[Politics] Brexit

[Jim in the West]

It would be tragic if the killing had a big impact on the vote.Going by the wall to wall hysterical coverage of what happened it has the possibility to have a significant impact if voters don't realise that this guy had mental issues.No-one can be held accountable for what happened other than the nutter.The next polls will tell us if it has had an impact.

It's one thing for the vote to be won by Remain based on Project Fear or whatever else they come out with but it is a serious blow for democracy if what happened swings the vote.

I think the point that (many) people are trying to make is that the poisonous atmosphere whipped up by (some) on the Leave side has created an irrational fear of immigrants, and this has the capacity to incite violence. It's clearly NOT what the vast majority of perfectly reasonable Brexiteers want to do. But you have to question the motivation of the likes of Farage (his stunt on Thursday with the "Breaking Point" poster was pretty blatantly racist). There's also been a lot of fear-mongering amongst the Vote Leave camp - immigrants will rape our women, immigrants are criminals, etc, etc. I really, really hope that the Vote Leave campaign now distance themselves from Farage and his ilk, and stops banging on so negatively about immigration.

 

[Hampster Gull]

"death to traitors, freedom for Britian". Clearly has issues, stoked up by the nonsense pushed by many

 

[Soulman]

Had the fisherman not allowed Nigel Farage to lead their protest, no doubt it would have had far more power and no interference from the likes of Bob. They've only got themselves to blame for allowing that charlatan in his brass buttoned blazer lead their flotilla.

Dear oh dear, as a deflection and a way to shift the blame, this comes out top.
Blame Farage for a show of ignorance from a gobby "singer" who needs a bit of media attention, has nothing really to do with the referendum......and the blame/swerve is completed.
Sir Gob indeed.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

I'm sure there are many itching to exploit this tragedy but I hope we are proved wrong ...naive, probably ... wishful thinking, almost certainly.

Wishful thinking indeed.

 

[Sorrel]

Had the fisherman not allowed Nigel Farage to lead their protest, no doubt it would have had far more power and no interference from the likes of Bob. They've only got themselves to blame for allowing that charlatan in his brass buttoned blazer lead their flotilla.

Farage has been a huge asset to the Remain campaign. His presence has allowed the Leave campaign to be depicted as racist, unpleasant and at the least xenophobic (and I say this as mostly a Leave supporter). They would have had so much more chance of a reasoned and a decent campaign without him. Yes, I know he's not in the official Leave group, but he just won't shut up.

Indeed, I'd say the existence of UKIP generally has been a major problem for Leave. While it has given those 15% or so of the population who share his views much to feed upon, it drowns out more reasoned criticism of the EU. And it gives an easy choice for many in this referendum - do you want to back Farage or not? - which for most sensible people has an easy answer. It means we've been debating on his stupid terms rather than actually discussing the issues and choices.

 

[cunning fergus]

Seriously??....a free labour market is when wages are set by the forces of supply and demand, this doesn't change if you use the term in a EU context!

You are also twisting my words..the working class discontent with the status quo is not about bigotry or prejudice it is about real things, decimation in public services, low wages, high housing costs, stagnated living standards. Whether you chose to ignore it or not some politicians and media outlets are peddling the idea that Jonny Foreigner is responsible for our countries myriad of problems. This is clouding the real issues, that those that the financial sector which caused the last economy have got away largely unpunished and unreformed, that wealthy tax dodgers refuse to pay their taxes while austerity is decimating public services, that successive governments have failed to address a growing skills shortage and that we don’t build nearly enough houses. None of these things will be solved by leaving the EU.

Look at the leave website and you will see the front page is almost exclusively about immigration, look at UKIP’s new poster with queues of refugees, the politics of division and fear have well and truly taken over and stifled the chance of any real debate. How can you deny that this isn’t the case when portions of the working class are now supporting UKIP, a party who backs the governments Austerity plans.

Oh and one final thing…brandishing everyone who disagrees with you a Tory boy wont help you win the argument, you obviously have some good points to make but the mudslinging comes across as a little immature.

The EU operates as an entirely free labour market, if you want to hold up the minimum wage as a "control" to this then feel free, I certainly don't see it that way, and neither I suspect do the millions now languishing in roles paying that rate.

The minimum wage is merely a bone thrown to the workers by the rich, if the market was controlled to work in favour of the workers then logically we would have a maximum wage, we had one once before in this country, and the was how powerful workers interests were.

I don't look at the leave website, I don't need to, know my own mind and precisely why I disagree with what the EU stands for. It certainly does not represent a model for social progression, given its performance on the euro crisis.

Once again, it's many of those the are advocating remain that expose much that is wrong with the EU, it's corporatist agenda, it's secrecy, it's largesse. These people who are now rowing back on their previously held views of how wonderful the EU rules are. It's clear from the debate who the EU works for, and who it works against..........the pro EU shills never stop going on about it.

