Would you vote for bombing ISIS in Syria?

[Herr Tubthumper]

How long until the next IS attack in London?

 

[Hastings gull]

The same Tony Benn that used tax avoidance schemes to get around inheritance tax and leave £5 million to his children?

Socialism is brilliant -for everybody else . .

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

So am I and so did I. I emailed him prior to the vote with my concerns and I got a reply yesterday, I suspect a 'stock response'...

A fair response and difficult to disagree with in theory but I have heard little about the 3 points he raises. If he has been convinced of these 3 points then great. But surely parliament has a duty to explain them to us as well?

 

[Hastings gull]

How long until the next IS attack in London?

Who knows -obviously it depends also on the efficiency of the security services, as it always has done. Given that it seems that yet another plot was foiled this week with raids on Luton homes, on top of all the others these last few years, the danger has always been there, so your question,timed as it is, is rather irrelevant,

 

[scamander]

Brimstone missiles. It came up in the debate - some armchair general was saying what a difference these could make and only the RAF had them. There was an interruption - to the effect that the Saudis have them (or course they do) - and then it turns out that the much vaunted contribution from the Arab nations (including Saudi Arabia) has withdrawn from their roles in bombing Syria.

Cameron was asked this last week in the HoC, the question actually specified whether Saudi Arabia had these. He avoided answering, would have thought he could have mentioned it then. Exactly why he avoided this option seems odd.

 

[Questions]

How long until the next IS attack in London?

Not that long I imagine but Ken Livingstone will be wrongly accused of condoning it whilst trying to explain why it happens. It'll be British citizens who will do it as well.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Who knows -obviously it depends also on the efficiency of the security services, as it always has done. Given that it seems that yet another plot was foiled this week with raids on Luton homes, on top of all the others these last few years, the danger has always been there, so your question,timed as it is, is rather irrelevant,

Sadly I take these statements that bomb plots have been foiled with a pinch of salt. It wasn't too long ago some OAP was arrested on terrorist charges at a Labour Party conference for daring to ask a question. And American tourists were nicked for taking snaps of Buck Palace. And before you accuse me of party politics it was Labour which started my distrust.

 

[Bold Seagull]

The same Tony Benn that used tax avoidance schemes to get around inheritance tax and leave £5 million to his children?

Simply tax planning. No schemes, just using rules about who you leave your estate to in your will. Even the Torygraph outlined how legitimate his planning was as advice to their own readers. We've done the same with our wills without getting too personal, there is no 'scheme' in simply outlining how your estate is left and to whom.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/tax/11189430/Tony-Benns-inheritance-tax-dodge-how-it-works-and-how-you-can-use-it-too.html

 

[Bold Seagull]

Socialism is brilliant -for everybody else . .

So are facts....

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Socialism is brilliant -for everybody else . .

It works brilliantly in my house hold thank you.

 

[Diego Napier]

No good will come of this.

Nothing learnt it seems from modern history - what is the exit strategy ?

As with Korea, Vietnam, Gulf war, Afghanistan first time round, Iraq, Pakistan & Afghanistan again, the exit strategy is quite straightforward, extract the digit as sharp as possible once the fan can't rotate because of the accumulated sh*t.

The cost in lives is only a determining factor when counting dead western soldiers not hapless civilians.

The exit strategy isn't the real problem, the lack of an end game is. Achieving lasting peace in the region is beyond the the wit and ability of Western leaders acting on their own.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

Don't think the governments feel there is any other way, however it won't make any difference in my opinion. You could have the best weapons in the world, but one thing you will never get rid of is the thought process of these people. This is why the government need to look closer at the religion. We have to be honest, if we didn't give so much over to this religion in the first place both here and across the EU, then these home grown extremists wouldn't exist. I know people get fed up with the words Political Correctness but I blame this for a lot of the problems we see today, it has stopped us from tackling many problems.

I see France is going to start closing down mosques http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/12/france-100-mosques-close-151202142023319.html, could you ever see the same thing happening here?

 

[Machiavelli]

How long until the next IS attack in London?

Enlighten me of the prior examples, HT.

 

[Nibble]

Don't think the governments feel there is any other way, however it won't make any difference in my opinion. You could have the best weapons in the world, but one thing you will never get rid of is the thought process of these people. This is why the government need to look closer at the religion. We have to be honest, if we didn't give so much over to this religion in the first place both here and across the EU, then these home grown extremists wouldn't exist. I know people get fed up with the words Political Correctness but I blame this for a lot of the problems we see today, it has stopped us from tackling many problems.

I see France is going to start closing down mosques http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/12/france-100-mosques-close-151202142023319.html, could you ever see the same thing happening here?

What have we given over to ISIL?

 

[TWOCHOICEStom]

I just wouldn't mind if, just for once, we just stayed out of all of this shit and left it to someone else.

 

[Machiavelli]

Who knows -obviously it depends also on the efficiency of the security services, as it always has done. Given that it seems that yet another plot was foiled this week with raids on Luton homes, on top of all the others these last few years, the danger has always been there, so your question,timed as it is, is rather irrelevant,

I'd say the core factor is the one that is the most difficult to establish: just how many plans for such attacks there are, and how advanced and sophisticated (i.e. dangerous) they are. I veer on the side of they're far less prevalent than many think, and have been encouraged -- which is not to say caused -- by prior actions. Whichever way, we're going to have to think through these issues, because they're not going away in a hurry.
And before anyone starts accusing me of keeping my head in the sand about the security threat and the brilliance of our intelligence services, may I offer up the examples of Campbell's Dodgy Dossier (which is really one of the most pathetic things I've ever read) and Cameron's current claim that there are 70,000 forces that are going to fill in that vacuum, which he claims is based on such impeccable intelligence.

 

[Hastings gull]

Sadly I take these statements that bomb plots have been foiled with a pinch of salt. It wasn't too long ago some OAP was arrested on terrorist charges at a Labour Party conference for daring to ask a question. And American tourists were nicked for taking snaps of Buck Palace. And before you accuse me of party politics it was Labour which started my distrust.

I was not going to accuse of that at all, but do accuse of being extremely naïve. If you take these plots with a pinch of salt, then presumably by your logic, when some are locked up after a trial, it is all made up to find an innocent scapegoat. And 7/7 was just an illusion.
I recall the OAP incident, and yes, people can over-react but this might just be a case of politicians not liking inconvenient criticism when they want to stage-manage conferences.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

What have we given over to ISIL?

Why have France started to close down some mosques? Because the people inside them are preaching radical, hard line views of this religion and because of that people have cleared off and joined groups like ISIL.

 

[Nibble]

Why have France started to close down some mosques? Because the people inside them are preaching radical, hard line views of this religion and because of that people have cleared off and joined groups like ISIL.

I see.

 

[Titanic]

"I wish I had the moral certitude of the finger-jabbing representatives of our new and kinder politics" - Alan Johnson

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