Southern Rail STRIKE details

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

This thing has been allowed to drift downwards for so many months now that it's just now WAY beyond rubbish. If you are a company so inept that you can't run a train on a simple flat track 50 miles between Brighton and London that the Victorians hacked out a hundred ago or can't even hack the pitifully easy journey twixt Brighon/Lewes and Falmer, then you are frankly unfit for purpose and beneath contempt. Fact.

 

[Ernest]

This thing has been allowed to drift downwards for so many months now that it's just now WAY beyond rubbish. If you are a company so inept that you can't run a train on a simple flat track 50 miles between Brighton and London that the Victorians hacked out a hundred ago or even the pitifully easy journey twixt Brighon/Lewes and Falmer, then you are frankly unfit for purpose and beneath contempt. Fact.

If it was a simple dispute about DOO it would have been settled months ago, the RMT deal was scuppered by the DfT as they want to break RMT and the ASLEF so unless they back down then this will drag on and on . The unions and their supporters have sufficient war chests to last a lot longer yet , so Wilkinson may well get his THREE or four year WAR

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

This thing has been allowed to drift downwards for so many months now that it's just now WAY beyond rubbish. If you are a company so inept that you can't run a train on a simple flat track 50 miles between Brighton and London that the Victorians hacked out a hundred ago or even the pitifully easy journey twixt Brighon/Lewes and Falmer, then you are frankly unfit for purpose and beneath contempt. Fact.

The key word is contempt which is what the rail providers, unions and government seem to have for the general public all of them are using the public for their own agendas be it power, profit or prove a point.

Taking it's toll on the wife being late constantly, missing the daughters bedtime sometimes she does not get to see her for a few days at a time, and this service is available for just a pittance of nearly £5000 bargin.....

Ever get the feeling your being ripped off.....

By everyone.

Disgraceful

 

[pearl]

If it was a simple dispute about DOO it would have been settled months ago, the RMT deal was scuppered by the DfT as they want to break RMT and the ASLEF so unless they back down then this will drag on and on . The unions and their supporters have sufficient war chests to last a lot longer yet , so Wilkinson may well get his THREE or four year WAR

Jesus Fvcking Christ ... hope you're over reacting. I'm sick of doing delay repay, can't be arsed anymore, sick of emailing southern, the government, caroline lucas .... sick of the whole f-ing mess gggrrrhhhhggggh

 

[The Oldman]

Interesting that the CEO of I360 has resigned citing poor rail travel between her home in London and Brighton as one of the reasons.

 

[Carrot Cruncher]

If it was a simple dispute about DOO it would have been settled months ago, the RMT deal was scuppered by the DfT as they want to break RMT and the ASLEF so unless they back down then this will drag on and on . The unions and their supporters have sufficient war chests to last a lot longer yet , so Wilkinson may well get his THREE or four year WAR

And that in a nutshell is why the unions are (nearly) as bad as the government/GTR...

 

[pearl]

The key word is contempt which is what the rail providers, unions and government seem to have for the general public all of them are using the public for their own agendas be it power, profit or prove a point.

Taking it's toll on the wife being late constantly, missing the daughters bedtime sometimes she does not get to see her for a few days at a time, and this service is available for just a pittance of nearly £5000 bargin.....

Ever get the feeling your being ripped off.....

By everyone.

Disgraceful

oh aren't fares going up in January too?
good luck getting home, i'm going via the offie

 

[Tom Hark Preston Park]

IWilkinson may well get his THREE or four year WAR

This smug freak will hopefully have his butt soundly kicked out of 'his' industry earlydoors.

 

[beorhthelm]

If it was a simple dispute about DOO it would have been settled months ago, the RMT deal was scuppered by the DfT as they want to break RMT and the ASLEF so unless they back down then this will drag on and on . The unions and their supporters have sufficient war chests to last a lot longer yet , so Wilkinson may well get his THREE or four year WAR

i know you want a 80's style war, fact is if the RMT had accepted the one remaining clause on exceptions to second safety person, along with all the other concessions they had won, this would be over. how does accepting this clause break the union?

 

[Ernest]

i know you want a 80's style war, fact is if the RMT had accepted the one remaining clause on exceptions to second safety person, along with all the other concessions they had won, this would be over. how does accepting this clause break the union?

Ask Peter Wilkinson not me

 

[Carrot Cruncher]

This smug freak will hopefully have his butt soundly kicked out of 'his' industry earlydoors.

As I said before, they should've sacked him after 'break the unions'. If they didn't then, they're not going to now.

 

[theboybilly]

So it is about money then....at least for the drivers anyway.

