[Albion] The handball penalty

[Bozza]

It felt like all 28,000 of us went up, appealing for a penalty.

I seemed to have a perfect view of it from the WSU and at no point could I see it had struck his thigh first and, as such, was not a penalty, with Taylor making the right call.

At the time, live in the stadium, did you think it should have been a penalty for handball?

 

[Bakero]

100% looked on pen on first viewing in TV. Seeing the replay and the obvious bounce off the knee, I agree it would've been very harsh.

 

[scooter1]

Where we were in E Lower, it looked stonewall and we were expecting it to go to VAR when the ball next went out of play, but play went on for about 5 mins by which time it all seemed to be forgotten. I guess they looked at it, it wasn’t a pen an everybody swiftly moved on.

 

[Napper]

Not seen replay but so what if hits thigh first . Irrelevant surely

 

[jonny.rainbow]

I’d be surprised if Taylor saw it hit his knee in real time.
I don’t think his position was that good and a lot of players were in his way.
Quite likely he had the VAR in his ear telling him what happened.

 

[Farehamseagull]

100% looked on pen on first viewing in TV. Seeing the replay and the obvious bounce off the knee, I agree it would've been very harsh.

This. I thought it was nailed on at first and couldn’t believe it wasn’t given and felt sure the VAR check was coming. It wasn’t a pen though, good refereeing and shows what a tough job it can be.

 

[Sheebo]

@Acker79 Has just pointed out the thigh thing isn’t mentioned in the rules now - and that arm is outstretched in an unatural position - so it was a nailed on pen and a terrible VAR f*** up i now think…

‘

This is the law for 2023/24 https://downloads.theifab.com/downloads/laws-of-the-game-2023-24?l=en

Handling the ball​

For the purposes of determining handball offences, the upper boundary of​

the arm is in line with the bottom of the armpit. Not every touch of a​

player’s hand/arm with the ball is an offence.​

​

It is an offence if a player:​

• deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, for example moving the​

hand/arm towards the ball​

• touches the ball with their hand/arm when it has made their body​

unnaturally bigger. A player is considered to have made their body​

unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence​

of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. By​

having their hand/arm in such a position, the player takes a risk of their​

hand/arm being hit by the ball and being penalised​

• scores in the opponents’ goal:​

• directly from their hand/arm, even if accidental, including by the​

goalkeeper​

• immediately after the ball has touched their hand/arm, even if accidental​

​

The goalkeeper has the same restrictions on handling the ball as any other​

player outside the penalty area. If the goalkeeper handles the ball inside their​

penalty area when not permitted to do so, an indirect free kick is awarded but​

there is no disciplinary sanction. However, if the offence is playing the ball a​

second time (with or without the hand/arm) after a restart before it touches​

another player, the goalkeeper must be sanctioned if the offence stops a​

promising attack or denies an opponent or the opposing team a goal or an​

obvious goal-scoring opportunity.​

This is the law from 2019-2020 https://downloads.theifab.com/downloads/laws-of-the-game-2019-20?l=en

Handling the ball​

It is an offence if a player:​

• deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, including moving the​

hand/arm towards the ball​

• gains possession/control of the ball after it has touched their hand/arm​

and then:​

• scores in the opponents’ goal​

• creates a goal-scoring opportunity​

• scores in the opponents’ goal directly from their hand/arm, even if​

accidental, including by the goalkeeper​

It is usually an offence if a player:​

• touches the ball with their hand/arm when:​

• the hand/arm has made their body unnaturally bigger​

• the hand/arm is above/beyond their shoulder level (unless the player​

deliberately plays the ball which then touches their hand/arm)​

​

The above offences apply even if the ball touches a player’s hand/arm​

directly from the head or body (including the foot) of another player who is​

close.​

​

Except for the above offences, it is not usually an offence if the ball touches​

a player’s hand/arm:​

• directly from the player’s own head or body (including the foot)​

• directly from the head or body (including the foot) of another player who is close​

• if the hand/arm is close to the body and does not make the body unnaturally​

bigger​

• when a player falls and the hand/arm is between the body and the ground to​

support the body, but not extended laterally or vertically away from the body​

​

The goalkeeper has the same restrictions on handling the ball as any other​

player outside the penalty area. If the goalkeeper handles the ball inside their​

penalty area when not permitted to do so, an indirect free kick is awarded but​

there is no disciplinary sanction​

You'll note those bold exceptions do not exist in the current laws of the game. They were specifically removed. It's why the Luton were given a penalty v Wolves - because according to the current laws of the game, there is no 'it came off my own body' exception.

