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[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...



Bodian

Well-known member
May 3, 2012
9,395
Cumbria
the trouble with twitter is too many unreliable witnesses, they'll tell you something without all the information. this tweet has for some reason ignored investment in water. that would be over £160bn according to the industry, and its a bit naughty to ignore that. you can argue there has been too much dividends, you can argue dividends shouldnt be paid from debt (110% agree to both, though the numbers are manipulated). arguing all the debt has gone to dividends is false, arguing there has been no investment is also false. its actually how they grow the businesses, by spending more their assets increase and therefore business value increase. its also amusing how the term "gaslighting" keeps getting thrown around so lightly.
But that investment was presumably paid for through our bills, and would have happened anyway. Without the shareholder payments - there would have been either more to spend on investment, or a lower debt.
 

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
34,697
But that investment was presumably paid for through our bills, and would have happened anyway. Without the shareholder payments - there would have been either more to spend on investment, or a lower debt.
quite right. bill revenue along with debt pay for investment and running costs, some goes to shareholders. you'd expect a tweet making about point about investment might include investments made, not ignore it.
 

Pevenseagull

Anti-greed coalition
Jul 20, 2003
18,465
Are the bosses still getting bonuses when the companies have been fined?I

Is that justified for having given shareholder value?
 

cheshunt seagull

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
2,438
Looks like the slippery arseholes have wriggled free again.

What is it about our lawmakers and arbiters that they repeatedly let the Tory’s off the hook?

I honestly despair.



The enquiry should be about getting answers for people who, like me, lost close relatives and the many people with lives that are changed forever. It should be about learning lessons for the future. Instead it has become a Johnson circus with his protection and that of the Tory reputation being the top priority. He is actually like a virus, every part of public life he touches is corrupted and infected. I won't even go into the parallels between him and a virus when it comes to reproduction.
 
The enquiry should be about getting answers for people who, like me, lost close relatives and the many people with lives that are changed forever. It should be about learning lessons for the future. Instead it has become a Johnson circus with his protection and that of the Tory reputation being the top priority. He is actually like a virus, every part of public life he touches is corrupted and infected. I won't even go into the parallels between him and a virus when it comes to reproduction.
Well said.

This A&E doctor is reminding everyone as to why this enquiry is so important.

 

The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
23,111
West is BEST
Johnson claiming to have handed over all his relevant docs and WhatsApp messages to the cabinet.
A characteristic lie.

He has handed over some of the stuff and nothing before May 2021.

I imagine they will get away with it. Again.
 

KZNSeagull

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
18,780
Wolsingham, County Durham
What I would like to know is why Government policy is being written on WhatsApp? Surely those discussions on WhatsApp would have resulted in policy directions that would have been documented in the standard governmental way, whatever that is? If they were not, then why not? Are WhatsApp messages now being treated like minutes of meetings?
 

The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
23,111
West is BEST
What I would like to know is why Government policy is being written on WhatsApp? Surely those discussions on WhatsApp would have resulted in policy directions that would have been documented in the standard governmental way, whatever that is? If they were not, then why not? Are WhatsApp messages now being treated like minutes of meetings?
Quite. Their defence says that “personal messages are mixed in with official messages”

Why? A flagrant disregard of protocol and perhaps law?
 

WATFORD zero

Well-known member
Jul 10, 2003
24,119
When we were in the middle of the COVID pandemic, the Government said now is not the time to investigate, we need to concentrate on the Pandemic. If you wanted to question the Government's response to COVID, we even had a special area on NSC for you to post.

So the Government sets up an independent enquiry to investigate claims of wrongdoing throughout the COVID pandemic after it has ended.

The Independent enquiry requests evidence in order to fully investigate the claims of wrongdoing.

The Government takes their own independent enquiry to court to stop them getting the evidence needed to investigate the claims.

A lot of people are, and have always been very justifiably, extremely angry about what has happened, and I really am very sorry, but I think this country is getting exactly what the majority wanted and, as a result, deserves :shrug:
 
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The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
23,111
West is BEST
When we were in the middle of the COVID pandemic, the Government said now is not the time to investigate, we need to concentrate on the Pandemic

So the Government sets up an independent enquiry to investigate claims of wrongdoing throughout the COVID pandemic after it has ended.

The Independent enquiry requests evidence in order to fully investigate the claims of wrongdoing.

The Government takes their own independent enquiry to court to stop them getting the evidence needed to investigate the claims.

A lot of people are, and have always been very justifiably, extremely angry about what is happening, and I really am very sorry, but I think this country is getting exactly what the majority wanted and deserves :shrug:
I have no confidence in wrongs getting righted and the bad guys going down. None.
 
What I would like to know is why Government policy is being written on WhatsApp? Surely those discussions on WhatsApp would have resulted in policy directions that would have been documented in the standard governmental way, whatever that is? If they were not, then why not? Are WhatsApp messages now being treated like minutes of meetings?
WhatsApp is encrypted.
Phone companies will have copies of the messages but can they be de-encrypted?
 

gripper stebson

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2004
6,617
And now whenever they are questioned about it they can say, 'there is an ongoing court case so obviously I cannot speak about the issue'...

...for months and months.
 

The Clamp

Well-known member
Jan 11, 2016
23,111
West is BEST
WhatsApp is encrypted.
Phone companies will have copies of the messages but can they be de-encrypted?
They can. WhatsApp has been compromised for years. That those messages can then be admissible into an inquiry is doubtful. Due to the way they would be de-encrypted. ie illegally.


Ultimately it is all ends up in the same spot; we know they’re up to their flabby necks in it and we are not allowed to prove it.

The Tory’s have been thriving on variations of that story for decades.
 

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