Justice
Dangerous Idiot
These two have regular blunders 5-0 up at Norwich and Mings has a howler to let Norwich score.
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[Albion] Why is Dunk consistently overlooked by England?
- Thread starter vagabond
- Start date
Pavilionaire
Well-known member
- Jul 7, 2003
- 30,707
I think Southgate has been fortunate that the likes of Klopp, Guardiola and Pochettino have started churning out some quality English players and he had some decent youngsters coming through like Maguire, Dele Alli, Lingard, Pickford but I'm not convinced the next wave - Rice, Winks, Mings, Tomori - are of the same calibre.
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
The argument for the defence:
Its not easy being an international manager. You get your players six or seven times a year for four or five days. You have to instil in them a style of playing, a tactical shape, a team understanding that you have to maintain and carry through qualifying and tournaments, whilst all the time they go back to their clubs and play in different formations and tactical set-ups. So when you've spent the first two international windows getting them trained in your style, do you REALLY want to spend the next international get-together teaching it to a whole different set of players? No. Do you want to have one player key to your style and then drop him because he's out of form one month? No. Do you want to pick the flavour of the month for game, but then have to drop him the next because he was a flash in the pan? No, you want to see sustained performances. An international manager has to have a squad, and then introduce new players to it gradually, on the fringes and one or two at a time. Likewise players shouldn't be jettisoned after one or two poor performances. Southgate's job is to spot the talent and then nurture them into a great team. It is often the case that smaller countries punch above their weight because they have a group of players that plays together all the time. If Southgate can keep a core of talent (and make sure its the right talent) for many years, they can do great things.
As for Lewis Dunk, he must be close, but he had one call-up and was absolutely schooled by Rashford on a clip that went viral. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=549800365517742. As someone else said, the upcoming games will tell us a lot about where he is relative to the very best. Dunk is still improving, if he keeps playing at this level his call-up is inevitable.
Its not easy being an international manager. You get your players six or seven times a year for four or five days. You have to instil in them a style of playing, a tactical shape, a team understanding that you have to maintain and carry through qualifying and tournaments, whilst all the time they go back to their clubs and play in different formations and tactical set-ups. So when you've spent the first two international windows getting them trained in your style, do you REALLY want to spend the next international get-together teaching it to a whole different set of players? No. Do you want to have one player key to your style and then drop him because he's out of form one month? No. Do you want to pick the flavour of the month for game, but then have to drop him the next because he was a flash in the pan? No, you want to see sustained performances. An international manager has to have a squad, and then introduce new players to it gradually, on the fringes and one or two at a time. Likewise players shouldn't be jettisoned after one or two poor performances. Southgate's job is to spot the talent and then nurture them into a great team. It is often the case that smaller countries punch above their weight because they have a group of players that plays together all the time. If Southgate can keep a core of talent (and make sure its the right talent) for many years, they can do great things.
As for Lewis Dunk, he must be close, but he had one call-up and was absolutely schooled by Rashford on a clip that went viral. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=549800365517742. As someone else said, the upcoming games will tell us a lot about where he is relative to the very best. Dunk is still improving, if he keeps playing at this level his call-up is inevitable.
The Wizard
Well-known member
- Jul 2, 2009
- 18,383
Unbelievably overrated manager. The much raved world about cup run in which we beat the mighty Sweden, Tunisia and Panama, drew against Colombia and lost against Croatia + lost twice to Belgium. BOYS DID US PROUD.
Stato
Well-known member
- Dec 21, 2011
- 6,659
This is wrong. He actually had two call ups in October and November last year. He didn't get on the pitch in either of the games of the first call up (Croatia and Spain). The Rashford clip was from training during this first call up. Although pounced upon by Palace fans and Man U fans who wanted to moan about Mourhinio's use of Rashford, it couldn't have possibly ended Dunk's England chances as following it he was picked again for the next squad and made his debut as a starter against the USA.
Justice
Dangerous Idiot
Agree apparently March does everything right in training and looks the nuts, we all know come match day his final ball isn’t there. Ray Houghton was on the radio saying as much some players look class in training yet fall apart on match day.
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
joeinbrighton
New member
I'd say he's quite unfortunate. We are in a spell where there are quite a few English centre backs to choose from, but none of whom stand out as really top class. Given that the manager favours passing football and bringing the ball out from the back, Lewis Dunk should actually fit that way of playing quite well. Keep playing well and also showing good leadership qualities though and eventually he will get his chance.
portslade seagull
Well-known member
Have a nice rest Dunky and watch the others fluff their lines
Albion Robster
Well-known member
From that clip, how do you not know the England coaching staff had told Dunk to jockey / non contact on Rashford?
It’s not uncommon for coaching drills to be non-contact, especially given defence vs attack scenarios, that could invite last ditch tackles.
Just saying...
Kalimantan Gull
Well-known member
Yeah, I'd be fairly certain that's the case. And I'm sure there were other clips cut out where dunk won the ball. Narrative is narrative though...
Not sure if this has been already said in this thread but it may have a lot to do with Asworth and the setting up of England DNA
Two good articles on it:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/dec/04/fa-england-dna-elite-player-development
http://www.wearebrighton.com/newsopinion/ashworth-england-dna-and-left-feet-why-dunk-isnt-in-the-england-squad/
Two good articles on it:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/dec/04/fa-england-dna-elite-player-development
http://www.wearebrighton.com/newsopinion/ashworth-england-dna-and-left-feet-why-dunk-isnt-in-the-england-squad/
dejavuatbtn
Well-known member
We might find out tomorrow.
From the horse's mouth:
.“In the ideal scenario you want players that are playing in matches where they’re pushing to win trophies,” he says. “The extra pressure that comes with those games is what you have to deal with [when you are] with England. When you’re playing for big clubs, there’s a responsibility to perform every week. With lesser clubs, sometimes you can lose and there isn’t a big inquest.
“Of course there is one within the club and locally but with the big clubs that’s national. The profile is just bigger and it’s closer to what they face with the national team.”
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...gland-players-under-pressure-gareth-southgate
.“In the ideal scenario you want players that are playing in matches where they’re pushing to win trophies,” he says. “The extra pressure that comes with those games is what you have to deal with [when you are] with England. When you’re playing for big clubs, there’s a responsibility to perform every week. With lesser clubs, sometimes you can lose and there isn’t a big inquest.
“Of course there is one within the club and locally but with the big clubs that’s national. The profile is just bigger and it’s closer to what they face with the national team.”
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...gland-players-under-pressure-gareth-southgate
Despite the fact England don't push to win trophies.
Mainly because when on the cusp of the pointy end of a tournament the players selected choke because they aren't used to defending.
Icy Gull
Back on the rollercoaster
- Jul 5, 2003
- 72,015
and Aston Villa are one of those teams? I am guessing Mings played for waistcoat man when he was an under somethings manager and Grealish didn’t?
Icy Gull
Back on the rollercoaster
- Jul 5, 2003
- 72,015
Or even looking like scoring against quality defenders.