This was 20 or more years ago, Drivers won't get any extra for driving DOO trains now. What I was pointing out is that then Aslef were willing to accept DOO as long as there was an incentive - there isn't one now. Also the DOO pay enhancements were mainly given to London depots as those south of Selhurst didn't do that work so you will have more drivers now not wanting this system foisted upon them. I'll leave it to you to decide what you think their motives are. As far as the OBS role is concerned I can see how this is advantageous to Southern: there is less training involved, staff won't have to be taken off the trains to sit in a classroom on 'Safety Days' (ie brushing up on Rules & Regs and watching safety videos) or taken off trains for periodical exams or medicals. They will no longer be Safety Critical which costs lots of money for the company to keep going. There is also the by-product in that it won't stop a train from running if an OBS is not available or, in the case of splitting/attaching trains (as at Haywards Heath) an OBS is running late on another service.
This is all about cutting staff costs as far as Southern are concerned as cancelling trains is one thing that doesnt seem to cost Southern money. Needing less staff (and down the line there will be less staff, I'm sure of it) is what I think Southern are after. For the time being Drivers are a necessary evil. Train operating companies hate train drivers.

 

[Hastings gull]

If it was a simple dispute about DOO it would have been settled months ago, the RMT deal was scuppered by the DfT as they want to break RMT and the ASLEF so unless they back down then this will drag on and on . The unions and their supporters have sufficient war chests to last a lot longer yet , so Wilkinson may well get his THREE or four year WAR

Depressing - I can see you are really looking forward to it. Who are their supporters, by the way, with their war chests? And who would want to "break" such constructive, forward-thinking organisations such as these two who contribute so much to the nation's transport.

 

[Arthur]

This was 20 or more years ago, Drivers won't get any extra for driving DOO trains now. What I was pointing out is that then Aslef were willing to accept DOO as long as there was an incentive - there isn't one now. Also the DOO pay enhancements were mainly given to London depots as those south of Selhurst didn't do that work so you will have more drivers now not wanting this system foisted upon them. I'll leave it to you to decide what you think their motives are. As far as the OBS role is concerned I can see how this is advantageous to Southern: there is less training involved, staff won't have to be taken off the trains to sit in a classroom on 'Safety Days' (ie brushing up on Rules & Regs and watching safety videos) or taken off trains for periodical exams or medicals. They will no longer be Safety Critical which costs lots of money for the company to keep going. There is also the by-product in that it won't stop a train from running if an OBS is not available or, in the case of splitting/attaching trains (as at Haywards Heath) an OBS is running late on another service.
This is all about cutting staff costs as far as Southern are concerned as cancelling trains is one thing that doesnt seem to cost Southern money. Needing less staff (and down the line there will be less staff, I'm sure of it) is what I think Southern are after. For the time being Drivers are a necessary evil. Train operating companies hate train drivers.

I was hearing you loud and clear and my point still stands. Safety didn't come in to it 20 years ago when they were having their palms crossed with silver. Now they aren't and all of sudden the guard is a safety critical member of staff.

 

[wakeytom]

Wow!

So now, on top of everything else the unions are to blame for, they're to be blamed for any increase in drink driving over the Christmas period too!?

Incredible. Simple incredible.

It may sound dramatic but it is a fear when public transport people will push boundaries. They have chosen to really strike hard during the Christmas period, when I suspect a higher number than normal would use the service due to festivities, which given how culture is in the UK would often include alcohol.

 

[Yoda]

As far as the OBS role is concerned I can see how this is advantageous to Southern: there is less training involved, staff won't have to be taken off the trains to sit in a classroom on 'Safety Days' (ie brushing up on Rules & Regs and watching safety videos) or taken off trains for periodical exams or medicals. They will no longer be Safety Critical which costs lots of money for the company to keep going. There is also the by-product in that it won't stop a train from running if an OBS is not available or, in the case of splitting/attaching trains (as at Haywards Heath) an OBS is running late on another service.
This is all about cutting staff costs as far as Southern are concerned as cancelling trains is one thing that doesnt seem to cost Southern money. Needing less staff (and down the line there will be less staff, I'm sure of it) is what I think Southern are after. For the time being Drivers are a necessary evil. Train operating companies hate train drivers.

If this were the case, why do short haul flights still have Cabin Crew? (As was posted earlier comparing the safety role of them by a Driver that someone had copied from Facebook).

The cabin crew are their just as much to assist in an emergency as the guard/conductor/OBS/Whatever you want to call them, and there are more incidents per year on trains in the UK than there are on flights Worldwide.

 

[1066familyman]

It may sound dramatic but it is a fear when public transport people will push boundaries. They have chosen to really strike hard during the Christmas period, when I suspect a higher number than normal would use the service due to festivities, which given how culture is in the UK would often include alcohol.

But you said the unions will have "blood on their hands".

That's quite an incredible statement to come out with.

Do you not accept that the only ones with "blood on their hands" in drink drive cases are the drink drivers themselves and them alone?

 

[Ernest]

Depressing - I can see you are really looking forward to it. Who are their supporters, by the way, with their war chests? And who would want to "break" such constructive, forward-thinking organisations such as these two who contribute so much to the nation's transport.

Stupid idiot

 

[Hastings gull]

Stupid idiot

let's be charitable and say that it takes all sorts . .

 

[wakeytom]

But you said the unions will have "blood on their hands".

That's quite an incredible statement to come out with.

Do you not accept that the only ones with "blood on their hands" in drink drive cases are the drink drivers themselves and them alone?

It may have been a little strong so will downgrade it as I agree with your comment. There is NEVER an excuse to drink drive but I do worry more will given the strikes