Far-Right National Front Stuns French Elite With EU 'Earthquake'

Herr Tubthumper · May 26, 2014

Buzzer said:
I don't think that trading with EU countries and being outside the EU will be particularly onerous nor cost-prohibitive. We seem to do quite well as it is with those presently outside the EU. And likewise, leaving the EU doesn't mean that it's an end to workers' rights or a minimum wage.

I disagree. One example is that removing the current VAT agreement will be a total ball-ache when trading goods within the EU, especially for sole-traders. Yes we do okay from trading with counties outside the EU but I believe our biggest trading partner is the EU.

Buzzer · May 26, 2014

Herr Tubthumper said:
I disagree. One example is that removing the current VAT agreement will be a total ball-ache when trading goods within the EU, especially for sole-traders.

We'll have to agree to disagree but a little more paperwork is definitely a fair trade-off for the right to self-determination, direct accountability and free from the endemic EU fraud.

Herr Tubthumper · May 26, 2014

Buzzer said:
We'll have to agree to disagree but a little more paperwork is definitely a fair trade-off for the right to self-determination, direct accountability and free from the endemic EU fraud.

Agree. I know from talking to you before, in some respect, we have (very) broadly the same goal.....but very different ideas about how we feel it will be achieved.

Deleted member 22389 · May 26, 2014

Herr Tubthumper said:
One thing which does puzzle me is that I really do not think europe is the biggest issue facing the country at the moment. The economy is still pants, manufacturing is almost non-existant, the schools are an incoherent jumble of free schools and academies and **** knows what, London airports need sorting out and the nation is being to ransom by the power companies. Yet something which you cannot do a lot about in the short to medium term is still top of the pile. Is the EU really the big ticket issue? Would all the energy and time spent on the EU not be better places elsewhere at this precise moment?

Manufacturing, your so right on this. No matter what you say we do have a pants economy. We have more people and more people yet if you like at places like Newhaven we are not really seeing a big growth in manufacturing companies.

What we are seeing is more supermarkets going up to feed more people, which sums up the type of economy we have. As I have said before, employers can pay what they like for these types of jobs, and if someone is not prepared to work for the money offered there is a steady stream of people that will.

If you had skilled engineering jobs such as toolmakers, CNC programmers you would have to pay the right money to get the right type of people. That would be the focus to start training people up again.

Dandyman · May 26, 2014

Buzzer said:
You're right of course. History is littered with examples. Robespierre, Trotsky, Rohm, The Gang of Four, Snowball...

No doubt he will outlast me though. I'm the archetypal White Russian counter-revolutionary destined to inglorious failure.

I hate to tell you but you far too liberal and philo-semitic to be a White Russian.

matthew · May 26, 2014

Worrying times but prejudice against minorities has been around since before civilisation - there's undoubtably a few tribes with grudges to this day.

Would be nice, however, if the prejudices were aimed at the corporate bosses and their shareholders rather than immigrants scrounging around for the coppers they drop on the floor.

Pretty pink fairy · May 26, 2014

Stumpy Tim said:
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2014/05/25/world/europe/25reuters-eu-election-france.html?_r=0

Unbelievable this can happen in Western Europe these days.

shock shock !!
regards
DR

The Spanish · May 26, 2014

Psychobilly freakout said:
I would guess Romani and Arabic

This comes from a country that has just outlawed motor cycle gangs....

very heavily involved in crime in scandinavia.

Kumquat · May 26, 2014

It certainly is an interesting time. I've long said that when you combie two factors (economic recession and the migration of manstream parties to the centre) you end up with success for extremist parties. There is no one filling that gap on the left in the absence of any commitment to the working classes by the Labour Party (although if the Greens got their act together they may be able to do so). The Tory leadership is being deliberately ambivalent on the EU partly to placate the CBI and big business who want us to stay in. Therefore UKIP have actually managed to hoover up the support of working class people who voted both Labour or Conservative. This is nothing new in terms of political dynamics. What is new is that the coalition Government has meant that a formerly "respectable" protest vote in the Lib Dems has become redundant. It could be a very interesting moment in history. Like the early 1900s we could see the obliteration of the Liberal Party. The difference is then it was replaced by a genuine working class movement and party. This time it is being replaced by an elitist party parading on one issue which people rightly feel strongly about. The main parties should be absolutely ashamed of themselves for allowing UKIP to get where they have. They have constantly ignored and patronised working people on the issue of Europe to keep business happy and have failed completely to sell why we should remain in the EU. Even the Lib Dems whose position is clear haven't said why.

