BHAFC Fans given banning order....................

bhafc4life03 said:

Embarrassing! Puts a bad name upon our club, glad they have been banned as they deserve it!

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daveinprague said:

Again,, I dont. Im going by an NSC eye witness who said they saw this incident an hour or two before the main attack by Russian thugs, and the fact that a police undercover officer filmed them, and was confronted by them according to the evidence the police have.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XEYhdprpeHE
Here is the Coventry fans removal from the ground (having done nothing wrong at all) and anyone viewing that could interpret him as a troublemaker (but he is innocent)

This evidence was probably the thing used to judge his guilt and give him a FBO - do you think it was justified? and that he is a dangerous troublemaker deserving a long ban from matches?

Background detail:
“This all started when PC Allsop first came over to me and I asked him why he wasn’t wearing his ID numbers and told him I was considering making a formal complaint since I knew he was in breach of guidelines.

“In response PC Allsop called me a ‘smart arse’ together with a torrent of abuse and then left me alone.

“I then called up another officer, assuming him to be a commanding officer but he could not provide me with an answer. He then turned against me and alleged I was drunk, which I wasn’t.

“My protestations were ignored and you can see what happened next in the footage.
Those saying that hey should have contested the charges and even just defended themselves in court (at little or no cost), the Coventry fan did this and it got them nowhere as they were still found guilty.

“I was charged with a public order offence (Section 5), given bail conditions preventing me from attending any football match and released at 2.00am.

Once the case came to court, I represented myself (I would advise that nobody should do this, rather call the FSF for advice and referral to Melanie Cooke). I was found guilty, fined £275 (including costs) and given a banning order.
Remember they don't get very long to plan a defence either

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daveinprague said:

Cool. You have evidence that will discredit the film the police took, and prove they did not confront the police for filming them?

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Guy Fawkes said:

Or reply to this which was also posted earlier in response to your point:



The police had 'evidence' against this Coventry fan, he was also issued with a FBO so he must have been guilty because they are using just part of what happened and not the whole story which could lead to a completely different outcome

Put it like this, you are in a club and someone starts an unprovoked attack against you, throwing punches, etc. You defend yourself and start to punch back at the same time security look around after hearing a commotion and only see you throwing punches (the cctv could also be pointed towards you at this point and only capture your punching) The person who started the fight backs off and isn't seen hiting (or maybe they are but as they saw you throwing punches first, interpret heir actions as self defence.

You have no cctv evidence to prove you were attacked first, the security witness only see you throwing the punches as they missed the start of the incident

So therefore, by your claim that incomplete evidence is conclusive of guilt, you would be guilty of starting the assault and should be punished to the fullest extent of the law (even though you were really the victim)

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gumbopickles said:

I was in the square that day - I managed to run BUT if I was I a bar I would have chucked anything near me at them to protect me and my mates- believe me when you are in that situation you are in survival mode and no one really knows how they would react

If there's videos of them charging around looking for a fight then the ban I would agree with but I guarantee you they were just like me and my mates that we're having a great time in the square and some beers and got run at by hundreds of armed Russians.

I'm disgusted fellow Brighton fans so quick to assume the worst of everyone and jump on their high horses

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daveinprague said:

i trust our police version of the events, and an nsc eye witness, rather than people who were not there really. Thats about it.
The prisons are full of 'innocent' people arent they? Maybe if they hadnt confronted the police officers filming them, it wouldnt have gone so badly for them.

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Pretty pink fairy said:

a bit like Antifa
regards
DR

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daveinprague said:

You mean when you excitedly read the police report in the Argus during the last pie and mash venture into Brighton? You believed that quite readily, but not the police version of what happened here. Why?

