Ched Evans

[nwgull]

They were tweeted (and then deleted) 5 months before the trial. Not recovered.

 

[Beach Seagull]

Fair enough. Just asking.

Fair question however given my staunch defence of him. I just feel there has been a miscarriage of justice here.

 

[The Fifth Column]

So what happens if he appeals and overturns his conviction? Presumably he would no longer be regarded a rapist and be free to resume his football career? Its a possiblilty so I wonder how people feel about that?

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Well to be fair propaganda or not its a pretty strong 'supporting source.' I can imagine if said tweets had been aired in his original trial the outcome may well have been different.

1. They were 'aired' five months BEFORE the trial.

2. They would have made no difference at all. SHE was not the one on trial. Even if the court were to accept your GUESS that it is compensation money she is referring to in those disputed tweets, its still a totally distinct issue from the case itself. Remember that she did not concoct this whole story in an attempted money grab - as you are trying to ininsuate. The CPS brought this case, based on information the accused provided to the police under interview. She did not make up and report a rape.

 

[The Fifth Column]

1. They were 'aired' five months BEFORE the trial.

2. They would have made no difference at all. SHE was not the one on trial. Even if the court were to accet your GUESS that it is compensation money she is referring to in those disputed tweets, its still a totally distinct issue from the case itself. Remember that she did not concoct this whole story in an attempted money grab - as you are trying to ininsuate. The CPS brought this case, based on information the accused provided to the police under interview. She did not make up and report a rape.

Actually they could be relevant to the case as any defence barrister worth his salt could use them to discredit the victim as a witness and fuel doubt in the jury's minds as to whether she is a credible witness or not. I dont think its so simple as to say they are not relevant, they could be and it would be for the court to decide that.

 

[Barrel of Fun]

Have these tweets ever been verified? Where is the proof of this mystery fire fighter?

 

[hans kraay fan club]

Actually they could be relevant to the case as any defence barrister worth his salt could use them to discredit the victim as a witness and fuel doubt in the jury's minds as to whether she is a credible witness or not. I dont think its so simple as to say they are not relevant, they could be and it would be for the court to decide that.

Disagree entirely. The only angle by which you could possibly use those tweets (if you can establish beyond doubt what they referred to - you'd need to see what they were in response to, to give them some context) would be to claim that compensation were the girl's motive for making the accusations. I repeat, again - she didn't make the accusations.

 

[Beach Seagull]

So what happens if he appeals and overturns his conviction? Presumably he would no longer be regarded a rapist and be free to resume his football career? Its a possiblilty so I wonder how people feel about that?

In the eyes of the law he would be an innocent man of his conviction was quashed.

 

[The Fifth Column]

Have these tweets ever been verified? Where is the proof of this mystery fire fighter?

Regardless i think the questions for the court to consider would be a. What do those tweets say and what is the relevance to the case. B. Can they without doubt be attributed to the victim.

Im also unsure if this is the only evidence Evans is relying on to support his appeal. If he can produce enough new evidence that is compelling and it can convince a court that his conviction was wrong or unsafe then good luck to him, if he cant and his appeal fails he remains a convicted rapist and will have to accept it and all that comes with it.

 

[nwgull]

As do I. I had no interest in this case until the case of the Albion players went to trial. The evidence against them, which was enough for the CPS to take it to court, was little more than the say so of a women who, according to work colleagues under oath, had a history of telling tall stories. The fact that this went to a second trial surprised and concerned me, particularly Lewis Dunk not being cleared despite having phone records showing that he was on the phone to his missis whilst the alleged offence was occurring. It made me think that maybe the police have an agenda against young footballers, and that the public in general - i.e. those that would make up a jury - have a strong prejudice, probably borne out of jealousy and the bad reputation painted by the media.

 

[The Fifth Column]

Disagree entirely. The only angle by which you could possibly use those tweets (if you can establish beyond doubt what they referred to - you'd need to see what they were in response to, to give them some context) would be to claim that compensation were the girl's motive for making the accusations. I repeat, again - she didn't make the accusations.

You may disagree however if Evans defence barrister can produce a good argument in an appeal hearing that those tweets are relevant evidence and the court agrees then they may be presented as evidence. Whether you agree or not is irrelevant it is for the court of appeal to decide and i guess we shall have to wait and see. And im not sure why you feel it necessary to repeat your point about her not making the accusations, I have made no comment on that. i am no Evans supporter and simply have an interest in the legal aspects of the case.

 

[hans kraay fan club]

You may disagree however if Evans defence barrister can produce a good argument in an appeal hearing that those tweets are relevant evidence and the court agrees then they may be presented as evidence. Whether you agree or not is irrelevant it is for the court of appeal to decide and i guess we shall have to wait and see. And im not sure why you feel it necessary to repeat your point about her not making the accusations, I have made no comment on that. i am no Evans supporter and simply have an interest in the legal aspects of the case.

Isn't it clear?