Don't pretend you are voting for something that's it not, it's pure naked Toryism.........so I will call out its supporters on that basis.

The truth hurts sometimes doesn't it.

 

[cunning fergus]

That was the gist of the article you posted!



I've not disputed that. I've agreed with it. That is what UK democracy has been delivering. Had Blair not marched Labour from it's socialist roots - he wouldn't have been elected. That is our democracy - like it or loath it.



Growing economies welcome more people. That is capitalism. EU membership won't change that. Switzerland and Norway both have more EU immigration than we do.



I'm not even sure what this means? The Labour Party have wanted to get elected. This country under the current democratic system will not elect a socialist government. So either Labour sticks to its roots, and we'll have 18 years in a row of Conservative rule as we did, or they make themselves electable. At the moment, they don't know what they're doing.

So, you are confirming I am right then, the interests of the traditional working class have been sacrificed by the likes of Tony Blair to satisfy ambition and political egos.

Decades of political ideology, the very founding principles of the Labour Party happily flushed down the toilet so that Peter Mandelson could get his hands on the levers of power.

Those who disagreed with this abject surrender of Labour's political DNA, like Corbyn were then marginalised and relegated to the political backwaters as political cranks.

In your view the working class should not bear any grudge with this betrayal of their interests and they should continue to line up to follow the Labour Party again in this debate because their new chums like Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan tell them so.

You are right of course that is politics, and we know the EU's political ambitions are even worse and more devastating. The working class in this country can see how their counterparts in Europe are fairing and understand who their natural enemy is.......the Tories and Tory supporting shills.

How is that cap fitting?

 

[daveinprague]

Dear oh dear, as a deflection and a way to shift the blame, this comes out top.
Blame Farage for a show of ignorance from a gobby "singer" who needs a bit of media attention, has nothing really to do with the referendum......and the blame/swerve is completed.
Sir Gob indeed.

What media attention does Geldorf 'need' exactly?

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

What media attention does Geldorf 'need' exactly?

The kind he received on the Thames. You know the sort of, 'I can swear a lot and single handedly save humanity' type.

Well, all except for the British fishermen as they apparently don't count.

 

[Soulman]

"The Eurozone is weak...racked by high unemployment and bad debts...and the failure to tackle the refugee crisis has ‘vividly exposed political fault lines’ which have threatened the entire European project." - International Monetary Fund, 18/6/2016
Just like when we left the European Exchange Rate Mechanism in 92, after the initial shock, in the medium to long term we are better off and stronger as an Independent Britain.

 

[daveinprague]

The kind he received on the Thames. You know the sort of, 'I can swear a lot and single handedly save humanity' type.

Well, all except for the British fishermen as they apparently don't count.

As im sure you know, he was berating Farage as a fraud. Not the fishermen. A man who BOASTED in the past of being in the bar instead of voting for British fishermens rights during EU meetings concerning our fishermen. .
Yeah, Geldorf needs the publicity. That must be it.

 

[Green Cross Code Man]

As im sure you know, he was berating Farage as a fraud. Not the fishermen. A man who BOASTED in the past of being in the bar instead of voting for British fishermens rights during EU meetings concerning our fishermen. .
Yeah, Geldorf needs the publicity. That must be it.

Okay then. Perhaps he should have been sticking up for British fishermen then instead of resorting to personalities.

 

[daveinprague]

Okay then. Perhaps he should have been sticking up for British fishermen then instead of resorting to personalities.

Yes, I agree to a point, but for Farage, to even have the cheek to put himself at the lead of that flotilla, is breathtaking.

 

[BadFish]

https://www.facebook.com/EvolvePolitics/videos/1701832670068673/

Nails it, the whole debate has only managed to highlight the dire state of politics

 

[Two Professors]

I see Osborne's idiot cousin,Emanuel Macron,has said the U.K. will be as insignificant as Guernsey after Brexit.Wonder why there has never been a movement there to rejoin France?He has also said there is no question of Denmark,Holland,or Poland getting the same status.He didn't mention Greece,Italy,Catalonia,Hungary,or large parts of France,the rather selective Europhile dope.

 

[Two Professors]

Maybe Geldof would have been better off going to France and supporting his own country,rather than interfering in ours.I'm sure that knowing Saint Bob was there would have produced a miracle recovery for the Republic

 

[Eeyore]

 

[Two Professors]

Meanwhile in HT's favoured asylum:



Going for 3-0 are you?

 

[Wrong-Direction]

Sick of the EU Referendum? Watch Jonathan Pie's epic rant. You won't regret it! - Watch the full episode at https://www.facebook.com/JonathanPieReporter/

This video pretty much sums up the farce you've all become part of.

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[Two Professors]

Sorry,did mean to post a pic of the French finance minister,but was laughing so much I forgot:



No wonder the French economy is in the toilet!