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daveinprague said:

I trust our police version of the events, and an NSC eye witness, rather than people who were not there really. Thats about it.
The prisons are full of 'innocent' people arent they? Maybe if they hadnt confronted the police officers filming them, it wouldnt have gone so badly for them.
Plus a video of somebody being arrested in Coventry for whatever it was, along with his version of what happened, doesnt really convince me of anything either way really

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daveinprague said:

I trust our police version of the events, and an NSC eye witness, rather than people who were not there really. Thats about it.
The prisons are full of 'innocent' people arent they? Maybe if they hadnt confronted the police officers filming them, it wouldnt have gone so badly for them.
Plus a video of somebody being arrested in Coventry for whatever it was, along with his version of what happened, doesnt really convince me of anything either way really

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Guy Fawkes said:

Or reply to this which was also posted earlier in response to your point:



The police had 'evidence' against this Coventry fan, he was also issued with a FBO so he must have been guilty because they are using just part of what happened and not the whole story which could lead to a completely different outcome

Put it like this, you are in a club and someone starts an unprovoked attack against you, throwing punches, etc. You defend yourself and start to punch back at the same time security look around after hearing a commotion and only see you throwing punches (the cctv could also be pointed towards you at this point and only capture your punching) The person who started the fight backs off and isn't seen hiting (or maybe they are but as they saw you throwing punches first, interpret heir actions as self defence.

You have no cctv evidence to prove you were attacked first, the security witness only see you throwing the punches as they missed the start of the incident

So therefore, by your claim that incomplete evidence is conclusive of guilt, you would be guilty of starting the assault and should be punished to the fullest extent of the law (even though you were really the victim)

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Guy Fawkes said:

So you'd have happily accepted the police version of events at Hillsborough where 96 fans died, and be quick to blame the fans ?

Also try reading that link about the Coventry fan, it might change your mind about him

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Pretty pink fairy said:

they were only pointing and laughing
regards
DR

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Thunder Bolt said:

This link to the Football Supporters Federation tells you the whole story about the Coventry fan being assaulted by police. West Midlands Police had to settle compensation to him. It was finally resolved because another copper told the truth. PC Allsop was disciplined by WMP.

http://www.fsf.org.uk/blog/view/coventry-fan-assaulted-wins-WMP-settlement

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Thunder Bolt said:

This link to the Football Supporters Federation tells you the whole story about the Coventry fan being assaulted by police. West Midlands Police had to settle compensation to him. It was finally resolved because another copper told the truth. PC Allsop was disciplined by WMP.

http://www.fsf.org.uk/blog/view/coventry-fan-assaulted-wins-WMP-settlement

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Harry Wilson's tackle said:

Why was the first guy thrown out? This looks quite disturbing to me. I have no time for football hooliganism, but this was a bloke sitting in a seat among his own fans. In what possible way could his removal be justified? Can anyone who knows the facts explain?

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Nobody expects to attend a football match and still be dealing with the ramifications over four years later. But this is exactly what happened to Mark Wynn a 48-year-old, lifelong Coventry City fan.

Back in September 2011 Mark, together with his then 14-year-old son, attended a home game at the Ricoh Arena versus Derby County.

At that time, Coventry fans were deeply unhappy at what was happening at the club and during the game, fans were protesting against their owners. Mark (in a white t-shirt) was not involved in the protest but felt fellow supporters that were, were being dealt with in a heavy handed way.

Noticing that one of the officers, a PC Allsop, was not wearing his shoulder ID numbers, Mark asked him why. Events that followed were caught on film.

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Guy Fawkes said:

details were in the link posted earlier in the thread and also by Thunder Bolt in the post just above yours:



The Coventry fans crime? - to ask for the shoulder number of a copper who wasn't wearing them (which are normally worn so that they can be identified should anyone wish to complain about them, praise them, etc)

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Harry Wilson's tackle said:

OK. That's really concerning. This is what the police did during the miner's strike, was it not (certainly during at least one of the 'civil unrest' episodes)? The removl of ID, I mean. Then the arrests . . . So, this is demographic targeting, with an assumption that everyone part of the group (in this case, football supporters) represents the whole, and the whole is Enemy. Like young black lads in London in the 70s (and today in certain places - in the US all you have to be is not a cop in uniform it seems). We have to CONTROL the police. They are not a self-directed pack of warlords. Obviously I don't mean all of them. But this stinks to high heaven. I don't share the politics or the social attitudes of lots of other fellow human beings (and vice versa). That's not a problem for me. Victimising people for being representatives of a prejudged whole, however, is completely unacceptable. It is PREJUDICE. Treating footbal supporters like they are terrorists and lucky to be allowed to breathe has to stop.

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GreersElbow said:

Went to school with Jake, always a bit of a thug.

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daveinprague said:

Initially yes I did.
There are always mistakes, people being released from prison proves that. It doesnt mean that its always a mistake though does it.

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