The fact that she did not make the accusations is massively relevant, to how important (or otherwise) these disputed tweets are. Because she did not, all you could say about the tweets is to allege that she was expecting to profit from a subsequent payout (and why should she not enjoy some compensation if she has been wronged?) - not that any potential payout was actually the motive for bringing the case in the first place - which is pretty much the only way they could be used to discredit her account.

 

[Beach Seagull]

Disagree entirely. The only angle by which you could possibly use those tweets (if you can establish beyond doubt what they referred to - you'd need to see what they were in response to, to give them some context) would be to claim that compensation were the girl's motive for making the accusations. I repeat, again - she didn't make the accusations.

I acknowledge that she didn't make an accusation of rape when she contacted the police the day after it happened (her accusation was 'my drink was spiked) and that the rape charges came about after McDonald and Evans were arrested and they both admitted to having had consensual sex with her. If Evans felt he was going to be accussed of rape he could easily have just denied sex had ever taken place given at that point she hadn't accussed him of 'raping' her.

Perhaps the 'pink mini cooper' and 'amazing holiday' tweets were the result of realising that if the outcome of the case was a guilty of rape verdict that compensation would be coming her way. Perhaps. You would surely expect a traumatised rape victims tweets to be talking about 'rebuilding my life' rather than 'pink mini coopers' and 'winning big.'

 

[The Fifth Column]

O

Isn't it clear?

The fact that she did not make the accusations is massively relevant, to how important (or otherwise) these disputed tweets are. Because she did not, all you could say about the tweets is to allege that she was expecting to profit from a subsequent payout (and why should she not enjoy some compensation if she has been wronged?) - not that any potential payout was actually the motive for bringing the case in the first place - which is pretty much the only way they could be used to discredit her account.

That may be so and i understand what you are saying but this does not prevent the tweets being presented as evidence by the defence. The arguments and opinions on the tweets that you are presenting will then no doubt be similarly thrashed out between the defence and prosecution and the defence will need to convince the court of their argument.

 

[nwgull]

It doesn't really matter to me what those tweets mean in a legal sense and whether or not they could be submitted as evidence; it helps me to form an opinion on the character of the victim and the flimsiness of the conviction though.

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

Obviously I don't know for sure what she is talking about and it could be totally unrelated to the case, but my guess is that the reference to 'winning big' is regarding the compensation she believes she will win, likewise the 'pink mini cooper' and the 'amazing holiday.' Before I get shot down (again) on here I acknowledge she could be speculating on what she would do if she won the euromillions or if she landed a well numerated job.

The tweets were unearthed after the CE was convicted and I'm guessing not in time to form part of his application for leave to appeal which was refused shortly after his conviction. I am guessing they will form a central plank of his appeal and could also be a reason why the usually slow CCRC have fast tracked his application. I'm no legal expert but I imagine a defence barrister would certainly 'make hay' in cross examining the 'victim' about the tweets (should the case go to appeal).

how much compensation would someone get from a league 1 footballer? Criminal payouts aren't normally very high and a quick google implies that the max payout is £44k and that is if severe physical and mental trauma occurs. 44k is not enough to buy 2 pink minis and a amazing holiday.

As you mention it could be euromillions/lottery and that makes more sense. How many tweets are there going to be like that every friday/saturday before the big draws. The tweets are ambiguous at best and as such can be attributed to many different things.

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

Well to be fair propaganda or not its a pretty strong 'supporting source.' I can imagine if said tweets had been aired in his original trial the outcome may well have been different.

how is a biased website strong supporting evidence? its circumstantial at best. I could do the same, in fact go to my website that i've just created, it will tell you how brilliant i am and that everyone should buy me a beer because i'm an all round great kind of guy and deserve it. I can even throw in some references from my family and friends that will support me.

 

[The Fifth Column]

Also these tweets may only form part of the appeal, if Evans defence is going down the unsafe conviction route then as unpalatable as it may seem it wont matter if he raped her or not all they have to do is prove the conviction was unsafe for whatever reason. It depends on whether they are looking to overturn the conviction completely and claim Evans is completely innocent and not guilty or are just looking to get the conviction quashed as unsafe. Its very complex and his team may have more than one approach. It will be interesting to see how it plays out but i wouldnt get too hung up on the relevance and meaning of these tweets as they will undoubtedly only form part of his appeal and clearly in my mind the defence want to be able to use them to discredit the victim and cast doubt on her as a witness which us a perfectly legitimate legal tactic and often not one that necessarily needs to be proved beyond reasonable doubt.

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

Are you a relative of the convicted rapist by any chance? You seem a bit OBSESSED in your defence of the bloke

Ha, i was wondering the same, a member here for 4 years and probably 20% of his posts on this one thread.

 

[JCL - the new kid in town]

It doesn't really matter to me what those tweets mean in a legal sense and whether or not they could be submitted as evidence; it helps me to form an opinion on the character of the victim and the flimsiness of the conviction though.

how so when they could be related to something completely different?