[Politics] Brexit

[Soulman]

Lest WE Forget. 9 November 2012
As a backdrop to US car company Ford closing their plants in Dagenham and Southampton — with the lost of 1,400 jobs — George Osborne okayed a EU loan to help them move production to Turkey, the New Statesman’s Rowenna Davis pointed out earlier today.

The decision to close the two UK plants caused outrage when it was announced last month, not least because MPs and BIS seemed to know nothing about the decision until it was announced. But now it seems that Ford have been granted an £80m loan to build a new transit van in Turkey, by the European Investment Bank — on the board of which George Osborne sits.

This, presumably, is the same George Osborne who in regards to the EU budget negotiations said last week:

“We’re not going to accept a deal that’s not good for Britain. There’ll be a simple choice, deal or no deal. We’ll only do a deal if it’s good for Britain.”

 

[5ways]

'Seems' isn't a factual or recognised term when accessing the specific supposed economic benefit of EU membership. Whereas the £53 Billion we paid in membership fees last parliament is.

Happy to amend 'seems' to 'totally is'. Stability of access to internal market paramount.

 

[Soulman]

Happy to amend 'seems' to 'totally is'. Stability of access to internal market paramount.

I can not help liking you, many of your posts are torn to bits and proved wrong........but still you plough on regardless.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

But as mentioned this money isn't just burnt in a KLF style disco, they are combined and 1000's of projects are created involving British companies as well as other european companies. The benefits are vast and way more than any one nation in Europe can achieve.

Have you any specific examples of these vast benefits and any evidence they couldn't be achieved outside the EU?

 

[pastafarian]

Seems reliant on access to the single market to me. Which is put at risk if we leave. I wonder, has Leave decided on the Gove model - we don't need the single market - or is there another model in vogue? Is the Albania model still popular?

when the EU sat down with Canada to sort out a free trade agreement did they say pick a model?
when the EU sat down with South Korea to sort out a free trade agreement did they say pick a model
did the EU kick off TTIP talks by saying pick a model?

No of course they didnt,why on Earth you think they will ask us to pick a model is absurd.

It will be a unique British model

 

[Soulman]

Blimey, Mick has always been a big Labour supporter, probably still is but he certainly is spot on here.

Mick Hucknall: Musician Calls Labour Leader Jeremy Corbyn 'Spineless Coward' in EU Referendum Positioning
"What a shabby, spineless coward Jeremy Corbyn is proving to be. Either fully commit to #LabourIn OR #LabourLeave or GO!" Hucknall said on Twitter ahead of the June 23 EU referendum.

 

[JC Footy Genius]

Happy to amend 'seems' to 'totally is'. Stability of access to internal market paramount.

You might as well say flange muffin... there is no definitive factual figure outlining the supposed specific economic benefit of EU membership ... which is telling.

 

[beorhthelm]

Seems reliant on access to the single market to me.

or:

Over the 13 pre-entry years:

UK exports to these 11 countries grew by 137%;
At an annual rate of 7.5%;
And as a share of the UK’s world exports increased from 25.0% to 43.4%.

Over the two Common Market decades:

UK exports to these 11 countries grew by 171%;
At an annual rate of 5.4%;
And as a share of the UK’s world exports increased from 43.4 to 57.6%.

Over the 21 years of the Single Market:

UK exports to these 11 countries grew by 82%;
At an annual rate of 3.0%;
And their share of world exports has fallen from 57.6 to 55.3%.

the very last point there is unfair as its clearly been averaging over 60% for the past 21 years. however the takeaway from that Civitas analysis is that while the common/single market will have helped, there's clearly corrleation to other factors, notably internal UK policy, you can see the ups and downs trace our economies trend. who'd have thought when the economy is up it exports more, when down exports less. though quite why exports collapsed 10% in the mid noughties is a mystery to me - thats pre-financial crisis, anyone know?

 

[Horton's halftime iceberg]

Have you any specific examples of these vast benefits and any evidence they couldn't be achieved outside the EU?

As quoted above the Galileo Satellite system will be better and more accurate than both the USA and Russian military systems alone, when all 30 are up it will hit any GPS device 4 times every minute and work to centimetres not metres as the USA and Russian systems currently do and we rely on.

Its and amazing combination of cooperation and funded by the EU at the cost of multi billions. Thats just one, we would be here all year if you want to examine all EU projects one by one. We would be an onlooker on this if we were not a part of the EU, and its a game changer.

http://www.gsa.europa.eu/galileo/why-galileo


Just read about it we would have to spend all our money on this one project if we wanted to go it alone, The EU alone has had to go into partnership with China over certain technology to get it going.

 

[The Rivet]

Vote extension. Can it be challenged legally?

 

[5ways]

I can not help liking you, many of your posts are torn to bits and proved wrong........but still you plough on regardless.

Devoted to economic stability

 

[Soulman]

Devoted to economic stability

Fair enough......Out it is then

 

[East Preston Gull]

The argus debate was very good. I would say 55% 45% in favour of remain which surprised me for a Brighton audience. The most interesting thing was the labour members of the audience who were heckling the labour remain speaker for being a traitor and jumping in to bed with the evil Tories.

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk

 

[The Rivet]

Newsnight Harriet Harman whinging because her party is not getting headlines. Wonder why? Irrelevant muppet.

