[Politics] Johnson blames energy price rises on Putin

[Thunder Bolt]

Why did Liz Truss allow the gas storage facility at Grimsby to be closed in 2017?

Why is the UK exporting gas to the Netherlands, because we’ve got nowhere to store it? Where did all the gasometers go?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/12/uk-fuel-exports-netherlands-hmrc-data-russia

 

[KZNSeagull]

I’m asking who do you tax and how ? I’ve said I’ve misunderstood

How do you tax a producer, who given the current situation seems to hold a whole lot of power

There has already been a windfall tax.

North sea oil and gas producers pay corporation tax and an additional tax as well, no idea how much that is. Have tried googling it but it is too complicated for me at 10.30 on a Sunday night. Am not sure how the levy brought in by Sunak fits into it as well, but I understood that would also raise money every year they make profits and not as a one off. I think.

 

[Weststander]

According to Labour MP Lloyd Russell-Moyle, Britain produces 75% of it’s own energy and the cost of production has not gone up. In his view we should not be letting British energy companies claim this is the effect of a global problem to charge exorbitant amounts for energy we produce anyway.

I’d have to do more research on that but interesting if true.

62%, 20% of which is nuclear and renewables.

Regarding the 80% of carbons, half is imported.






The other problem is that wholesale prices are set internationally (and that means way beyond the EU/UK). EU nations are facing the very same obstacle. Portugal and Spain only recently received special permission to break away from that and lower (only) electricity prices after proving that they’re almost an energy island. They have huge stocks of gas and with their climate are leaders in renewables.

 

[Weststander]

North sea oil and gas producers pay corporation tax and an additional tax as well, no idea how much that is. Have tried googling it but it is too complicated for me at 10.30 on a Sunday night. Am not sure how the levy brought in by Sunak fits into it as well, but I understood that would also raise money every year they make profits and not as a one off. I think.

Plus the 4th, windfall taxes.

 

[rigton70]

I’m happy to be corrected and educated, I just don’t like being told to shut up.

Thank you for the explanation. It is appreciated.

It just annoys me people spouting of shite without having the facts and the scaremongering that goes with it.

This is a world wide problem and Africa will suffer most. I am expecting riots in Africa soon which will then spread. Unless our government freezes our energy bills ( which will increase borrowing ) i can see riots across Europe.

 

[rigton70]

Why did Liz Truss allow the gas storage facility at Grimsby to be closed in 2017?

Why is the UK exporting gas to the Netherlands, because we’ve got nowhere to store it? Where did all the gasometers go?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2022/aug/12/uk-fuel-exports-netherlands-hmrc-data-russia

Why did the Lib Dems vote down nuclear plants in 2011 hindsight is great.

 

[beorhthelm]

Would it be possible to tax the producers?

Honestly don’t know, seems difficult to the point of being nearly impossible ?

as a lot of producers are foreign, no. even BP and Shell are dependent on foreign nations for much their product (and less involved in North Sea), if you tried to tax on the overseas earnings, they'd be spun off asap. hence the windfall tax only looking at North Sea revenues and not raising all that much. many people want to tax because they want to tax, its an end in itself, this is just another reason to justify the cause. some might see it as source of revnue to pay for spending. what we need is a measured plan then assess how its to be funded, then look for the source to fund, what the secondary effects of that might be.

 

[Kinky Gerbil]

How did energy companies get hammered in the pandemic? Their shareholders all made profit. I don’t see how. Genuine question.

And if they did get hammered, they all seem to be still trading. Forcing people into abject poverty so they can recoup losses is not an acceptable strategy.

As you say though, a definitive answer is elusive.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/02/02...oss-of-5point7-billion-after-brutal-year.html

 

[Thunder Bolt]

Why did the Lib Dems vote down nuclear plants in 2011 hindsight is great.

Exporting gas right now isn’t hindsight.

 

[beorhthelm]

Exporting gas right now isn’t hindsight.

exporting gas to help Europe fill storage, when they fear complete cut of Russian supply, seems like some foresight.
also see point 4 of this https://oeuk.org.uk/offshore-energies-uk-oeuk-why-is-the-uk-exporting-gas-when-we-are-short-supply/.

 

[Bozza]

I don't wish to be banned.

What a bizarre post and, I think, one you've made before.

I can try to guess that you are suggesting you will be banned for disagreeing with me. I can't recall banning anyone for disagreeing with me in the 20+ years I've looked after NSC. I've no plans to start now. People disagreeing with me is often how I learn something new, and appreciate alternate points of view.

All that aside, I'm not sure what there is to disagree with in the post I made. You'll note I'\ve not made any real comment on this whole issue as it's big, complicated and one I know little about. I'm reading as much as I can though, because I want to know more.

But the standing charge increase, and the reasons for it, is something I have read about and I'm not sure it has been that widely discussed. A large part of the recent increase has, I believe, been imposed to fund the losses of various suppliers who went bust as wholesale energy prices spiked. This is a regressive burden, with a greater impact on those who can least afford it. Taken to an extreme, I've heard about people on pre-payment metres who have stopped using a fuel completely in order to try to save money, but later found out that they are in debt due to the standing charge continuing to accrue, even though they were not using the fuel at all.

Like you, I imagine, I'm not likely to need to make the "heating or eating" choice in the near future, but it doesn't mean that I can't feel that something was amiss that allowed all these new suppliers to enter the market with little consideration for if they were going to be able to continue to operate if the macro-economic climate changed.

 

[Weststander]

Exporting gas right now isn’t hindsight.

I envy the French though who got on with building nuclear plants, swatting to one side the equivalent of the LibDems and others who ideologically opposed it every step of the way. Uniquely on peninsular Europe, they’re sitting pretty right now.

