UK net migration hits record high

[Chicken Runner61]

can you point out where I've lumped in Muslims/Syrians and the Middle East as one homogenous group ? All I did was point out your glaring inaccuracy in stating that Kurds are different from Sunnis, if you want to point out that Kurds are different from Arabs then say it, at present you're just thrashing around making statements that have very little meaning and seem largely designed to highlight what a knowledgable and humane person you are.

But they are slightly different - if you can't see that it's pointless discussing anything else with you because you have a problem in reasoning the whole Middle East problem let alone the subtle differences between tribes, religion, status, treatment of women, gays and every other detail about this or any other discussion.

You might as well join Isis yourself because your way of thinking is pretty much aligned with them.

Have to do some work now so if I don't reply to any response from you it's not because I have flounced or you have got me on some irrational point - it's because I'm busy

In the time try and go through what you actually think and see if it makes sense, is humane and logical and fits in with history or is it an excuse for xenophobic or racist views. What I mean by that is that if you really believe in those views at least have the balls to stand up and say what you really think.

So long as you don't post anything that is incitement or hatred you are entitled to those views even if they are abhorrent to most.

Personally I'm against anyone coming here to blag out benefits system but I think someone who is trying to protect their family by fleeing a war zone or away from a refugee camp needs a bit of humanity -

 

[Hastings gull]

In my opinion Cameron has actually got this one right about taking refugees directly from the local camps, rather than those coming through Serbia etc.

I'd take many more though than the 10,000 he is proposing, and for me given a 60 million UK population, we should really be looking at 60 thousand.[/QUOTE]

I don't doubt your sincerity in that you would like to take more, but conveniently plucking some sort of formula out of the sky will not wash. It might be 60,000 in a population of 60 million, but that 60,000 are very likely to settle in areas which already have high levels of immigrant families, and will not be spread about to give your formula credence. It is the numbers game - we already have so many, and this is what worries folk, as you know. If there had been far less immigration hitherto, then the case for taking more, as you state, would be more compelling. And of course who would bet against the same scenario presenting itself next year etc etc etc - would you be saying in Sept 2016/17/18/19/ that another 60,000 should be admitted, on top of what is presumably going to be another figure of net immigration of 300,000, assuming, as seems likely, that the government will not be able to hold down the numbers.
As I have stated before, we in Europe really do not have any alternative other than to take in this year those who are here, and then it could well be that the number we admit will be increased as you desire, but ONLY if I could be assured that drastic action, possibly involving the military, will largely stop the future flow, as they see our decision to admit more as the green light. Yes, their lives are in most cases not good, but this migration on the scale we are witnessing cannot go on.

 

[Deleted member 22389]

If we are going to take 10,000 people doesn't the burden and cost of housing these people come down to the individual councils and local council tax payer?

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

I don't doubt your sincerity in that you would like to take more, but conveniently plucking some sort of formula out of the sky will not wash. It might be 60,000 in a population of 60 million, but that 60,000 are very likely to settle in areas which already have high levels of immigrant families, and will not be spread about to give your formula credence. It is the numbers game - we already have so many, and this is what worries folk, as you know. If there had been far less immigration hitherto, then the case for taking more, as you state, would be more compelling. And of course who would bet against the same scenario presenting itself next year etc etc etc - would you be saying in Sept 2016/17/18/19/ that another 60,000 should be admitted, on top of what is presumably going to be another figure of net immigration of 300,000, assuming, as seems likely, that the government will not be able to hold down the numbers.
As I have stated before, we in Europe really do not have any alternative other than to take in this year those who are here, and then it could well be that the number we admit will be increased as you desire, but ONLY if I could be assured that drastic action, possibly involving the military, will largely stop the future flow, as they see our decision to admit more as the green light. Yes, their lives are in most cases not good, but this migration on the scale we are witnessing cannot go on.

It's a good point you have about onward numbers for next year etc. We cannot keep taking in refugees every year, and a strategy to stop the cause has to be found.

As stated before I favour conquering a piece of Syria so they can live there, which could involve conflict with President Assad and (dangerously) potentially his Russian ally.

 

[BigGully]

The logic is 1 emergency refugee per 1000 population.

It is opinion whether or not you happen to agree.

But it would just 'over populate' those countries that might be considered so and the under populated countries for example Canada and Australia et al would take less, it just doesnt make much sense.

 

[alfredmizen]

But they are slightly different - if you can't see that it's pointless discussing anything else with you because you have a problem in reasoning the whole Middle East problem let alone the subtle differences between tribes, religion, status, treatment of women, gays and every other detail about this or any other discussion.

You might as well join Isis yourself because your way of thinking is pretty much aligned with them.

Have to do some work now so if I don't reply to any response from you it's not because I have flounced or you have got me on some irrational point - it's because I'm busy

In the time try and go through what you actually think and see if it makes sense, is humane and logical and fits in with history or is it an excuse for xenophobic or racist views. What I mean by that is that if you really believe in those views at least have the balls to stand up and say what you really think.

So long as you don't post anything that is incitement or hatred you are entitled to those views even if they are abhorrent to most.

Personally I'm against anyone coming here to blag out benefits system but I think someone who is trying to protect their family by fleeing a war zone or away from a refugee camp needs a bit of humanity -

WTF are you on about ?? I pointed out your schoolboy error about kurds and sunnis, and suddenly its not worth discussing with me and i might as well join ISIS and i '' have a problem in reasoning the whole Middle East problem let alone the subtle differences between tribes, religion, status, treatment of women, gays and every other detail about this or any other discussion.? jesus wept man grow up !! im fully aware of the subtleties and differences in the middle east concernin religions tribes and etthnicities , i find it fascinating, , just accept that your knowledge of the situation is superficial and you came unstuck on this occasion and move on , attempting to deflect this with statements like this ''What I mean by that is that if you really believe in those views at least have the balls to stand up and say what you really think'' is going to work, quite simply because i havent stated a view.