Stumpy Tim · May 26, 2014

Psychobilly freakout said:
Do you live in France ?

Do you know why they voted for the party ?

Are x amount of people stupid or retarded ?

Maybe they have a concern you know nothing about.

Who mentioned anything about retardation? Pretty low thing to bring up in this context

Stumpy Tim · May 26, 2014

bushy said:
Tim, people are simply sick to death of large scale immigration forced on them by people who, by and large don't have to deal with the consequences, they are obviously protesting by voting for the nf in Franceand ukip here, i don't think the ukip vote here is an anti EU one as much as a protest at immigration, EU and non EU.

I don't disagree at all. Immigration is an issue, though judging from those thread people seem more worried about Muslim immigrants than European ones

Dandyman · May 26, 2014

Kumquat said:
It certainly is an interesting time. I've long said that when you combie two factors (economic recession and the migration of manstream parties to the centre) you end up with success for extremist parties. There is no one filling that gap on the left in the absence of any commitment to the working classes by the Labour Party (although if the Greens got their act together they may be able to do so). The Tory leadership is being deliberately ambivalent on the EU partly to placate the CBI and big business who want us to stay in. Therefore UKIP have actually managed to hoover up the support of working class people who voted both Labour or Conservative. This is nothing new in terms of political dynamics. What is new is that the coalition Government has meant that a formerly "respectable" protest vote in the Lib Dems has become redundant. It could be a very interesting moment in history. Like the early 1900s we could see the obliteration of the Liberal Party. The difference is then it was replaced by a genuine working class movement and party. This time it is being replaced by an elitist party parading on one issue which people rightly feel strongly about. The main parties should be absolutely ashamed of themselves for allowing UKIP to get where they have. They have constantly ignored and patronised working people on the issue of Europe to keep business happy and have failed completely to sell why we should remain in the EU. Even the Lib Dems whose position is clear haven't said why.

UKIP are a virulently anti-working class group of Uber-Thatcherites and Monday Club types. Once their policies start to come under proper scrutiny then they will begin to come unstuck.

martyn20 · May 26, 2014

Dandyman said:
UKIP are a virulently anti-working class group of Uber-Thatcherites and Monday Club types. Once their policies start to come under proper scrutiny then they will begin to come unstuck.

This

Kumquat · May 26, 2014

Dandyman said:
UKIP are a virulently anti-working class group of Uber-Thatcherites and Monday Club types. Once their policies start to come under proper scrutiny then they will begin to come unstuck.

I agree absolutely with that, but my point is that if the mainstream parties had actually started to address the underlying concerns about Europe rather than patronise the public by simply rubbishing UKIP, then they wouldn't have done so well in the local elections. I think you're right that UKIP will come unstuck but we will then be faced with the same problem. Noone genuine there to reflect the absolutely right concerns a large part of the public have about the way Europe is being run. It's amazing how the press and mainstream parties and others have banged on about what a bunch of idiots UKIP are without addressing why they are doing so well despite that being evident.

Herr Tubthumper · May 26, 2014

Stumpy Tim said:
judging from those thread people seem more worried about Muslim immigrants than European ones

Quite, as Farange said when questioned about the difference between white and non-white immigrant neighbours.... "you know what I mean"

Stumpy Tim · May 26, 2014

Herr Tubthumper said:
Quite, as Farange said when questioned about the difference between white and non-white immigrant neighbours.... "you know what I mean"

Not quite true. He said that about Romanians and Germans

melias shoes · May 26, 2014

dougdeep said:
Why do you post your opinions as fact? The EU is just a bottomless pit of dishonesty and corruption. Better that it collapse now than later. A referendum in this country at any time will vote OUT.

This.

Beach Hut · May 26, 2014

matthew said:
Worrying times but prejudice against minorities has been around since before civilisation - there's undoubtably a few tribes with grudges to this day.

The demographics are totally changing now which means everything will have to change, I am pretty certain a year or two ago there were more black children born than white in the USA. Therefore by starting these far right theories at some point they will simply not work.

However all the while this country buys into the illusion of UKIP they will sadly thrive.

Pretty pink fairy · May 26, 2014

beach hut said:
the demographics are totally changing now which means everything will have to change, i am pretty certain a year or two ago there were more black children born than white in the usa. Therefore by starting these far right theories at some point they will simply not work.

However all the while this country buys into the illusion of ukip they will sadly thrive.

blonde hair blue eyes type of thing

regards
dr

martyn20 · May 26, 2014

Does UKIP policy actually include a referendum on membership of the EU?

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