 

[jonny.rainbow]

Not seen replay but so what if hits thigh first . Irrelevant surely

Sadly not.

As the law stands defenders can benefit from the ball bouncing off another part of the body and hitting an arm even if it is in an unnatural position.

I reckon we will see a goal line clearance soon where this happens and all hell will break loose and force IFAB to change this ridiculous iteration of the law.

 

[BevBHA]

I’ve posted this on another thread, but the most frustrating part for me was the fact Mitoma kicked it at him in the first place, his shot was going out for a throw!

 

[Sheebo]

Where we were in E Lower, it looked stonewall and we were expecting it to go to VAR when the ball next went out of play, but play went on for about 5 mins by which time it all seemed to be forgotten. I guess they looked at it, it wasn’t a pen an everybody swiftly moved on.

Didn’t go on that long as he went and booked RDZ and most thought he was going to the screen it seemed…

 

[Sheebo]

Sadly not.

As the law stands defenders can benefit from the ball bouncing off another part of the body and hitting an arm even if it is in an unnatural position.

I reckon we will see a goal line clearance soon where this happens and all hell will break loose and force IFAB to change this ridiculous iteration of the law.

See the post above - I don’t think you’re right…

 

[essbee1]

Accidental. No penalty.

 

[tronnogull]

I’ve posted this on another thread, but the most frustrating part for me was the fact Mitoma kicked it at him in the first place, his shot was going out for a throw!

Yep, he really should have scored. Given that he miskicked and the ball was heading in an unexpected direction, when it hit an arm from close range I never thought it would be given as a pen....

 

[jonny.rainbow]

See the post above - I don’t think you’re right…

The current law doesn’t determine a handball as deliberate if it touches the hand or arm after ricocheting off another part of the body.

It doesn’t specify that in the wording of the law but that is how referees are being told to apply the law.

 

[Sheebo]

The current law doesn’t determine a handball as deliberate if it touches the hand or arm after ricocheting off another part of the body.

It doesn’t specify that in the wording of the law but that is how referees are being told to apply the law.

Mmm tough to prove that though - surely they should go by the rules not verbal commands. Either way, the handball and offside rules seem a mess and nobody seems to know them for sure - and they change all the time!

Also, it doesn’t have to be deliberate now. Surely Van Dijks one falls under this:
• touches the ball with their hand/arm when it has made their body
unnaturally bigger. A player is considered to have made their body
unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence
of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement’

 

[Acker79]

Doesn't help when just last week they were saying they couldn't stop the game when they realised the VAR error because 'them's the rules' yet, for handball they're saying 'yeah, that's the rule, but we want to do this instead...'

 

[LamieRobertson]

I thought it was a penalty….steward gave me a yellow card for dissent

 

[studio150]

RDZ said post match it was a penalty, so that's good enough for me.

The real issue for me is why do we have a different definition of handball between defenders and attackers. Reverse the incident and the ball bounces up off a Brighton players knee and then hits his arm before he scores, the goal is not given due to handball.

 

[Guinness Boy]

Was a penalty under the current laws of the game.

Those laws have been constantly rewritten to fit in with VAR though so no wonder no one knows

 

[Not Andy Naylor]

I’ve posted this on another thread, but the most frustrating part for me was the fact Mitoma kicked it at him in the first place, his shot was going out for a throw!

Exactly. I'd have been embarrassed if we'd benefitted from such a terrible effort.