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

But it would just 'over populate' those countries that might be considered so and the under populated countries for example Canada and Australia et al would take less, it just doesnt make much sense.

Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that 1 figure fits all countries. I haven't given any thought to other countries, in fact.

 

[BigGully]

Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that 1 figure fits all countries. I haven't given any thought to other countries, in fact.

Perhaps this is the problem, too many throwing around figures usually higher than the ones offered by the recipient country without any kind of thought process.

As we have already received 3 million migrants in recent years by your calculation instead of factoring this as some kind of 'brake' in having to accept more migrants it would mean an extra 3 000 migrants as a result, its back to front.

 

[atfc village]

Same here with the Chinese, Thais, Nepalese etc.....they cause no trouble either, in fact most are fine...does not mean we have the room and infrastructure to keep taking loads more.

Not all is dandy with the Nepalese /local community up here in Aldershot ,but it is the younger generation where the trouble surfaces.

 

[cunning fergus]

I strongly don't agree, and in my opinion it's 100% Putin's agenda all the way through.

Putin has 2 significant aims :
(1) To stop fracking as it's a threat to Russia's gas economy.
(2) To use every trick in the book to sow disunity in the European Union, and cause as big a break up of it as possible.

RT is just his mouthpiece.

To be honest most of the disunity in the EU is not of Putin's sowing, its because the institution is ultimately undemocratic.

Today we are expecting the unelected Hoad of teh EU Commission (Juncker) to announce the quota system for the other EU member states.................he has not been elected by the people in those member states to have this mandate. This is not even being passed by the EU Parliament.

Its ironic that its the elected representatives of ex Soviet bloc Hungary and Slovakia that understand this dynamic and and are only doing what their electorates want.

If the EU is disunited its because of the system not Putin.

Putin never created the euro either................the previous crisis the EU has temporarily lurched from.

 

[pastafarian]

BBC news was interesting earlier.
The Syrian refugees will be brought here under the Vulnerable Persons Relocation scheme.
Under this scheme refugees cannot be housed in someones spare room and made to live with a stranger. They are housed in their own properties. Only 200 properties have been offered to let out exclusively to the incoming refugees.
It would seem to offer to put one up in your house is of no use as the offer will be refused anyway,and it was mentioned offers by individuals has been very low anyway(although no exact figures were given)

 

[sydney]

it's all about the filthy dollar/pound euro.......who is propping up the isis filth...??

 

[cunning fergus]

You really are mad

I will assume this is a public retraction of last week's PM apology I got from you because you said I had aspergers?

Don't worry I am not offended this time either.

I think this regular reactionary cycle of yours when you are confronted with constructs or arguments you dont understand says a lot more about the frailty of your own mental condition rather than mine.................you have my sincerest sympathy.

 

[Bold Seagull]

I will assume this is a public retraction of last week's PM apology I got from you because you said I had aspergers?

Don't worry I am not offended this time either.

I think this regular reactionary cycle of yours when you are confronted with constructs or arguments you dont understand says a lot more about the frailty of your own mental condition rather than mine.................you have my sincerest sympathy.

Not offended, but feel the need to go back with your own insult. Right oh then.

 

[daveinprague]

Thanks for telling us about your pm. Not sure what the point was.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

I will assume this is a public retraction of last week's PM apology I got from you because you said I had aspergers?

Don't worry I am not offended this time either.

I think this regular reactionary cycle of yours when you are confronted with constructs or arguments you dont understand says a lot more about the frailty of your own mental condition rather than mine.................you have my sincerest sympathy.

No, I was sincere with my apology. Still am.

But, separately, I made a comment about how I reckon you can turn any random arbitrary comment I make into an anti-EU rant. I was not thinking you'd actually respond with an anti-EU rant complete with trademark link. Now knowing this it rather diminishes your arguments.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

Not offended, but feel the need to go back with your own insult. Right oh then.

Quite

 

[KZNSeagull]

BBC news was interesting earlier.
The Syrian refugees will be brought here under the Vulnerable Persons Relocation scheme.
Under this scheme refugees cannot be housed in someones spare room and made to live with a stranger. They are housed in their own properties. Only 200 properties have been offered to let out exclusively to the incoming refugees.
It would seem to offer to put one up in your house is of no use as the offer will be refused anyway,and it was mentioned offers by individuals has been very low anyway(although no exact figures were given)

DC making announcement in commons at 15:30. If they are under this existing scheme, they have the right to stay for 5 years, after which they can apply to settle in the UK. But lots of mixed messages in the BBC story I read - DC refers to them as refugees, Yvette Cooper refers to them as migrants, so hopefully this announcement will make things clearer.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34171148

 

[sydney]

what a cluster fuch.....oh deary deary me......!!!

 

[BigGully]

DC making announcement in commons at 15:30. If they are under this existing scheme, they have the right to stay for 5 years, after which they can apply to settle in the UK. But lots of mixed messages in the BBC story I read - DC refers to them as refugees, Yvette Cooper refers to them as migrants, so hopefully this announcement will make things clearer.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34171148

This is a key speech for me and even perhaps for the EU, just how much will he lurch towards France and Germany's calls for quotas basically formulated by them.