 

[5ways]

You might as well say flange muffin... there is no definitive factual figure outlining the supposed specific economic benefit of EU membership ... which is telling.

The economic benefit derives from unfettered access to the internal market. Any trade with Europe benefits from this unconditional access, it also provide recourse to address unfair treatment of British goods. Why can we not export beef to America? Because they banned it all after the BSE scare. What can we do about it? Nothing. In Europe we can challenge unfair treatment.

The total amount of all EU trade contributes to the economic benefit of EU membership. Moreover there are economic benefits very difficult to put a price on. Increased tourism from the EU would be one, that we receive the second largest amount of EU science and technology funding which supports British science is another. There is also the fact that EU migrants pay more into the system than they take out. The IFS said leaving the EU would in effect cost a further two years of austerity.

See also:

 

[Horton's halftime iceberg]

You might as well say flange muffin... there is no definitive factual figure outlining the supposed specific economic benefit of EU membership ... which is telling.

Many things are economic are some go beyond that into just knowledge and human development, anyone with some basic sense can go through the projects below and see what are useful and what are not, but science and technological development are better when we pool are resources, money, people and research.

I don't get how you all seem to just make odd statements and hound people and not just spend time reading instead about what is going on in the EU with some of our money to make our continent a better, wealthier and more interesting place to live in.

http://ec.europa.eu/research/infocentre/all_headlines_en.cfm?item=All&subitem=&start=11

 

[The Rivet]

Many things are economic are some go beyond that into just knowledge and human development, anyone with some basic sense can go through the projects below and see what are useful and what are not, but science and technological development are better when we pool are resources, money, people and research.

I don't get how you all seem to just make odd statements and hound people and not just spend time reading instead about what is going on in the EU with some of our money to make our continent a better, wealthier and more interesting place to live in.

http://ec.europa.eu/research/infocentre/all_headlines_en.cfm?item=All&subitem=&start=11

Go to bed you sound pissed!

 

[JC Footy Genius]

As quoted above the Galileo Satellite system will be better and more accurate than both the USA and Russian military systems alone, when all 30 are up it will hit any GPS device 4 times every minute and work to centimetres not metres as the USA and Russian systems currently do and we rely on.

Its and amazing combination of cooperation and funded by the EU at the cost of multi billions. Thats just one, we would be here all year if you want to examine all EU projects one by one. We would be an onlooker on this if we were not a part of the EU, and its a game changer.

http://www.gsa.europa.eu/galileo/why-galileo


Just read about it we would have to spend all our money on this one project if we wanted to go it alone, The EU alone has had to go into partnership with China over certain technology to get it going.

So did I, apparently the initial private/ public funding fell apart so it had to be 'nationalised' (EU taxpayers money?) as well as China, Norway and Switzerland are part of the project so not exclusively an EU project. But to be fair it looks promising, the European Space Agency also has agreements with Canada so not sure EU membership is a prerequisite to playing a significant role in this important industry. As usual what is claimed as an exclusive benefit of EU membership is not quite what it seems.

 

[5ways]

when the EU sat down with Canada to sort out a free trade agreement did they say pick a model?
when the EU sat down with South Korea to sort out a free trade agreement did they say pick a model
did the EU kick off TTIP talks by saying pick a model?

No of course they didnt,why on Earth you think they will ask us to pick a model is absurd.

It will be a unique British model

We're actually physically part of Europe so the EU will want to preserve rights and benefits for its citizens. This is principally the right to free movement. We will want to preserve some rights and benefits for our citizens. This is principally access to the internal market, the largest and richest market in the world that supports 3 million UK jobs. In order for everyone to get what they want we will have to negotiate. There are models used by other countries which serve as templates for our own negotiations, the Swiss model and Norway model are two such models. Both of these models require free movement, accepting EU regulation, and paying a fee.

I'm very interested to hear more about this unique British model but unfortunately the Leave campaign have not actually set out any model at all, or even provided a timeline of how EU Brexit negotiations will secure access to the internal market and protect British jobs. Gove said that he can't tell us how many jobs we will lose and cannot guarantee that jobs will not be lost. I guess that's okay for him and Boris, however, as they are already set up nicely.

 

[Fitzcarraldo]

1936 - Adolf Hitler uses the expression ‘United States of Europe’ to describe his plan for a united Europe
1940 - Reichsmarschall Herman Goering coins the name ‘European Economic Community’
1940 - Walther Funk submitted to Hitler plans for an ‘Economic Reorganisation of Europe’ and proposes a single European currency
1942 - Reinhard Heydrich published ‘The Reich Plan for the Domination of Europe’ which later became ‘The Treaty of Rome’
1943 - Thirteen countries are invited to join a European Federation working under German military control
1944 - A German conference is held in Strasbourg to discuss how Germany will dominate the peace when the war ends.
Strange, eh?
Yet our government would have us believe in the European project

This is all obviously a load of sh!t copied and pasted from Facebook and therefore if you looked into it ALL of it would probably be made up. But the Goering and European Economic Community line stands out. What rubbish. Do you have a SHRED of evidence to support that? Or are you, as all Quitter Little Englanders seem to be doing, trying to associate the EU with Hitler?