the book on his era. He wasn't as great as some are making him out to have been, he wasn't as bad as the others say either. Personally I'm now pissed off with the man because HE cost us promotion after getting us so close.

I was one of many who didn't want him moving to another club, gradually became more and more frustrated at his less than subtle hints for other clubs to come and get him and now I'm glad he's gone. Thanks for the good you did Gus and bollocks to you for the rest.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

Great post Bwian.

 

[The Merry Prankster]

The problem(s) for me is Gus Poyet. He messed up big time with the second leg of the playoffs. He, if rumours are true, turned up for the second leg against Palace 30 minutes before kick off. Not exactly professional if true and not surprising that the players appeared to be ill-prepared and not up for it.

Poyet blaming everybody but himself is what has angered so many. We should have beaten Palace over two legs, without a shadow of a doubt. Forget the goal that nearly was at Selhurst, fact is Gus blew it. With the squad he had available we should have gone up in second place. Instead, we lost in the playoffs.

Forgetting everything else, Poyet's post Palace defeat interview turned me from wanting him to stay and finish the job to wanting him gone straight away. He didn't give a damn about the club at that point and that is unforgivable. He may well be the reason we nearly got promoted. He is also the reason we didn't too. I hope he gets the Sunderland job so we can close the book on his era. He wasn't as great as some are making him out to have been, he wasn't as bad as the others say either. Personally I'm now pissed off with the man because HE cost us promotion after getting us so close.

I was one of many who didn't want him moving to another club, gradually became more and more frustrated at his less than subtle hints for other clubs to come and get him and now I'm glad he's gone. Thanks for the good you did Gus and bollocks to you for the rest.

Articulated my feelings perfectly. Thanks.

 

[Creaky]

It is still the responsibility of middle management to ensure what happens behind the scenes does not affect the 'shop floor'.

Anyway what if that sales manager had told everyone he is leaving the company then got called into the bosses office and told to do the job he is hired to do?

It may be middle-management's "responsibility" to do as you say but we're talking about real people, not robots - there are many external factors that can affect an employees performance.

It is equally upper management's job to ensure that they don't behave in a way that is detrimental to the performance of those working lower down in the organisation - ultimately the buck stops with TB.

Any sales manager of mine who told their staff they were leaving would be out the door immediately - I certainly wouldn't force them to carry on working - that would be a recipe for disaster.

 

[The Large One]

The fact that he wanted out from March onwards would suggest that his heart wasn't entirely in it and that his head in might not have been in the right place.

... which co-incided with our best run of the season - 5 wins, 4 draw in 9 matches, 18 goals scored, 5 conceded.

This says... something, just not quite sure what.

 

[Creaky]

The fact that he wanted out from March onwards would suggest that his heart wasn't entirely in it and that his head in might not have been in the right place.

Didn't GP essentially deny that was the case when interviewed on Sky

 

[The Large One]

Interesting exoneration of the players here. I saw some reasonable performances that evening, and some awful ones. And that's the fault of one person - and one person alone?

 

[The Hon Sec]

Agree wholeheartedly with Bwian above. Couldn't have put it better. Thanks for the ride, Gus, but I believe we are in a better place now.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

It may be middle-management's "responsibility" to do as you say but we're talking about real people, not robots - there are many external factors that can affect an employees performance.

It is equally upper management's job to ensure that they don't behave in a way that is detrimental to the performance of those working lower down in the organisation - ultimately the buck stops with TB.

Any sales manager of mine who told their staff they were leaving would be out the door immediately - I certainly wouldn't force them to carry on working - that would be a recipe for disaster.

It is also upper managements responsibility to ensure strategic goals are met; so if it was better to maintain a person in a role that is a key enabler to one of those goals you may well keep them in there. Its a risk score = sack / may not go up v dont sack / pos go up.

Interesting exoneration of the players here. I saw some reasonable performances that evening, and some awful ones. And that's the fault of one person - and one person alone?

I work bad when I get a task i am not prepared for, by a boss that has told me he is off, who has (allegedly) turned up late for work. Again the middle management analogy fits; it is the sales managers responsibility when the sales team dont sell...thats what management is all about and when you dont manage things fall down and people dont work to their full potential.

