This whole anniversary of Lennon's murder

[tedebear]

Who on earth was a better band? I love listening to the Stones, the Who, the Kinks, Hendrix, Led Zep, all/any of them. But none of them get anywhere near close to the level of musical innovation that the Beatles brought about in only seven years. And the point is that those bands would probably say the same thing.

Are we debating different things here? I'm talking musically not as a contribution to the music the world enjoys? I love the beatles and their songs don't get me wrong there, but musically I don't think they were as brilliant as some people think...

 

[enigma]

Wu-Tang were better than the Beatles in my opinion.

 

[CHAPPERS]

Wu-Tang were better than the Beatles in my opinion.

No coubt.

If we're talking about innovative music you can't go far wrong with them.

Much better than the Beatles who were shit.

 

[enigma]

No coubt.

If we're talking about innovative music you can't go far wrong with them.

Much better than the Beatles who were shit.

Word. Making an album that good when you have that many members, and that low a budget is incredible. I dont think anyone had ever used that amount of kung-fu samples before either. Legends.

36 Chambers will happy-slap nearly any album ever made. There are no dud tracks .

 

[looney]

It's fascinating to see the contrast between the dewy-eyed patriotic fervour that some people on here work themselves up into about something daft like Trafalgar Day not being celebrated enough, and this "ah, he wasn't all that anyway" crap on the anniversary of Lennon's murder.

Here's someone who is arguably one of the greatest and most-loved British people that this country has ever produced. Even if you personally don't like him or the Beatles, who has EVER been a more popular Englishman, on a global basis? Churchill? Probably. But who else? Lennon's at least as well known as any of them. And, IMHO, most of his contributions and messages have been unremittingly positive. I don't generally "do" patriotism but I'd say there's something to feel truly patriotic about.

Comparing Lennon to Lord Nelson? What a load of wank.

 

[zefarelly]

I'm sticking by my original post that there are hundreds of equally good and better musicians, songwriters, band leaders etc who are totally unsung and far superior to Lennon. He did achieve a lot, although it has to be accepted it was in an era when Dave Clark succeeded as well so there has to be some continuity

I'm with Looney, Oasis are mediocre at best and Noel does look Like Parker !

ok, the Wings bit was a just a wind up for all the beardy hipppies

oh . . .can anyone exactly pinpont what John Lennon ever did for world peace ? FFS Bonio has done more and he's an egotistical twat

 

[On the Left Wing]

It is sadly ironic that it should happen now just a week after George Best's death .... I can think of only two celeb death's that have emotionally affected me in any way:
Lennon and Best .... both tragic for very different reasons

 

[Pavilionaire]

oh . . .can anyone exactly pinpont what John Lennon ever did for world peace ?

How about campaign tirelessly for peace and pen the greatest pacifist anthem of all time "Give Peace A Chance"?

 

[zefarelly]

How about campaign tirelessly for peace and pen the greatest pacifist anthem of all time "Give Peace A Chance"?

the first points highly debatable, the songs good, albeit a light hearted skim over the surface compared to many others. although due to the Beatles fame theres no doubt it reached the widest audience

 

[Icy Gull]

I'

oh . . .can anyone exactly pinpont what John Lennon ever did for world peace ? FFS Bonio has done more and he's an egotistical twat

He was a figurehead for the young who decided that killing the Vietnamese wasn't such a good idea and helped inspire enough people to stand up and stop a war. He also scared the shit out of US establishment, when did Bono come close to that?

He had also returned to writing and recording shortly before he was assasinated having had a long break. Making music like Woman which was head and shoulders above anything else the rest of the Beatles were doing at the time. Who knows what he waould have done if he'd lived, one thing is for sure it would have been way classier than anything McCartney has done since.

 

[Fourteenth Eye]

the fact of the matter is that which ever way you look at it Lennon was an innovator. The Beatles pushed boundaries & took music to the next level.

Lennon rightly or wrongly is an icon. There are so many if's whys & maybe's about what his status would be today. it seems that dieing in suspicious circumstances has always enhanced your future status & elevated you to an icon...ie Kurt Cobain, keith moon etc

I personally think that lennon was great and an innovator but so was Ray Davies of the kinks but he will never have icon status because he's still alive

 

[On the Left Wing]

How about campaign tirelessly for peace and pen the greatest pacifist anthem of all time "Give Peace A Chance"?

totally agree (add naked Peace, Bed in for Peace etc etc) ... which is why he was on the CIA hit list (something never achieved by even Bono!) and refused his green card (supposdely on drug offence reasons nut because Nixon and Ford were terrified of his iconic status in the USA.

He may not have written as many civil rights and peac songs as Bob Dylan, but his personality and status drove forward the peace movement in so many other ways

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Lennon is portrayed as working class hero. How many working class people sat around taking LSC all day, shagging an ugly oriental girl while staying in bed for a week, growing a long beard and experimenting with eastern philosophy.

Much like JFK's death slightly clouded over his suspect womanising and madia links, the memory of Lennon has been preserved because of his death and he never quite got to the stage where he would have irritated the f*** out of people and written shit pretensious music.

 

[Gwylan]

I expect the chattering classes of Charles I era were writing off Shakespeare as yesterday's man in the same way you write off Lennon now.

Well no. Ben Jonson described Shakespeare as not for our times but for all times - it was generally acknowledged that he was a genius.

Which also answers MoH's question about whether there's a more highly-regared Briton - Shakespeare would come well ahead of Lennon in a global popularity poll -in fact he did about five years ago.

I must say that I agree with Looney. There's a load of hype about him at the moment because so many of the people who run the media are of that generation - that's also why there were so many programmes about that tiresome old bore Dylan. Lennon meant very little to me and his death scarcely registered with me. Bob Marley's death about six month's later did though - oh boy, did it.

I'm now going to cogitate on the awful consequences of agreeing with Looney for the first (and probably only) time.

 

[enigma]

Bob Marley- more of a legend in my eyes.

 

[Gwylan]

Bob Marley- more of a legend in my eyes.

Absolutely. And I also suspect that his death had more of an impact globally than Lennon's.

 

[Brighton Breezy]

Ray Davies = Better lyricist.

 

[Screaming J]

For me most of the stuff he did after leaving the Beatles was embarassing rubbish. Even Imagine is a whiney irritating dirge.

Not that I wanted the feller dead, you understand, and Mark Chapman is an appalling human being. But if Lennon had lived he'd be just another contributor to Grumpy Old Men now.

What got my goat was it was on the news ALL DAY yesterday. I was half expecting to hear the bleedin' pope had beatified him!

 

[Icy Gull]

I'm not a great Beatles or Lennon fan, but reading this thread he appears to be marginally more talented than Noel from Hearsay. Must be shit eh, what's all the fuss about ?