 

[pastafarian]

If anyone knows someone struggling with their fuel costs or the cost of living in general, its worth pointing them towards Citizens Advice.
There is a lot of support information out there and someone may benefit from assistance they didnt realise was available or even eligible for.

Get help with the cost of living
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/get-help-with-the-cost-of-living/

Get help with bills
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/budgeting/budgeting/get-help-with-bills/

Help with debt
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/help-with-debt/

Using a food bank
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/using-a-food-bank/

If you can't afford to top up your prepayment meter
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/c...-out-who-your-gas-or-electricity-supplier-is/

What to do if you’re struggling to pay your energy bills
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/c...ur-bills/struggling-to-pay-your-energy-bills/

Save money on your gas and electricity
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/c...-deal/save-money-on-your-gas-and-electricity/

Extra financial help
There are a number of energy companies who offer grants and schemes that are open to anyone - you don't have to be a customer.

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/c...energy-bills/#Grants_To_Help_Pay_Energy_Debts

You might be able to get a grant from a charitable trust to help pay off your debts. Let's Talk has more information on available grants and how to apply.

https://www.lets-talk.online/

If you’re disabled, elderly or you get benefits, check whether you can get other help paying your energy bills.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/c...d-benefits-to-help-you-pay-your-energy-bills/

Check what help you can get from your local council
Contact your local council
https://www.gov.uk/find-local-council

Your local council might help you pay for things like:
• your energy and water bills
• food
• essential items - for example, clothes or an oven
This help is known as 'welfare assistance' or the ‘Household Support Fund’. Each council runs their own scheme. The help they offer and who can get it varies.
Ask your local council if they run a welfare assistance or Household Support Fund scheme. You can find out how to contact your local council on GOV.UK.
You don’t have to be getting benefits to get help from your local council. If you do get benefits, they won’t be affected if you start getting money from a welfare assistance or Household Support Fund scheme.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Prof. Steve Jones, UCL, FRS. I'd second his thoughts Harry. But I add dirty rotter, scum, ***t.

I was thinking more along the lines of the guitarist with the Pistols

 

[rigton70]

What a bizarre post and, I think, one you've made before.

I can try to guess that you are suggesting you will be banned for disagreeing with me. I can't recall banning anyone for disagreeing with me in the 20+ years I've looked after NSC. I've no plans to start now. People disagreeing with me is often how I learn something new, and appreciate alternate points of view.

All that aside, I'm not sure what there is to disagree with in the post I made. You'll note I'\ve not made any real comment on this whole issue as it's big, complicated and one I know little about. I'm reading as much as I can though, because I want to know more.

But the standing charge increase, and the reasons for it, is something I have read about and I'm not sure it has been that widely discussed. A large part of the recent increase has, I believe, been imposed to fund the losses of various suppliers who went bust as wholesale energy prices spiked. This is a regressive burden, with a greater impact on those who can least afford it. Taken to an extreme, I've heard about people on pre-payment metres who have stopped using a fuel completely in order to try to save money, but later found out that they are in debt due to the standing charge continuing to accrue, even though they were not using the fuel at all.

Like you, I imagine, I'm not likely to need to make the "heating or eating" choice in the near future, but it doesn't mean that I can't feel that something was amiss that allowed all these new suppliers to enter the market with little consideration for if they were going to be able to continue to operate if the macro-economic climate changed.

Maybe i am wrong but i thought i joined in 1997 on the old boards?

 

[taz]

North sea oil and gas producers pay corporation tax and an additional tax as well, no idea how much that is. Have tried googling it but it is too complicated for me at 10.30 on a Sunday night. Am not sure how the levy brought in by Sunak fits into it as well, but I understood that would also raise money every year they make profits and not as a one off. I think.

the UK gets 40%,, not on profit but on the value of the total gas and oil extraction, the UK has increased its extraction of gas by 25% in the last few months

 

[Swansman]

It just annoys me people spouting of shite without having the facts and the scaremongering that goes with it.

This is a world wide problem and Africa will suffer most. I am expecting riots in Africa soon which will then spread. Unless our government freezes our energy bills ( which will increase borrowing ) i can see riots across Europe.

Riots could happen. Winter will be interesting to say the least. There's also chances there will be a huge divide in Europe... Germany and some other countries are going to be desperate for peace in Ukraine - in whatever way - while the UK and US, who are likely to be among those least affected by the energy crisis due to their own production, will probably keep their arms industries happy through sending more weapons into Ukraine. Could get tense.

 

[Icy Gull]

Riots could happen. Winter will be interesting to say the least. There's also chances there will be a huge divide in Europe... Germany and some other countries are going to be desperate for peace in Ukraine - in whatever way - while the UK and US, who are likely to be among those least affected by the energy crisis due to their own production, will probably keep their arms industries happy through sending more weapons into Ukraine. Could get tense.

Are you living in a cave? It’s pretty tense in most of Europe already!

 

[Swansman]

Are you living in a cave? It’s pretty tense in most of Europe already!

It depends on what you compare it with. If you look now compared to how it will likely be in three or four months... its probably the quiet before the storm.

 

[The Clamp]

It just annoys me people spouting of shite without having the facts and the scaremongering that goes with it.

This is a world wide problem and Africa will suffer most. I am expecting riots in Africa soon which will then spread. Unless our government freezes our energy bills ( which will increase borrowing ) i can see riots across Europe.

I wasn’t scaremongering. Or spouting shit. If you can’t engage without misrepresenting me or insulting me, I suggest you don’t reply to me at all.

Good day.