 

[symyjym]

Ulloa didn't need a whole season to fit into Brighton.

Do behave, Murray was key to Poyet's title winning promotion and averaged 1 goal every 2 games. He then had one bad season with Palace, where he picked up an injury, and then he became the Championship top scorer and helped them win promotion to the Prem.

Why do you have the need to put Murray down in order to lift Poyet up. It is clear that letting Murray go was the wrong decidion by him.

 

[The Large One]

I work bad when I get a task i am not prepared for, by a boss that has told me he is off, who has (allegedly) turned up late for work. Again the middle management analogy fits; it is the sales managers responsibility when the sales team dont sell...thats what management is all about and when you dont manage things fall down and people dont work to their full potential.

If I did a task based on speculation, I'd get my arsed kicked.

 

[Sergei's Celebration]

If I did a task based on speculation, I'd get my arsed kicked.

I am not sure i am getting this comment?

 

[enterprise]

The problem(s) for me is Gus Poyet. He messed up big time with the second leg of the playoffs. He, if rumours are true, turned up for the second leg against Palace 30 minutes before kick off. Not exactly professional if true and not surprising that the players appeared to be ill-prepared and not up for it.

Poyet blaming everybody but himself is what has angered so many. We should have beaten Palace over two legs, without a shadow of a doubt. Forget the goal that nearly was at Selhurst, fact is Gus blew it. With the squad he had available we should have gone up in second place. Instead, we lost in the playoffs.

Forgetting everything else, Poyet's post Palace defeat interview turned me from wanting him to stay and finish the job to wanting him gone straight away. He didn't give a damn about the club at that point and that is unforgivable. He may well be the reason we nearly got promoted. He is also the reason we didn't too. I hope he gets the Sunderland job so we can close the book on his era. He wasn't as great as some are making him out to have been, he wasn't as bad as the others say either. Personally I'm now pissed off with the man because HE cost us promotion after getting us so close.

I was one of many who didn't want him moving to another club, gradually became more and more frustrated at his less than subtle hints for other clubs to come and get him and now I'm glad he's gone. Thanks for the good you did Gus and bollocks to you for the rest.

Couldn't agree more with the above

 

[Creaky]

It is also upper managements responsibility to ensure strategic goals are met; so if it was better to maintain a person in a role that is a key enabler to one of those goals you may well keep them in there. Its a risk score = sack / may not go up v dont sack / pos go up.



I work bad when I get a task i am not prepared for, by a boss that has told me he is off, who has (allegedly) turned up late for work. Again the middle management analogy fits; it is the sales managers responsibility when the sales team dont sell...thats what management is all about and when you dont manage things fall down and people dont work to their full potential.

Well the "risk score" decision taken was patently no better than the alternative.

Yes it is the sales manager's responsibility if the sales team don't sell in exactly the same way that it is the upper management's responsibility if the sales manager doesn't perform. The higher up the organisation you go then the greater the level of responsibility.

 

[Buzzer]

Bwian has it spot on.

There are certain times when you have to put aside squabbles with the board and do what is in the best interests of the club. And from what we know as absolute truth is that a couple of days before the March game against Palace, Poyet asked to leave with immediate effect. Bearing in mind the grief he quite rightly got for messing up the September 2011 match and that he knew how important this was to us fans I find that staggeringly selfish of Poyet.

And then we know he was having problems with Barber and the lateness of his arrival and his post-match comments clearly indicate that the match was not his number one priority and that the only thing that mattered to him was him. I had a chance to go to Wembley with my sons to watch Brighton play, we had a chance at the Premiership and instead of that we get beaten by our arch-rivals at our ground - I was absolutely gutted after that game. The last thing I wanted to hear was Poyet sounding off once again about HIS ambitions. I'm sorry but for that alone F*ck you Poyet. F*ck you very much, you self-centred nob. I have no doubts where the blame for that result lies.

 

[Albumen]

So much horseshit written over the past few days on here. Think it's time to step away from NSC for a while (well I'll give it a go anyway).